Train Manager/Conductor

[387star]

Why do FGW Train managers get paid more than conductors?

I appreciate they 'manage' catering oversee first class and have more passengers under their care however fewer stops and more commission as well. I guess route knowledge is higher and currently they have to be very careful with all the slam door stock to avoid doors on the catch incidences

I'm guessing TM jobs rarely come up? Do they normally go to internal applicants?

Is the assessment process harder?

 

[bunnahabhain]

It will be down to terms and conditions and what the TMs have sold off in return for a slightly higher salary. Usually its down to selling things like the right to PNBs which Senior Conductors would rather retain, as a TM could in theory use the buffet car for cooking whatever snap they want, whereas a Conductor or Senior Conductor stuck in the back end of a pacer won't have much in the way of cooking things.

The job itself is the same, the rulebook makes no distinction for job titles such as Train Manager, Conductor, Senior Conductor, et al, at the end of the day you are a Guard.

 

[Flamingo]

Train Manager is responsible for on-board crew (customer host's, chefs, Pullman crew), so is a "supervisory" role. Also, TM's are chosen for their dazzling good looks and magnetic personality!

 

[NX]

Guards are also forced to undergo a interview and assessment centre now to be 'promoted' to TM.

If a TM messes up they are 'demoted' to unit Guard, if a unit Guard messes up they're sacked.

TMs cross cover DMU work at their rate of pay, Guards cross cover TM unit work at the guards rate of pay........

Whereas unit drivers sign up for a normal transfer to the HST links, when they get to the top they move a cross, no interview etc.

The assessments as the same for both roles, but the comp. questions at interview are slightly different. The last few intakes have been guards to TMs. But there are some depots (Paddington) that don't have guards to 'promote' from so they take anyone with a pulse!
There is an agreement which is now being enforced that only once all internal guard candidates have been intervied and found unsuitable can they look to other grades, it's written as a line of promotion.

Depending who you ask (TM or Guard) they will tell you their role is more difficult. Route knowledge is the same, at my depot we cover several hundard miles of routes over TCB, AB, Axle counter track, semaphore sigalling, token block, DC third Rail, short platforms, request stops, local door platforms multiple traction etc.

Yes, TMs have to watch for doors on the catch a huge problem if your not switched on but usually TMs have despatchers to assist with despatch. They also have SDO which is a risk if your not switched on again. But usually they revert to ops only mode, so don't do revenue when they're working the Berks and Hants or Cotswolds with every stop a different SDO position.

Guards are expected to do both with anything from a single 153 to a 6 or 7 car multiple traction formation from Weymouth in the high summer. Try working a 7 vehicle with front door request stops with a 150/1 - 150/1 + 153 + 158 the front two units have no walk through ! lol

I'm sure Mr Flamimgo Will give a insight into his role also....

TMs at Virgin earn circa 40k. as opposed to the circa 33k at FGW I would suggest the FGW TM has a more challenging role than the Virign TM though.........

NX

 

[Withnailandi]

People don't get sacked so easily. I hate this misconception that people have about the railway.

 

[NX]

That's correct, if you mess up-fess up. If you don't you'll the boot, pretty much the only way you'll get the boot.

NX

 

[Withnailandi]

Its very hard to sack people these days. Disregarding the drug and alcohol policy and as a driver the mobile phone policy whilst in a cab are sackable offences. Making a mistake and not owning up is not necessarily a sackable one. It would probably not do you any favours if you went for promotion or if a guard wanted to go driving.

 

[387star]

Virgin guards earn 40k wow

What depots do they work from

I gather they are amongst the toughest company to join

 

[muz379]

Its very hard to sack people these days. Disregarding the drug and alcohol policy and as a driver the mobile phone policy whilst in a cab are sackable offences. Making a mistake and not owning up is not necessarily a sackable one. It would probably not do you any favours if you went for promotion or if a guard wanted to go driving.

depending on the mistake trying to cover something sinister up could be sackable .

