Train for scenic lines

[superkev]

Came across this Japan train on you tube showing how it should be done.
https://youtu.be/eHZxhSu6fVs
View out the front, rotating Sears some in pairs to direction of travel, huge windows and most of all some legroom.
Can't see it happening here sadly with all our "can't do people". Perhaps Japan has more "can do people" than us.
K

 

[najaB]

I'd be interested if it meets crash-worthiness regulations.

 

[themiller]

That looks like it's on a secondary tourist line so it wouldn't necessarily have to comply with UK mainline crashworthiness standards. In Switzerland, I've been in several mainline, Eurocity panorama cars which go into Austria and Italy and must therefore comply with European standards.

 

[yorksrob]

I'm not sure there's that much benefit tbh. I speak as a rwegular traveller on the Settle Carlisle, and even with the narrow windows of 158's, I've never had difficulty seeing the peaks and hills of the route. The overhead windows on this supposedly scenic train would just allow cloud spotting.

A more effective idea would be to get a rake of 1st class mk3's with 2+1 seating and windows lining up.

With various HST's coming off lease in the near future, who knows !

 

[Bletchleyite]

I'm actually not a great fan of those panoramic coaches - I find the large area of glass means they get too hot, luggage provision is poor and the curved windows cause distortion of the image which means I don't enjoy the view quite as well.

Large conventional picture windows with the seats fully aligned to them are to me best. I can think of few vehicles better for viewing Swiss mountain scenery than the EW IV. Though the Class 158 in original layout (fully window-aligned throughout) isn't bad.

 

[class387]

I prefer this:

Perfect window alignment and large opening windows for photography.

Panoramic windows just let you see more clouds.

 

[edwin_m]

I'd be interested if it meets crash-worthiness regulations.

Japan has a very different philosophy on crashworthiness, basically assuming that crashes are so unlikely that it isn't worth spending a lot of money reducing the effect if one does happen.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

I'm not sure there's that much benefit tbh. I speak as a rwegular traveller on the Settle Carlisle, and even with the narrow windows of 158's, I've never had difficulty seeing the peaks and hills of the route. The overhead windows on this supposedly scenic train would just allow cloud spotting.

With the Pennines being a lot more gentle than the Alps, there is much less need to look upwards to see them.

 

[43096]

I prefer this:

Perfect window alignment and large opening windows for photography.

Panoramic windows just let you see more clouds.

These are even better, although the seats don't line up with the windows.... because there are no windows!

 

[class387]

These are even better, although the seats don't line up with the windows.... because there are no windows!

Yes. Bit too cold though.

Also, your image is a little too big.

 

[richieb1971]

Nobody cleans trains windows in the UK Anymore.

In Japan all bullet trains are sparkling everywhere they go and they have to be because they are pure white. When the train pulls in numerous workers clean the flies, the front end, everything.

In contrast the UK doesn't clean their trains. It really does put us to shame.

So anyway, having a panoramic window won't work here unless the windows are cleaned. And as for the experience, I believe it would be 300% better to have panoramic windows. Its not about cloud spotting, its about riding the countryside and absorbing it.. the lighting... If you have a conventional train you don't get that, you just feel like your in a container looking out of window.

 

[yorksrob]

If you think the windows are dirty, you should have been in Kent during the hosepipe ban !
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
This seems to be a bit of an expensive gimmick when they could achieve a lot more, more cost effectively by concentrating on the basics - I.e good window view, comfy seat, not too many crowded in.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I prefer this:

Perfect window alignment and large opening windows for photography.

And hardly any legroom, and in 2nd incredibly uncomfortable seats.

This:

is much better (though I don't like the 1st class seats; they are a bit bouncy and not supportive enough).

- interior.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Nobody cleans trains windows in the UK Anymore.

LM do. I can't remember the last mucky window on a LM 350. VTWC tend to do so too.

Other TOCs just need some attention to detail. Northern is a disgrace in this respect, and it is sheer laziness. Provide a bloke with a bucket and a sponge at selected stations if there's no fixed equipment.

 

[Ash Bridge]

It's fine having crystal clear windows, but the major problem preventing a good view still seems to be the vast amount of unchecked lineside foliage that obscures it! Neil I think what you mentioned about the person with a bucket and sponge was trialled on the Looe Valley Line a few years back, not sure if they still do though?

 

[superkev]

The Japanese don't seem to put up with travelling backwards like here.
Often pairs of seats swivel to the direction of travel.
See https://youtu.be/g29cDEu33FM.
I'm sure here there would be a multitude of 'can't do' people saying it can't be done.
K

 

[Tim R-T-C]

I'm sure reversible seats would be perfectly possible, just rather unnecessary - even on scenic routes you often get a perfectly good view facing backwards.

