Time restrictions if services are running late

[Baggers]

If I hold a ticket with specific time restrictions, for example, a Rover ticket such as the "East Midlands Rover 3 in 7 days" which allows travel "By any train after 09.00 Monday - Friday.", what happens if services are running late?

So imagine that I'm waiting at (say) Milton Keynes Central for the first after 9 o'clock (Northbound) service [09:19] and there have been problems so that (say) the 08:50 scheduled service is running 14 minutes late and rolls into the platform after 09:00 ... does this mean that I am valid to leap on?

Thanks in advance.

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

If I hold a ticket with specific time restrictions, for example, a Rover ticket such as the "East Midlands Rover 3 in 7 days" which allows travel "By any train after 09.00 Monday - Friday.", what happens if services are running late?

So imagine that I'm waiting at (say) Milton Keynes Central for the first after 9 o'clock (Northbound) service [09:19] and there have been problems so that (say) the 08:50 scheduled service is running 14 minutes late and rolls into the platform after 09:00 ... does this mean that I am valid to leap on?

Thanks in advance.

Whilst that particular wording of the time restriction is vague as to whether it refers to the scheduled or actual departure time, most time restrictions refer to the scheduled departure time, and so, short of specific authority from an authorised person (i.e. most likely from the station manager or train guard) it would probably not be a wise idea to go onto a late-running service that, if on schedule, would not be permitted. If you do and have your ticket checked by an observant ticket inspector/RPI, you might get into trouble.

The general aim of such restrictions is (apart from revenue maximisation) to reduce loading on busy trains, so 09:00 is only an arbitrary threshold they've come up with. Most people who originally intended to catch the 08:50 would still catch it if it were 15 minutes late, so in my mind the restriction sticks as its raison d'être is still there.

 

[WelshBluebird]

I'd hope common sense would be used.

In some circumstances, delays of 1 hour or more are not unheard of. And I'd be amazed if a ToC tried to enforce off peak restrictions based on departure time if the service was departing an hour after the end of the peak restriction!

In other circumstances, all trains on a route are delayed, is a passenger expected to wait for the next train and be delayed, even though they could have caught the earlier train that may have actually departed at the same time as their planned train should have?

 

[Spoorslag '70]

The wording of the restriction (according to brfares.com or http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/B3)

Not valid on trains timed to
depart after 04:29 and before
09:00.

 

[talldave]

What does "timed" mean? The word "scheduled" would be unambiguous, but I find "timed" somewhat vague. A late running 08:50 train, shown as arriving at 09:02 on platform indicators is "timed" for 09:02?

 

[bb21]

What does "timed" mean? The word "scheduled" would be unambiguous, but I find "timed" somewhat vague. A late running 08:50 train, shown as arriving at 09:02 on platform indicators is "timed" for 09:02?

I think that interpretation is pushing it a bit.

That said, I am broadly in agreement with WelshBluebird on this one.

 

[185143]

I suspect this is a situation where if you were to ask the guard they'd almost certainly let you. However if you just boarded regardless, and met an RPI, they'd throw the book at you.

 

[Rover]

I suspect this is a situation where if you were to ask the guard they'd almost certainly let you. However if you just boarded regardless, and met an RPI, they'd throw the book at you.

But what if you asked the guard and he said ok but an RPI got on and wanted to charge you excess? Would you have a leg to stand on?

 

[robbeech]

But what if you asked the guard and he said ok but an RPI got on and wanted to charge you excess? Would you have a leg to stand on?

This is only the same argument as any other decision made by a guard. If the guard gives you permission to travel on that train with that ticket then you have permission. If another member of staff then tells you you can’t and tries to charge you extra you should tell them you have been given permission by the guard. It’s very unlikely (but not unheard of) that a guard will go back on their word and lie when asked by the other member of staff. You would have to watch out for crew changes though.

Back to this topic. One phrase that often gets used here is that timing restrictions are based upon the ticket and not the train. Most rover restrictions say any train after 0845, or 0930, or similar. It’s didficult to know what is implied here but the wording seems vague enough to accept that at and after the given time you are allowed to board any train (following any other restrictions). They don’t specifically state any train scheduled or timed to depart, just a straight forward time restriction.
So my opinion is that if the wording is a straightforward any train after a given time you should be allowed to board any train after that time. A copy of the restrictions might be handy to keep on you if you feel you might have issues.