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TOC contract expiry dates

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ollyexe2808

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This is missing the point by a country mile.

The major critical issues for GBR will be:
  1. Funding. It is clear that the system as a whole will need to be subsidised. Will the subsidy be fixed annually or cover longer terms, say five or seven years? It's the difference between day-to-day planning or being able to commit to things over a longer period. It is hugely important.
  2. Charges. Will it be free to set its own fares and access charges? Limiting or delaying charge increases while still demanding a defined performance in the face of changing costs is a major reason for the poor financial performance of not only 'The Big Four' but also British Railways. The bigger the subsidy the more say over the way you run your business has the person supplying the cash. 'He who pays the piper...'
  3. Freedom from micromanagement from the DfT / Treasury. See point 2 above.
There are others but forming GBR will, by itself, make no difference at all if the rest of the interface to Government remains essentially unchanged.

I absolutely get that but I was just giving my opinion that I am excited to see the next phase of nationalisation in the form of the GBR legislation. I don't really see how the points mentioned here by yourself are incompatible with saying that I am interested (and excited) by the formation of GBR?
 
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coppercapped

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I absolutely get that but I was just giving my opinion that I am excited to see the next phase of nationalisation in the form of the GBR legislation. I don't really see how the points mentioned here by yourself are incompatible with saying that I am interested (and excited) by the formation of GBR?
If you are excited by something it implies that you expect changes which are beneficial to you. Otherwise you would be apprehensive.

The proposed change in the structure of the organisation gives no reason to expect the change to have any effect on the day to day running of the business. However a change in the 'aims' of the organisation and giving the management freedom to implement any necessary changes will have an effect.

Unfortunately there are no clear, published aims for GBR. Apart from the desire to bring the passenger side of the railways under state control.

In this sense there is no difference between the current efforts at state control and those of the 1947 Transport Act. That didn't meet any of its aims either, apart from giving the politicians the ability to say 'We nationalised the railways'.
 

HerneHill

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Unfortunately there are no clear, published aims for GBR.
No published aims yet - but knowing what we all know in this forum about the complexity of the railway, can you blame them for not wanting to commit to specific promises too far upfront?

What is patently clear is that better track and train / inter-TOC operational and commercial coordination for the benefit of the passenger can only be achieved by bringing all parties under the same management - and given the subsidy-heavy, public service nature of the railway, that management must necessarily be in the public sector.

Hence the govt is starting by doing the one thing that they know for certain needs to be done, and that is nationalising the TOCs ahead of organisational reform…
 

coppercapped

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No published aims yet - but knowing what we all know in this forum about the complexity of the railway, can you blame them for not wanting to commit to specific promises too far upfront?

What is patently clear is that better track and train / inter-TOC operational and commercial coordination for the benefit of the passenger can only be achieved by bringing all parties under the same management - and given the subsidy-heavy, public service nature of the railway, that management must necessarily be in the public sector.

Hence the govt is starting by doing the one thing that they know for certain needs to be done, and that is nationalising the TOCs ahead of organisational reform…
Even assuming that your statements in the second paragraph are correct, what is being proposed is the totally wrong way to approach things.

Firstly - define your aims

Secondly - set up the structures/organisation/finance to achieve them.

What is being done is a**e about face. The next Railways Act is already pre-programmed.
 

Doctor Fegg

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Its not going to be the rose tinted panacea people are wistfully wanting.
Quite. It amazes me that people can look at (a) anything the Government has run in the last 15 years and (b) LNER, and conclude that a nationalised railway is going to be a marvel of competence and efficiency.
 

duffield

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Quite. It amazes me that people can look at (a) anything the Government has run in the last 15 years and (b) LNER, and conclude that a nationalised railway is going to be a marvel of competence and efficiency.
Nearly the entirety of that fifteen year period was under a different government which was entirely opposed to a nationalised railway, and regarded it as a temporary last resort (and a damn nuisance), and thus had no incentive whatsoever to make improvements, including such things as removing wasteful cross franchise duplication and so forth.

