Ticket snatching by machines

[Bayum]

Got into London Kings Cross, put my ticket into the barrier, and it’s been eaten. I stopped anyone else coming through so I could get someone from the station to open the machine, but Was told I couldn’t have it back. I explained that it wasn’t to recoup my ticket from the hospital, but the woman told me that this wasn’t doable, that she was very sorry and that was that. When I said that previous visits to London hadn’t resulted in my ticket being taken and kept by the machine, she said that some barriers took and kept, whereas other barriers didn’t, that staff had asked for the barriers to not ‘keep’ the ticket, but only a few had this update put in place.

Is this true? I don’t really know what to do now, aside from hope that the hospital will accept email confirmations and the ticket receipt with all the writing huddle down close together.

So a general warning to those who need to keep tickets to claim, and to go to staff to get through the barrier!

 

[AlterEgo]

It seems a little mean not to give the ticket back.

I always take photographs of paper tickets, when I use them.

 

[Gareth Marston]

Got into London Kings Cross, put my ticket into the barrier, and it’s been eaten. I stopped anyone else coming through so I could get someone from the station to open the machine, but Was told I couldn’t have it back. I explained that it wasn’t to recoup my ticket from the hospital, but the woman told me that this wasn’t doable, that she was very sorry and that was that. When I said that previous visits to London hadn’t resulted in my ticket being taken and kept by the machine, she said that some barriers took and kept, whereas other barriers didn’t, that staff had asked for the barriers to not ‘keep’ the ticket, but only a few had this update put in place.

Is this true? I don’t really know what to do now, aside from hope that the hospital will accept email confirmations and the ticket receipt with all the writing huddle down close together.

So a general warning to those who need to keep tickets to claim, and to go to staff to get through the barrier!

Golden Rule of claiming for rail travel - get a receipt in addition to your ticket. Ive done this since BR days and have never had a problem with tickets going inot barriers.

 

[johntea]

The barriers at Kings Cross were in use? You're a little late for April Fools Day

 

[LowLevel]

Depending on the location and barrier type it can be a real pain to extract the ticket - on ours they just fall into a tall metal bin and you end up with up to a few thousand tickets all over the floor while you try to find the right one.

 

[Stampy]

I get the same problem sometimes at King's Cross with a 1 Day Travelcard when travelling from PBO.

Get to the barriers, and "swipe" to exit - ticket retained* (or sometimes REFUSED).

*Ask nicely for ticket back, and get it back - ticket now refuses to work on Underground or any other ticket machine.....

Doesn't happen when I go from Bedford though.....

 

[Jonfun]

Officially a ticket remains the property of the railway and can be retained after completion of the journey.
In reality, the vast majority of staff receiving such a request from the passenger would just mark the ticket as having been used to the extent of it's validity and probably put a tear down the magstripe to stop it going through gates. You were probably just unlucky with your choice of inspector.

 

[al78]

I always get a receipt if I need to claim for travel expenses. My workplace technically doesn't accept used tickets, it has to be a proper receipt.

 

[Bletchleyite]

If you need to keep a ticket the best thing is to go to staff first and say so.

 

[DelW]

In my experience most barriers keep the ticket at the final destination. I tend to be surprised by the Waterloo barriers which return it (AIUI, as inbound tickets can be used from Waterloo East to London Bridge). I always use a manual gate if I want to retain a ticket, and it's rarely a problem.

 

[yorkie]

Got into London Kings Cross, put my ticket into the barrier, and it’s been eaten. I stopped anyone else coming through so I could get someone from the station to open the machine, but Was told I couldn’t have it back. I explained that it wasn’t to recoup my ticket from the hospital, but the woman told me that this wasn’t doable, that she was very sorry and that was that. When I said that previous visits to London hadn’t resulted in my ticket being taken and kept by the machine, she said that some barriers took and kept, whereas other barriers didn’t, that staff had asked for the barriers to not ‘keep’ the ticket, but only a few had this update put in place.

Is this true? I don’t really know what to do now, aside from hope that the hospital will accept email confirmations and the ticket receipt with all the writing huddle down close together.

So a general warning to those who need to keep tickets to claim, and to go to staff to get through the barrier!

King's Cross changed from returning tickets to retaining them, I can't remember when exactly, but relatively recently.

Do you need the physical original tickets? If not, my advice is to take a photograph before commencing travel.

 

[Mojo]

In my experience most barriers keep the ticket at the final destination. I tend to be surprised by the Waterloo barriers which return it (AIUI, as inbound tickets can be used from Waterloo East to London Bridge). I always use a manual gate if I want to retain a ticket, and it's rarely a problem.

King's Cross changed from returning tickets to retaining them, I can't remember when exactly, but relatively recently.

Do you need the physical original tickets? If not, my advice is to take a photograph before commencing travel.

Does it retain all tickets? As most tickets valid into Kings + are valid for onward travel to Old Street or Moorgate by LUL services.

 

[yorkie]

I've only tried it with Advance fares to London Terminals

 

[47513 Severn]

Does it retain all tickets? As most tickets valid into Kings + are valid for onward travel to Old Street or Moorgate by LUL services.

As the Moorgate line now has weekend services is it possible this 'easement' has been quietly removed? Is it even documented anywhere, it isn't really an inter-available route in the same way as Finsbury Park to King's Cross via LU or National Rail is.