Asside from that the usual things that will get you sacked apply , stealing from your employer and assaulting a colleague/customer/manager etc .

 

[scotsman]

Virgin guards earn 40k wow

What depots do they work from

I gather they are amongst the toughest company to join

Yup, and they also do 42 hour weeks over 5 days (most guards do 35 over 4 - compare the pay per hour!) and have lower overtime and commission payments.

As far as I know, Virgin have TMs in Euston, Manchester, Birmingham, Wolverhampton, Preston, Liverpool, Glasgow, and Edinburgh.

 

[Minilad]

Train Manager is responsible for on-board crew (customer host's, chefs, Pullman crew), so is a "supervisory" role. Also, TM's are chosen for their dazzling good looks and magnetic personality!

Does that mean the ugly ones get to be conductors ?
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Yup, and they also do 42 hour weeks over 5 days (most guards do 35 over 4 - compare the pay per hour!) and have lower overtime and commission payments.

As far as I know, Virgin have TMs in Euston, Manchester, Birmingham, Wolverhampton, Preston, Liverpool, Glasgow, and Edinburgh.

Not Birmingham

 

[LowLevel]

I passed the tests to be a train manager at another TOC that has TMs and conductors but got a conductors job - which I'm perfectly happy with. No first class, no catering, no on board spats and bitching about which hostess is sleeping with which driver etc etc, I just trundle around on my knackered unit on board which I'm king and perfectly happy thanks very much! Plus I can see where I'm.... coming from properly out of the back cab window! (Nearly said going there )

 

[notadriver]

I passed the tests to be a train manager at another TOC that has TMs and conductors but got a conductors job - which I'm perfectly happy with. No first class, no catering, no on board spats and bitching about which hostess is sleeping with which driver etc etc, I just trundle around on my knackered unit on board which I'm king and perfectly happy thanks very much! Plus I can see where I'm.... coming from properly out of the back cab window! (Nearly said going there )

surely the back cab is something common to all who do the TM and conductor role?

 

[muz379]

surely the back cab is something common to all who do the TM and conductor role?

nah voyagers and pendos etc have them fancy fandangled train manager officers in the coach behind first class or something dont they

not something I know about from work experience as the fanciest traction I sign is a 158
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Yup, and they also do 42 hour weeks over 5 days (most guards do 35 over 4 - compare the pay per hour!) and have lower overtime and commission payments.

As far as I know, Virgin have TMs in Euston, Manchester, Birmingham, Wolverhampton, Preston, Liverpool, Glasgow, and Edinburgh.

yeah , I thought they had sundays in the week as well . which at my TOC we get paid extra for working .

 

[LowLevel]

Intercity guards at best have an office or brake van and at worst nothing at all bar the kitchen and often windowless anyway. No one but a fitter is allowed to travel in the rear powercar on a HST as if the remote fire systems go off there's every chance they'll kill you. Fitters disabled it and can activate it manually if required. I'll stick with my units ta!

 

[387star]

Do Southern conductors have Sunday as the working week?

 

[Flamingo]

Does that mean the ugly ones get to be conductors ?

You might say that, I could not possibly comment

 

[plastictaffy]

TMs at Virgin earn circa 40k. as opposed to the circa 33k at FGW I would suggest the FGW TM has a more challenging role than the Virign TM though.........

NX

The TM's at Virgin do indeed earn nearly 40k. However, they have committed sundays, and must work 26 a year. They also get split restdays eg off weds, early thurs, off fri late sat and then to lates. They also have a weird rostering system where they have a 7 day mark-up, on which they can be moved to whichever shift management see fit, as long as Hidden 18 is adhered to. I can't see a Virgin TM's job being hard, either. London to Manchester with three intermediate stops?? Doddle. They wanna try a 12 car, all shacks uphill first thing in the morning. I may earn less money, but I don't have to work my sundays, I don't get rostered split restdays, and I know what my shifts will be weeks in advance.