We now have an entirely new government which has a huge electoral incentive to make GBR work, and it's pretty clear that at the very least some merging of, coordination between and sharing of facilities between the former franchises could yield at least some savings and customer benefits, for example.

In the light of these facts, it seems bizarre to use the last fifteen years as a rigid guide to what will happen in the next five and so draw the conclusion from that that "nationalisation doesn't work" as opposed to the conclusion that "nationalisation can never work under a government that is entirely opposed to it".

For the avoidance of doubt, I have no idea how well GBR will work, and no idea if really significant improvements will result. But I do expect things to be different, and don't think the last fifteen years experience is particularly relevant.
 

Lknowles78

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Has anything been revealed yet about the structure of the passenger railway under GBR?

Will it continue as fragmented companies as they are now under one management and be called “LNER a GBR Company” etc or will they all become “GBR” in name and retain the franchise structure or will there be mass reorganisation into something like the old InterCity, Regional Railways, NSE etc or regional cost centres?
 

brick60000

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Has anything been revealed yet about the structure of the passenger railway under GBR?

Will it continue as fragmented companies as they are now under one management and be called “LNER a GBR Company” etc or will they all become “GBR” in name and retain the franchise structure or will there be mass reorganisation into something like the old InterCity, Regional Railways, NSE etc or regional cost centres?
I personally suspect that the franchise structure will remain, possibly with some minor reassignment of routes, at least for a significant period of time.

Everything else notwithstanding, staff contracts across all grades are now so fragmented (even within existing operators) that any form of alignment would be an enormous task. And having just gone through a major period of industrial unrest, the settlement of which has been a key part of Labour’s pledge, I can’t see any desire to fire the starting pistol for another.

As an example, I can’t see a world now where staff within the same newly aligned operator are going to agree to drive/guard the same routes for different rates of pay. And aligning pay to the highest common denominator would cost an absolute fortune - and I’m not sure there would be a real benefit for the passenger from doing so.

A bigger benefit feels like a coordinated central “owning group” (ie GBR) to which all the TOCs are answerable, working towards common goals.
 

HerneHill

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Firstly - define your aims

Secondly - set up the structures/organisation/finance to achieve them.
100% agree under normal circumstances. However, this government’s 5-year ticking clock is now already 4 months in - there is no time to waste on generating reams and reams of paper; gotta just get on with it.

Has anything been revealed yet about the structure of the passenger railway under GBR?
The bulk of operational decision-making will still be localised akin to present-day TOCs.

Main areas to centralise are things like procurement and technology, where TOCs have really been screwed over by monopolistic suppliers (e.g., Cubic, Tracsis) which have no incentive to innovate or do better as no individual TOC has enough leverage to make them do so.

An equally key focus of the reform will be joining up operational priorities between track and train, e.g., the train operator detecting issues like track defects or vegetation ingress leading to the track owner taking remediation steps should become one joined-up decision chain. Gone will be the days where TOCs and NR continually point fingers at each other for delays and cancellations - it will be all about working together.

Quite. It amazes me that people can look at (a) anything the Government has run in the last 15 years and (b) LNER, and conclude that a nationalised railway is going to be a marvel of competence and efficiency.
The previous government has made zero attempts to reform LNER or even improve its coordination with fellow DOHL TOCs (lack of mutual ticket acceptance with Northern and TPE comes to mind).

