Train Numbers

[starrymarkb]

Is there any reason we don't use train numbers to identify services.

For example my Eurostar tickets have a clear "Valid on train number 9132" - I know Voyagers display the Retail ID, but could there not be a national numbering system?

 

[466.networkers]

Surely this would only work if a particular train worked a particular service on that day.

 

[swt_passenger]

Although the OP called it a train number, I think it's really a service ID number.

For it to work generally, all bookable trains would have to have a way of having the service ID displayed, like Voyagers.

 

[sprinterguy]

Is there any reason we don't use train numbers to identify services.

For example my Eurostar tickets have a clear "Valid on train number 9132" - I know Voyagers display the Retail ID, but could there not be a national numbering system?

Surely that's exactly what headcodes are. What's the need to advertise it to the public? Train specific advance tickets include the departure station and time printed on them, which is of far more use to the passenger than a train reporting number.

 

[djw1981]

We identify buses by service numbers... and flights

 

[MCR247]

Except headcodes are reused

 

[sprinterguy]

Except headcodes are reused

True, but it is unlikely that the same passenger travelling on one train will end up on another somewhere else with the same headcode. And it's the same method as the Eurostar train reporting numbers, though I imagine the Eurostar headcodes don't repeat within a day.

Bus service numbers only identify a group of services operating the same route: The only (AFAIK) individual identification of local bus services is the vehicle roster which, of course, the public don't see.

 

[swt_passenger]

Retail service IDs are of the format AAnnnn (where AA is the 2 letter TOC code, eg VT, XC, SW etc) and are used by the RJIS system to define a particular train, usually in numerical sequence of the TOCs services on a particular day, although some TOCs do use the numeric fields differently.

They show up in the reservation system and paper seat reservation tickets already show the RSID rather than the train reporting number (aka the headcode).

Departure station and departure time are not unique though are they?

 

[starrymarkb]

Nope - wasn't there a near simultaneous departure from BHM to Edinburgh but taking different routes at one point?

 

[MCR247]

In VXC days, I got a 1003(?) to Aberdeen on a Sunday morning via Edinburgh at the same time as a train via Preston to Edinburgh was leaving! The left from platforms that were next to each other!

 

[scotsman]

Even the crews aren't sure on the train numbers. It's not uncommon to see VT1M52 etc. in the train number field

 

[Oswyntail]

If (and it is a big If) the TOCs could agree that this is a good idea, and had a standard means of displaying it by the doors of trains, this could help passengers a lot. Rather than asking "does this train go to Thirsk?" (which needs a fair bit of knowledge to answer) "Is this train PQ9876?" is a simple question, simply answered by reference to the door. But, IMHO, TOCS (and a fair number of posters on this board ) seem to be of the firm belief that passengers should be omniscient about all railway matters before they even set foot on a station. And standardisation would cut across their USPs. So no chance

 

[starrymarkb]

a fair number of posters on this board ) seem to be of the firm belief that passengers should be omniscient about all railway matters before they even set foot on a station.

It does seem that way on occasion. It seems to work well on the continent, so why not here?

 

[shinkansen1966]

It does seem that way on occasion. It seems to work well on the continent, so why not here?

Agreed. Airlines have them, seems most other European train services have them. What exactly is stopping us adopting them here, too ?

And it would help reduce the tedium of those incessant announcements about the time and date of the train when travelling with advance purchase tickets. You could simply say "please make your advance purchase ticket shows today's date and train number EC156...".

Come to think of it, the train number could be a combination of the operator's initials and the a three digit number eg "XC576". Think train numbers would be useful on long distance but less necessary on commuter services.

 

[swt_passenger]

Come to think of it, the train number could be a combination of the operator's initials and the a three digit number eg "XC576".

Or you could just stick with the operators two initials and four digits, which I explained yesterday is what already exists...

 

[tbtc]

Bus service numbers only identify a group of services operating the same route: The only (AFAIK) individual identification of local bus services is the vehicle roster which, of course, the public don't see.

Some bus companies do have this kind of thing printed on tickets.

I liked the old Southern Region of "numbered" trains - so if you saw a "32" you knew it was your service.

Similarly, Virgin have numbered routes - though they seemed to be less important than they used to.

I could see it working on daytime services (e.g. EMT run EMT1 fast from London to Sheffield, EMT2 slow from London to Sheffield, EMT3 fast from London to Nottingham etc).

However the problem is that there will be exceptions and omissions (e.g. do you have a different route number depending on whether a train stops at Loughborough? how do you trade-off simplicity and accuracy?)