I would support some 'scenic' rolling stock being made for the UK, for routes like the S&C and the Scottish Highlands. They could be used to promote the scenic value of these lines and encourage tourist travel on them. Particularly if they were reserved-seat-only coaches so that people could guarantee a view.

Would be ideal if they brought back LHCS on these lines, could add on scenic cars depending on demand, but keep the main coaches for standard travellers.

However, someone has to pay for these and I can't see it happening any time soon.

 

[Ash Bridge]

The Japanese don't seem to put up with travelling backwards like here.
Often pairs of seats swivel to the direction of travel.
See https://youtu.be/g29cDEu33FM.
I'm sure here there would be a multitude of 'can't do' people saying it can't be done.
K

I'm sure reversible seats would be perfectly possible, just rather unnecessary - even on scenic routes you often get a perfectly good view facing backwards.

I would support some 'scenic' rolling stock being made for the UK, for routes like the S&C and the Scottish Highlands. They could be used to promote the scenic value of these lines and encourage tourist travel on them. Particularly if they were reserved-seat-only coaches so that people could guarantee a view.

Would be ideal if they brought back LHCS on these lines, could add on scenic cars depending on demand, but keep the main coaches for standard travellers.

However, someone has to pay for these and I can't see it happening any time soon.

How about something like this, BR mk1 based (Gloucester RC&W built) prototype from 1957 fully swivelling and reclining seats.

 

[Clip]

The Japanese don't seem to put up with travelling backwards like here.
Often pairs of seats swivel to the direction of travel.
See https://youtu.be/g29cDEu33FM.
I'm sure here there would be a multitude of 'can't do' people saying it can't be done.
K

It can be done indeed it has been done before but these seats and the train you posted at the start are both unnecessary.

 

[DarloRich]

i can just imagine those panoramic trains trundling through an iron clad gray North Yorkshire November day when it doesn't even seem to get properly light - the view should be superb.

 

[jayiscupid]

I'm sure reversible seats would be perfectly possible, just rather unnecessary - even on scenic routes you often get a perfectly good view facing backwards.

I would support some 'scenic' rolling stock being made for the UK, for routes like the S&C and the Scottish Highlands. They could be used to promote the scenic value of these lines and encourage tourist travel on them. Particularly if they were reserved-seat-only coaches so that people could guarantee a view.

Would be ideal if they brought back LHCS on these lines, could add on scenic cars depending on demand, but keep the main coaches for standard travellers.

However, someone has to pay for these and I can't see it happening any time soon.

There was an article in Rail magazine a few years back which showed the concept of a semi permanently coupled 4 car 156 reconfigured as a scenic train with aircon. I think it was proposed by one of the leasing companies but I don't have the magazine anymore and can't find any reference on line.
It's a shame that the electrification delays and DMU shortage has put the idea to rest.

 

[GrimShady]

There was an article in Rail magazine a few years back which showed the concept of a semi permanently coupled 4 car 156 reconfigured as a scenic train with aircon. I think it was proposed by one of the leasing companies but I don't have the magazine anymore and can't find any reference on line.
It's a shame that the electrification delays and DMU shortage has put the idea to rest.

Cant remember which year the magazine came out can you? Id like to see that artical.

 

[jayiscupid]

Cant remember which year the magazine came out can you? Id like to see that artical.

Sadly I don't. I do know that it was within the last 4 years and there was an inset picture on the front cover showing an artists impression (it's why I bought the magazine).
I've tried google searches but without any luck.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

I think that was only a year or two ago?

 

[daikilo]

There was this in August 2015
http://www.railmagazine.com/news/2015/08/25/class-158s-being-prepared-for-scotland-s-scenic-journeys
but it just describes the actual refurbishment of 158s.

And there's stuff in this thread from 2014
http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=106930

 

[Lemmy99uk]

The Kintetsu Railway has the best forward view on their Shimakaze service.

This is the Green (first) class.

 

[themiller]

View attachment 30042

The Kintetsu Railway has the best forward view on their Shimakaze service.

This is the Green (first) class.

Almost as good as the Montreux Oberland Bernois railway where the driver sits behind and above those willing to pay a supplement on their Crystal Panoramic an Golden Panoramic trains. There's also one of the DB ICEs (3 I think) where the passengers in the leading coach have a view past the driver.

 

[Townsend Hook]

Soon passengers will have a driver's eye view of scenic Merseyside, when the new Merseyrail Stadtler EMUs are delivered