LNER still has some pretty poor operational mgmt practices, e.g., route managers not being part of a joint decision-making forum as central Performance managers, that should be easy to fix with proper top-down reform learning from TOCs that have done it right such as GA.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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Has anything been revealed yet about the structure of the passenger railway under GBR?
Will it continue as fragmented companies as they are now under one management and be called “LNER a GBR Company” etc or will they all become “GBR” in name and retain the franchise structure or will there be mass reorganisation into something like the old InterCity, Regional Railways, NSE etc or regional cost centres?
No details yet, but maybe the structure will be unveiled once the nationalisation bill is law.
There will inevitably be at least a 3-year transition to the final GBR setup, as it will take that long to terminate all the private contracts.
Initially it will pretty much be the current setup with DOHL/OLR taking over each TOC in its current size/shape etc.
How it will then evolve and integrate into one body is unknown at the moment.
Scotland, Wales and the devolved operations (TfL, Merseyrail etc) look like being outside, or semi-detached from, mainstream GBR.

Richard Brown's new book ("Changing Times Changing Trains") on being a senior railway manager under both BR and private organisations is a fascinating read.
There's good and bad on both sides, but the moral seems to be don't expect the government (any shade) to pay much attention to the detail of the industry's structure, or to be responsible for any failures in the structure.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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Louise Haigh and her junior ministers spent another hour in the Commons yesterday (Thur Nov 21) answering MP's transport questions.
This was more than just rail, of course, and included much debate about bus services and road potholes.
No reference to the Passenger Railway Services Bill, though, despite the imminent Royal Assent.
 

coppercapped

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Nearly the entirety of that fifteen year period was under a different government which was entirely opposed to a nationalised railway, and regarded it as a temporary last resort (and a damn nuisance), and thus had no incentive whatsoever to make improvements, including such things as removing wasteful cross franchise duplication and so forth.

We now have an entirely new government which has a huge electoral incentive to make GBR work, and it's pretty clear that at the very least some merging of, coordination between and sharing of facilities between the former franchises could yield at least some savings and customer benefits, for example.

In the light of these facts, it seems bizarre to use the last fifteen years as a rigid guide to what will happen in the next five and so draw the conclusion from that that "nationalisation doesn't work" as opposed to the conclusion that "nationalisation can never work under a government that is entirely opposed to it".

For the avoidance of doubt, I have no idea how well GBR will work, and no idea if really significant improvements will result. But I do expect things to be different, and don't think the last fifteen years experience is particularly relevant.
You do realise that your first paragraph could equally well have been written in 2010 or 2012 as:

"Nearly the entirety of that fifteen thirteen year period was under a different government which was entirely opposed to a nationalised privatised railway, and regarded it as a temporary last resort (and a damn nuisance), and thus had no incentive whatsoever to make improvements, including such things as removing wasteful cross franchise duplication encouraging inter-TOC competition and so forth."

None of the arguments for or against GBR have concentrated on the most important factor for the future of the railways in an increasingly electric and battery-driven world and that it how the whole cost base is to be reduced. Cutting some duplication in some functions between some TOCs is not going to cut it - that's lost in the noise.

The biggest costs in the railway business are the interest paid on Network Rail's borrowings under the system set up by Gordon Brown, that of return on the Regulated Asset Base, which had no upper limit set on the debt which could be accumulated and the maintenance of the infrastructure. These are costs which have been under the control of a nationalised organisation since Network Rail was set up as a 'company limited by (government) guarantee' in 2002.

I see no mention in the discussions on the form and structure of GBR as to how the cost base of the railway business will be brought under control. They seem to be almost exclusively concerned with the 'failures' of the TOCs.
 

ollyexe2808

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You do realise that your first paragraph could equally well have been written in 2010 or 2012 as:

"Nearly the entirety of that fifteen thirteen year period was under a different government which was entirely opposed to a nationalised privatised railway, and regarded it as a temporary last resort (and a damn nuisance), and thus had no incentive whatsoever to make improvements, including such things as removing wasteful cross franchise duplication encouraging inter-TOC competition and so forth."

None of the arguments for or against GBR have concentrated on the most important factor for the future of the railways in an increasingly electric and battery-driven world and that it how the whole cost base is to be reduced. Cutting some duplication in some functions between some TOCs is not going to cut it - that's lost in the noise.