 

[causton]

It also could be that they are moving away from station groups, and therefore a Virgin advance to London Kings X specifically would be retained and an Off-Peak Day Return to London Terminals would not?

 

[Mojo]

As the Moorgate line now has weekend services is it possible this 'easement' has been quietly removed? Is it even documented anywhere, it isn't really an inter-available route in the same way as Finsbury Park to King's Cross via LU or National Rail is.

The Through Ticketing (Non-Travelcard) Agreement treats it just the same as an Interavailable route and it is still listed in the appropriate books for LUL staff as being valid.

But, I would agree with you that it would be reasonable to remove this given that the line now has extended opening hours.

 

[westv]

The Kings X to Moorgate easement never seems to have been advertìsed widely. Obviously "they" would rather as few people as possible use it.

 

[Silver Cobra]

As the Moorgate line now has weekend services is it possible this 'easement' has been quietly removed? Is it even documented anywhere, it isn't really an inter-available route in the same way as Finsbury Park to King's Cross via LU or National Rail is.

I don't know about when travelling into London, but the interavailability/easement still definitely exists in the reverse direction. I posted a thread just over two weeks ago about the subject (using the Northern Line to travel between Moorgate and King's Cross on a Sunday), and my experience was that the return portion of my Biggleswade to London Terminals ticket worked in the barriers at Moorgate, King's Cross St. Pancras and King's Cross NR. It would be strange for the interavailability to only work in one direction rather than both.

Maybe a reason why the interavailabiltiy still exists despite the regular Moorgate line service during evenings and weekends is for passengers travelling with VTEC/Grand Central/Hull Trains, who's services do not stop at Finsbury Park.

 

[TheDavibob]

Does it retain all tickets? As most tickets valid into Kings + are valid for onward travel to Old Street or Moorgate by LUL services.

I've made recent trips to London Terminals and it doesn't retain them.

 

[Hadders]

Are VTEC Advance tickets issued to 'Kings Cross' or to 'London Terminals'? If it is KGX then this will explain why they are retained. London Terminals tickets shouldn't be retained as the ticket will have onward validity to Moorgate. I am travelling to London tomorrow using a Stevenage-London Terminals ticket so I will check (when I travelled last week the ticket was still returned).

The inter-availability is required now more than ever. Consider passengers travelling stations on the Hertford Loop services at weekends who need to get to Kings Cross - they will now travel to Highbury & Islington and onwards to Kings Cross via the Victoria Line.

 

[Mojo]

Even if the ticket was issued to Kings + then it is still valid on LUL services to Moorgate or Old Street.

 

[Hadders]

But, I would agree with you that it would be reasonable to remove this given that the line now has extended opening hours.

This would be a problem for passengers whose trains don't stop at Finsbury Park - there are many of these in the peaks. Also, forcing more passengers onto the Moorgate trains at Finsbury Park would not be a good idea in the peaks - they're wedged enough as it is.

The Kings X to Moorgate easement never seems to have been advertìsed widely. Obviously "they" would rather as few people as possible use it.

I agree. There were even posters at Kings Cross St Pancras station last year in connection with the London Bridge works erroneously claiming that tickets issued to 'London Terminals' were not valid at that station.

 

[greatkingrat]

Even if the ticket was issued to Kings + then it is still valid on LUL services to Moorgate or Old Street.

No it wouldn't, the easement specifically refers to tickets valid "Between Finsbury Park and London Terminals", which doesn't cover a ticket issued to King's Cross specifically.

 

[Mojo]

No it wouldn't, the easement specifically refers to tickets valid "Between Finsbury Park and London Terminals", which doesn't cover a ticket issued to King's Cross specifically.

I provided a link to the applicable document above above and it says "Between Finsbury Park...and King’s Cross..."

 

[jon0844]

Is it me or does the title of this thread suggest gatelines have become sentient and are now fighting back, starting with the snatching of tickets today and possibly crushing people in the gates tomorrow.

Stephen King is hopefully working on the film as I speak.

I've never liked Cubic gates and always thought they were evil.

 

[talldave]

Is it me or does the title of this thread suggest gatelines have become sentient and are now fighting back, starting with the snatching of tickets today and possibly crushing people in the gates tomorrow.

Stephen King is hopefully working on the film as I speak.

I've never liked Cubic gates and always thought they were evil.

I thought it was about people having tickets stolen from them after purchasing from TVMs!!

 

[DarloRich]

I always get a receipt if I need to claim for travel expenses. My workplace technically doesn't accept used tickets, it has to be a proper receipt.

my former work place would only accept a train ticket and receipt for a valid expenses claim. It was a clear opportunity to skimp on expenses.

 

[jon0844]

I thought it was about people having tickets stolen from them after purchasing from TVMs!!

Let's face it. No TVM is ever going to become sentient.

 

[cuccir]

I do think that this is one of the small ways in which the fragmentation of the rail industry produces passenger unfriendly outcomes.

In parts of the country you could travel very frequently and not know that barriers can keep tickets, because locally they have not been set to do so.First time it happened to me I was very confused! Of course the railway companies are in their rights to keep tickets, but a simple sign where barriers may swallow tickets or standard practice across the country should not be much to ask...

 

[mallard]

Of course, having the barriers "snatch" tickets also helps the train companies cut down on those pesky Delay Repay claims when the train's late, but I'm sure that's not the intention behind it at all...