TPE May 2022 Unit Allocation

[JonathanH]

Problem is, you're looking at it from a May 22 point of view, which is only a short-term timetable. What's the point in putting 802s on a different route requiring significant traction training, when say in Dec 23, the medium/long-term plan is different.

Why would the December 23 timetable be different? If the May 22 timetable works, there is very strong justification for it remaining in place for the next decade. If it doesn't work, there will need to be more retrenchment until there is a simple, reliable timetable.

 

[LittleAH]

Why would the December 23 timetable be different? If the May 22 timetable works, there is very strong justification for it remaining in place for the next decade. If it doesn't work, there will need to be more retrenchment until there is a simple, reliable timetable.

Transpennine Route Upgrade
Diversionary routes
MRTF
Potential new routes

 

[Greybeard33]

There's plenty of reasons, including that with MRTF the service in question will still run through to the Airport outside of peak times etc. Problem is, you're looking at it from a May 22 point of view, which is only a short-term timetable. What's the point in putting 802s on a different route requiring significant traction training, when say in Dec 23, the medium/long-term plan is different.

The latest recommendation from the Manchester Recovery Task Force for the December 2022 timetable (Option B+) has the York service terminating at Manchester Victoria all day, not running through to Manchester Airport.

See the MRTF thread.

 

[Fokx]

185 Manchester to Hull
185 Manchester to Cleethorpes
185 Manchester to Huddersfield
185 Huddersfield to Leeds
185 Airport to Saltburn*
185 York/Leeds to Scarborough**

802 Liverpool to Newcastle
802 Manchester to York

68 Liverpool to Scarborough
68 York/Leeds to Scarborough*
68 Airport to Saltburn

397 Liverpool to Glasgow
397 Airport to Glasgow
397 Airport to Edinburgh

*Handful of journeys only
** TPE to operate a half hourly service from Scarborough replacing the proposed Northern service which will run to York or extended to Leeds depending on demand

In regards to the ‘extra’ 802’s, keep an eye out for upcoming changes to the Nova purple stop boards at station which may give you a clue

 

[Purple Orange]

185 Manchester to Hull
185 Manchester to Cleethorpes
185 Manchester to Huddersfield
185 Huddersfield to Leeds
185 Airport to Saltburn*
185 York/Leeds to Scarborough**

802 Liverpool to Newcastle
802 Manchester to York

68 Liverpool to Scarborough
68 York/Leeds to Scarborough*
68 Airport to Saltburn

397 Liverpool to Glasgow
397 Airport to Glasgow
397 Airport to Edinburgh

*Handful of journeys only
** TPE to operate a half hourly service from Scarborough replacing the proposed Northern service which will run to York or extended to Leeds depending on demand

In regards to the ‘extra’ 802’s, keep an eye out for upcoming changes to the Nova purple stop boards at station which may give you a clue

Surely the 802s aren’t going to be run as 10-car trains?

 

[Fokx]

Surely the 802s aren’t going to be run as 10-car trains?

There’s nothing physically stopping 397’s or 802s from operating as double sets except for short platforms on the North route

 

[sjm77]

In regards to the ‘extra’ 802’s, keep an eye out for upcoming changes to the Nova purple stop boards at station which may give you a clue

Surely the 802s aren’t going to be run as 10-car trains?

Well there was demand for certain key Airport - Glasgow/Edinburgh services to be 8 car C350, and for these a 5 car 397 would not be enough. However I thought the airport had a strict 8 coach maximum.

 

[Purple Orange]

Surely a Liverpool-Newcastle service could run as 10-car? Or could it be kept for the York-Manchester services where most of demand is?

 

[LittleAH]

Surely a Liverpool-Newcastle service could run as 10-car?

Not a chance.

 

[IanXC]

** TPE to operate a half hourly service from Scarborough replacing the proposed Northern service which will run to York or extended to Leeds depending on demand

I'd been pondering whether that might come up, uses the resources otherwise not required as a result of other changes I guess.

Interesting idea that it could be extended to Leeds. Surely this is falling back into trying to fit too many trains into the Garforth corridor?

 

[Philip]

If these rolling stock predictions are accurate, it would still leave quite a few 185s surplus to requirements and no guarantee that they will operate to Nottingham.

 

[Fokx]

If these rolling stock predictions are accurate, it would still leave quite a few 185s surplus to requirements and no guarantee that they will operate to Nottingham.

15 are due to be released after the December timetable change as their lease extension expires then. However, in theory they could once again be extended at the request of TfN or DfT for the TRU

 

[LittleAH]

15 are due to be released after the December timetable change as their lease extension expires then. However, in theory they could once again be extended at the request of TfN or DfT for the TRU

They'll be staying.

 

[JonathanH]

They'll be staying.

What will be going then? Or, put another way, how are taxpayer savings going to be delivered relative to the current cost of the TPE operation?

 

[LittleAH]

What will be going then?

Nothing.

No need to go through this again. TPE will be running some Newcastle-Edinburgh's. Huddersfield stoppers from Manchester will be extending to Wakefield and there'll be some additional destinations too.

 

[Purple Orange]

Nothing.

No need to go through this again. TPE will be running some Newcastle-Edinburgh's. Huddersfield stoppers from Manchester will be extending to Wakefield and there'll be some additional destinations too.

What other destinations could there be?