The biggest costs in the railway business are the interest paid on Network Rail's borrowings under the system set up by Gordon Brown, that of return on the Regulated Asset Base, which had no upper limit set on the debt which could be accumulated and the maintenance of the infrastructure. These are costs which have been under the control of a nationalised organisation since Network Rail was set up as a 'company limited by (government) guarantee' in 2002.

I see no mention in the discussions on the form and structure of GBR as to how the cost base of the railway business will be brought under control. They seem to be almost exclusively concerned with the 'failures' of the TOCs.
I suppose it depends how deep or broad you want to go in the discussion really. I am obviously nowhere near as well-read as yourself on this subject and as a lay-person who dips in and out of the forums, quite like the direction of travel of the railways from what has been presented by this government in its manifesto. If I am very honest, in my naïve way I am just interested in how it all unfolds, and as someone who loves infrastructure and the railway, the changing shape is quite exciting. I will leave the detail of finances, business cases, financial benefits and the cost base to those who have a better understanding of how it works. To plain old me, I just like trains and GBR feels like a step in the right direction as far as reducing fragmentation and creating a single coherent network.
 

JamesT

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100% agree under normal circumstances. However, this government’s 5-year ticking clock is now already 4 months in - there is no time to waste on generating reams and reams of paper; gotta just get on with it.
Get on with what?

Labour have had plenty of time in opposition to formulate what their aims for GBR are. At the moment all they appear to have is a bit of paper with “nationalise” written on it and seem to expect that will make everything better.
 

duffield

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Get on with what?

Labour have had plenty of time in opposition to formulate what their aims for GBR are. At the moment all they appear to have is a bit of paper with “nationalise” written on it and seem to expect that will make everything better.
I'm sure they've got a lot more than that, but the details have not been announced yet. In particular I find it totally unbelievable that the Rail Minister, Peter Hendy, does not have some very specific plans for GBR. I expect we will learn more soon after royal assent for the bill, though some of the plans may be contingent on the spending review early next year.
 

HerneHill

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None of the arguments for or against GBR have concentrated on the most important factor for the future of the railways in an increasingly electric and battery-driven world and that it how the whole cost base is to be reduced.
I definitely agree that the govt isn’t electrifying the network as quickly as we all here would like to see. Yes, no denying how important a factor it is to the cost base, but that strikes me as something that can be solved purely from the infrastructure owner perspective, so I don’t see how it is relevant to the organisational reform that comes with GBR?

I'm sure they've got a lot more than that, but the details have not been announced yet. In particular I find it totally unbelievable that the Rail Minister, Peter Hendy, does not have some very specific plans for GBR.
It’s to keep all potential options open at this stage! Why announce any detailed plan and pre-commit to one particular path when you’re not even sure of all the pieces that you get to play with yet?

That’s why it’s so important to get on the TOC nationalisation bill passed… imagine if that wrecking amendment had gone through. Assembling GBR starting with GA and absorbing all the good practices that comes with it would require quite a different strategy to starting with Avanti and being forced to come up with all sorts of stopgap solutions to its systematic performance issues.
 

Nicholas Lewis

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I definitely agree that the govt isn’t electrifying the network as quickly as we all here would like to see. Yes, no denying how important a factor it is to the cost base, but that strikes me as something that can be solved purely from the infrastructure owner perspective, so I don’t see how it is relevant to the organisational reform that comes with GBR?
Labour haven't committed to any new electrification yet. Maybe once the spending review has been concluded late Spring 25 we may get some new announcements.
It’s to keep all potential options open at this stage! Why announce any detailed plan and pre-commit to one particular path when you’re not even sure of all the pieces that you get to play with yet?

That’s why it’s so important to get on the TOC nationalisation bill passed… imagine if that wrecking amendment had gone through. Assembling GBR starting with GA and absorbing all the good practices that comes with it would require quite a different strategy to starting with Avanti and being forced to come up with all sorts of stopgap solutions to its systematic performance issues.
Weve seen Avanti sort themselves out, XC have delivered on their obligations as will TPE come Dec 25 change. Haigh now needs to lean on the other poor performing operators to up their game as well.
 

