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Train hitting object at Swinton (S.Yorks)

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Donny158

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Does anyone know what's happened at Swinton this morning? Rail enquiries suggesting a train has hit an object on the line but does anyone have more detail? It must have done a lot of damage as the line is expected to have problems until 1500.
Many thanks
 
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talltim

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Looking at Northern's service alerts, I'm wondering if the incident was actually yesterday evening? Lots of services delayed in the area from about 20:00 due to emergency services attending an incident.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
https://twitter.com/hallamfmnews/status/530679038835441664
British Transport Police tell us rail disruption this morning was caused after an empty train hit a wood chipper on the line at Swinton

other Tweets refer to a generator
 
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D1009

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Delays to southbound Cross Country trains this morning are being announced as due to vandalism in the Sheffield area. It appears they are being diverted from South Kirkby Jn via Doncaster and Thrybergh Jn to Aldwarke Jn.
 

talltim

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Delays to southbound Cross Country trains this morning are being announced as due to vandalism in the Sheffield area. It appears they are being diverted from South Kirkby Jn via Doncaster and Thrybergh Jn to Aldwarke Jn.
I might have to got to Doncaster today, always wanted to travel that bit of line
 

Donny158

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Anyone know which empty train was involved this morning? I'm guessing with the amount of time it's taking to get the line cleared, it has caused some considerable damage to either the train involved or the infrastructure!?
 

talltim

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Speaking to colleagues in our rail department it seems it was a wood chipper
 
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wensley

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On a train...somewhere!
Anyone know which empty train was involved this morning? I'm guessing with the amount of time it's taking to get the line cleared, it has caused some considerable damage to either the train involved or the infrastructure!?

XV 5V81 0416 Crofton Depot - Sheffield.
 

najaB

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Speaking to colleagues in our rail department it seems it was a wood chipper
How does a wood chipper (or generator for that matter) get onto the line? If it's equipment involved in line maintenance I thought it would be kept well into the cess.
 

talltim

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Well as the BTP are involved, I suspect it was nothing to do with the railway.
Northern services to Doncaster are being diverted via the GC route from Aldwarke junction. The XC services to/from Doncaster seem to be cancelled at Sheffield, whether they are completely bypassing the area I don't know. The XC services that go between Sheffield and Wakefield seem to be still running, but I can't see what diversionary route they could use , except via Barnsley, which I doubt they have the route knowledge for
 

D1009

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The XC services that go between Sheffield and Wakefield seem to be still running, but I can't see what diversionary route they could use , except via Barnsley, which I doubt they have the route knowledge for
As mentioned earlier, they are going via Doncaster.
 

455driver

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How does a wood chipper (or generator for that matter) get onto the line? If it's equipment involved in line maintenance I thought it would be kept well into the cess.

Well it didn't walk itself onto the line did it so have a guess! ;)
 

Donny158

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XV 5V81 0416 Crofton Depot - Sheffield.

Thanks for the info. I have just had a quick look on realtime trains and I see a Northern ECS went the opposite direction around the same time as 5V81 at Swinton. This got me wondering if the driver of the Northern ECS ( Sheffield-Wakefield kirkgate) could possibly have seen the object on the opposite track? I'm no driver so I don't know the how a driver operates ! ( is the driver supposed to just concentrate on signals and just the track the train is on and so probably would not have seen an object on the opposite track? ) If the Northern driver had seen the object and could see a train on the opposite side fast approaching the object, is there anything the train driver could have done to warn the other train ? ( I'm thinking something like flashing of lights) many thanks
 

talltim

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As mentioned earlier, they are going via Doncaster.

Yeah, I worked that out. Seems strange to cancel the ones that go via Doncaster to run the ones that don't that way, but presumably it makes sense when you consider the rest of their routes

Just been Sheffield-Mexborough and return for a spot of track bashing
 

tsr

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Thanks for the info. I have just had a quick look on realtime trains and I see a Northern ECS went the opposite direction around the same time as 5V81 at Swinton. This got me wondering if the driver of the Northern ECS ( Sheffield-Wakefield kirkgate) could possibly have seen the object on the opposite track? I'm no driver so I don't know the how a driver operates ! ( is the driver supposed to just concentrate on signals and just the track the train is on and so probably would not have seen an object on the opposite track? ) If the Northern driver had seen the object and could see a train on the opposite side fast approaching the object, is there anything the train driver could have done to warn the other train ? ( I'm thinking something like flashing of lights) many thanks

It depends on the amount of light available and the field of vision from the cab, but drivers should be alert to their surroundings and I would certainly expect there is a high chance they would see something like a wood chipper on an adjacent line. If so, the actions taken would really depend on what it was deemed to be (not always obvious) and what needed to be done, but realistically I would expect the driver to stop their train and report it urgently to the signaller. It all depends what was going on in the driver's surroundings and whether the obstruction was in fact on the line at the time, though.