1D54

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Weve seen Avanti sort themselves out, XC have delivered on their obligations as will TPE come Dec 25 change. Haigh now needs to lean on the other poor performing operators to up their game as well.
You don't have to delve far on this forum to know that AWC have not sorted themselves out and as for XC delivering on their obligations? Name one.
 

Goldfish62

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Labour haven't committed to any new electrification yet. Maybe once the spending review has been concluded late Spring 25 we may get some new announcements.

Weve seen Avanti sort themselves out, XC have delivered on their obligations as will TPE come Dec 25 change. Haigh now needs to lean on the other poor performing operators to up their game as well.
GWR surely has to be in the firing line for the total breakdown of their Sunday timetable. In some ways it's worse than Northern due to the impact on long distance journeys.
 

Clarence Yard

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You don't have to delve far on this forum to know that AWC have not sorted themselves out and as for XC delivering on their obligations? Name one.

Keeping to the DfT set expenditure budget. That’s the one that gets you a lot of contract performance fee “points”.
 

Minstral25

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Don't forget Thameslink is also an utter disaster (cancelled trains, poor stock condition, awful station maintenance), but then it's already nationalised!
 

Nicholas Lewis

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Don't forget Thameslink is also an utter disaster (cancelled trains, poor stock condition, awful station maintenance), but then it's already nationalised!
Stations maybe poor on Sutton Loop while since ive been that way but the rest of the stations are fine and at best tired but then thats the same for much of the railway unless it happens to be part of recent major project. The 700's suffer from WC graffiti but generally are in good condition despite the free for all on most their network with almost negligible staff presence. Cancellations are much more of an issue than they've been for years especially on Saturdays now and they might be better just running the Sunday service on a Sat until they sought resourcing out.
 

Minstral25

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Thameslink is ran by GTR is it not? Its still private

GTR has had a management contract where the entire revenue went direct to the Government since 2014. They can spend nothing unless the DfT gives permission. So, Government gets money, and Government decides what is spent - all GTR do is look after the books for the DfT - that is nationalised in my opinion.

At least elsewhere Rail Companies could decide on things like services cheap fares, and provision of staff, etc but GTR can't. GTR has never been a private franchise like most other Rail Companies.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Stations maybe poor on Sutton Loop while since ive been that way but the rest of the stations are fine and at best tired but then thats the same for much of the railway unless it happens to be part of recent major project. The 700's suffer from WC graffiti but generally are in good condition despite the free for all on most their network with almost negligible staff presence. Cancellations are much more of an issue than they've been for years especially on Saturdays now and they might be better just running the Sunday service on a Sat until they sought resourcing out.

Matter of opinion but stations are very poor in many other areas - left to become dilapidated. Central London probably ok but stations along the Redhill route in particular are awful. 700's look run down inside and have dirt streaks or what looks like rust on the outside now - they seem to be rarely cleaned. Lack of staff encourages littering and graffiti and a general sense of who cares. Cancellations are rife and constant - probably feels worse through Redhill where I travel because of regular withdrawal of 9R service (Bedford - Three Bridges) and the lack of drivers on 9J's (Peterborough to Horsham) plus the Quarry line shuffle. I think almost every journey in last few months has had some cancellation to dela with (although I accept, I've probably been unlucky and often travel home late evening)
 
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coppercapped

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I'm sure they've got a lot more than that, but the details have not been announced yet. In particular I find it totally unbelievable that the Rail Minister, Peter Hendy, does not have some very specific plans for GBR. I expect we will learn more soon after royal assent for the bill, though some of the plans may be contingent on the spending review early next year.
The Williams Rail review was set up in 2018 to examine the future of the railways.

The result was published in May 2021 as the Williams-Shapps Plan for Rail.

It is now nearly 2025. Are you seriously trying to say that it's still necessary to keep the details under wraps? And it doesn't show much confidence in GBR if its remit and structure are dependent on one spending review.
I definitely agree that the govt isn’t electrifying the network as quickly as we all here would like to see. Yes, no denying how important a factor it is to the cost base, but that strikes me as something that can be solved purely from the infrastructure owner perspective, so I don’t see how it is relevant to the organisational reform that comes with GBR?
I did not mention anything at all about electrification, but only the general cost base.

But, taking the bone, why do you think that further electrification will reduce the railways' total costs? Agreed that rolling stock maintenance costs may be reduced slightly (mainly concerning the power unit, most of the other kit is unaffected) and that nominally reliability should be higher than diesel traction but actual practice shows that there is little, if anything, in it. The costs of fuel for electric trains can be higher than diesel, look at the cost of Electricity for Traction (EC4T) supplied by Network Rail to the train and the costs of servicing the capital tied up in the overhead wires and power supply system before trains use them. There can be years between installation and use - and in the meantime the capital spent is simply adding to the costs. There are also costs incurred in maintenance of the power supply system - trying to avoid these costs is at least part of the reason that so many de-wiring incidents have occurred. Low voltage/high current third rail is notoriously inefficient — all those juicy I^2R losses — and the presence of the third rail adds considerably to track maintenance costs. The diesel carries all of its fuel with it in a steel tank permanently connected to the prime mover.

It’s to keep all potential options open at this stage! Why announce any detailed plan and pre-commit to one particular path when you’re not even sure of all the pieces that you get to play with yet?
My understanding of the Williams-Shapps Plan was that there should be a new "guiding mind" of the railway, that is GBR: it is effectively a merger of the DfT's franchising function, the Rail Delivery Group and Network Rail.

There has been little of substance published since then which suggests that this arrangement will not come to pass — although there has been much hearsay and speculation. The published aim was for GBR to manage both the network infrastructure and a new generation of Passenger Service Contracts ("PSCs") granted to train operators. Ostensibly the logic is one of simplification and reduction of inefficiency. We'll see.

Changes in the details of the industry, however, are less obvious. The current and future industry diagrams in the Plan show differences which seem to me to be more aesthetic than substantive. It's not entirely clear which (if any) of the existing "maze of agreements" (and as a consequence some of the "battalions of lawyers") are expected to disappear.

The big difference for the train operators is that unlike the previous franchise agreements whereby the franchisees took the farebox risk, the new PSCs will basically be managed concessions under which operators will be paid a fixed premium over their costs in exchange for delivering a detailed service specification determined by GBR. It is conceivable that the PSCs may incorporate the (currently separate)
track access agreements — maybe that is the reason for all this secrecy?
That’s why it’s so important to get on the TOC nationalisation bill passed… imagine if that wrecking amendment had gone through. Assembling GBR starting with GA and absorbing all the good practices that comes with it would require quite a different strategy to starting with Avanti and being forced to come up with all sorts of stopgap solutions to its systematic performance issues.
I don't think your prediction of the way things will work maps to the Plan's aspirations.
 

Goldfish62

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The Williams Rail review was set up in 2018 to examine the future of the railways.

The result was published in May 2021 as the Williams-Shapps Plan for Rail.

It is now nearly 2025. Are you seriously trying to say that it's still necessary to keep the details under wraps? And it doesn't show much confidence in GBR if its remit and structure are dependent on one spending review.

I did not mention anything at all about electrification, but only the general cost base.