There are various other options such as the use of flashing hazard lights on some stock, switching headlights to red, etc., but if the train has not actually hit an object and is not causing an obstruction in and of itself, it may not be deemed necessary to use those options, especially if the signaller can be readily contacted.
 

Tomnick

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It depends on the amount of light available and the field of vision from the cab, but drivers should be alert to their surroundings and I would certainly expect there is a high chance they would see something like a wood chipper on an adjacent line. If so, the actions taken would really depend on what it was deemed to be (not always obvious) and what needed to be done, but realistically I would expect the driver to stop their train and report it urgently to the signaller. It all depends what was going on in the driver's surroundings and whether the obstruction was in fact on the line at the time, though.

There are various other options such as the use of flashing hazard lights on some stock, switching headlights to red, etc., but if the train has not actually hit an object and is not causing an obstruction in and of itself, it may not be deemed necessary to use those options, especially if the signaller can be readily contacted.
Is GSM-R in use around there yet? I thought it was. If so, the answer's far simpler - a railway emergency group call, initiated by the driver, to get the job stopped as quickly as possible.
 
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Picture of the XC train parked up at Doncaster this morning. Thanks to Alan Gouldthorpe for this picture.

I caught the 0901 Doncaster - Lincoln Central via Sheffield service yesterday, 153315 with a broken side window went via Kilnhurst, Aldwark Junction was like a train park with trains waiting to get onto the part single line at Kilnhurst, we arrived at Lincoln 17 late which was not to bad considering.
 

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tsr

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Is GSM-R in use around there yet? I thought it was. If so, the answer's far simpler - a railway emergency group call, initiated by the driver, to get the job stopped as quickly as possible.

I wasn't sure, so I said "report it urgently to the signaller". You are right, of course!
 

Wolf

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The driver can use the red button on the gsm-r to initiate an emergency group call for anything which can pose a danger to trains. What suprised me when I did my gsmr training is that a fatality actually would not warrent use of the red button under normal circumstances but only the yellow priority call button.
 

tsr

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The driver can use the red button on the gsm-r to initiate an emergency group call for anything which can pose a danger to trains. What suprised me when I did my gsmr training is that a fatality actually would not warrent use of the red button under normal circumstances but only the yellow priority call button.

Indeed. I was not sure if the route in question was fully fitted with GSM-R equipment. I have known the red button to be used for a number of reasons and, whilst you're correct that it's not usually relevant for persons hit by trains, it has sometimes been activated for those sorts of emergencies.
 

cf111

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The driver can use the red button on the gsm-r to initiate an emergency group call for anything which can pose a danger to trains. What suprised me when I did my gsmr training is that a fatality actually would not warrent use of the red button under normal circumstances but only the yellow priority call button.

I think that this is so a likely very distressing conversation has a degree of privacy between the driver and the signaller, rather than it being broadcast to everyone in the area.
 

tsr

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I think that this is so a likely very distressing conversation has a degree of privacy between the driver and the signaller, rather than it being broadcast to everyone in the area.

Local instructions for my locality do say that once the immediate type and scope of this sort of incident is established on a red-button railway emergency group call, the signaller will then move to a private conversation with the driver or other member of staff involved, ensuring in the process that a clear understanding is achieved with regards to moving (or not moving) any nearby trains. I am not sure if this protocol is universal yet.
 

Andyh82

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Considering it will have been dark at that time, and the Northern ECS would most likely have been a pacer or something similar with weak headlights, would the driver have seen an obstruction on the other line, are the lines immediately next to each other in that area.

Driving the first service in a morning particularly in winter must be a quite hair raising, you don't know what you will come across, fallen tree, a flood, a snow blockage etc, not to mention vandalism.
 

Dieseldriver

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The driver can use the red button on the gsm-r to initiate an emergency group call for anything which can pose a danger to trains. What suprised me when I did my gsmr training is that a fatality actually would not warrent use of the red button under normal circumstances but only the yellow priority call button.

If I struck a person I would not hesitate to use the REC button on the GSMR.
 

Llama

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Correct, red button should always initially be used, signallers have guidelines to end the Railway Emergency Group call when appropriate and initiate a priority point-to-point call to the driver when required in these situations.
I wouldn't like to have to stand up in a coroners inquest and try to explain why I didn't think that an emergency call was required.
 
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