But, taking the bone, why do you think that further electrification will reduce the railways' total costs? Agreed that rolling stock maintenance costs may be reduced slightly (mainly concerning the power unit, most of the other kit is unaffected) and that nominally reliability should be higher than diesel traction but actual practice shows that there is little, if anything, in it. The costs of fuel for electric trains can be higher than diesel, look at the cost of Electricity for Traction (EC4T) supplied by Network Rail to the train and the costs of servicing the capital tied up in the overhead wires and power supply system before trains use them. There can be years between installation and use - and in the meantime the capital spent is simply adding to the costs. There are also costs incurred in maintenance of the power supply system - trying to avoid these costs is at least part of the reason that so many de-wiring incidents have occurred. Low voltage/high current third rail is notoriously inefficient — all those juicy I^2R losses — and the presence of the third rail adds considerably to track maintenance costs. The diesel carries all of its fuel with it in a steel tank permanently connected to the prime mover.


My understanding of the Williams-Shapps Plan was that there should be a new "guiding mind" of the railway, that is GBR: it is effectively a merger of the DfT's franchising function, the Rail Delivery Group and Network Rail.

There has been little of substance published since then which suggests that this arrangement will not come to pass — although there has been much hearsay and speculation. The published aim was for GBR to manage both the network infrastructure and a new generation of Passenger Service Contracts ("PSCs") granted to train operators. Ostensibly the logic is one of simplification and reduction of inefficiency. We'll see.

Changes in the details of the industry, however, are less obvious. The current and future industry diagrams in the Plan show differences which seem to me to be more aesthetic than substantive. It's not entirely clear which (if any) of the existing "maze of agreements" (and as a consequence some of the "battalions of lawyers") are expected to disappear.

The big difference for the train operators is that unlike the previous franchise agreements whereby the franchisees took the farebox risk, the new PSCs will basically be managed concessions under which operators will be paid a fixed premium over their costs in exchange for delivering a detailed service specification determined by GBR. It is conceivable that the PSCs may incorporate the (currently separate)
track access agreements — maybe that is the reason for all this secrecy?

I don't think your prediction of the way things will work maps to the Plan's aspirations.
The SOS reported to the Transport Select Committee last week that the future structure of our railways and role of GBR will be be revealed in a consultation document soon after the current bill receives Royal Assent. The enabling bill itself is due to be introduced to Parliament in the summer.

So really not long to wait now.
 

duffield

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The Williams Rail review was set up in 2018 to examine the future of the railways.

The result was published in May 2021 as the Williams-Shapps Plan for Rail.

It is now nearly 2025. Are you seriously trying to say that it's still necessary to keep the details under wraps? And it doesn't show much confidence in GBR if its remit and structure are dependent on one spending review.

...
No, I didn't say and wasn't trying to say it was necessary. I don't actually have enough information to say whether or not there may be good reasons to keep any or some details under wraps. Generally I'm in favour of the maximum possible openness from government and would like any secrecy to be fully justified.

All I was doing was responding to the comment stating that the government's entire plan seemed to amount to a piece of paper with the word "nationalise" on it, which seems absurd. I repeat that I cannot believe that, for example, Peter Hendy's entire plan consists of this one word, and that he must have some fairly well developed ideas.

As for the spending review, the first spending review of a entirely new government is likely to have extremely wide reaching effects across every aspect of government, so I would say we have insufficient information to determine what its effects might or might not be on GBR.
 

coppercapped

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The SOS reported to the Transport Select Committee last week that the future structure of our railways and role of GBR will be be revealed in a consultation document soon after the current bill receives Royal Assent. The enabling bill itself is due to be introduced to Parliament in the summer.

So really not long to wait now.
Clement Attlee won a General Election in July 1945 and created the Welfare State by setting up National Insurance in 1946 and the National Assistance Act of 1948. It also nationalised about a fifth of the economy:
  • hospitals;
  • coal;
  • railways;
  • canals;
  • docks and harbours;
  • road transport;
  • the Bank of England;
  • civil aviation;
  • external telecommunications (Cable and Wireless);
  • electricity generation and distribution;
  • gas; and
  • steel.
All this in less than 3 years.

Why, in the name of your deity of choice, has GBR taken so long...?
 
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