Ticket machines and off-peak fares

[Markdvdman]

It's not so much fair/unfair as realistic. Staff can't be expected to know every split on every route that they may work, and there is also the argument that if someone else happens to know of an even cheaper way of doing it, staff could be criticised for not offering that option as well.

Even the very knowledgeable experts on this forum can't guarantee that a particular fare is the cheapest, as witnessed in just about every fares thread!

I am not saying they should know but most staff I see use the same routes! It is not rocket science - what I have mentioned are basic not complicated splits. I am not daft - I know it is a complex minefield but really it is not hard to work out. I do suspect it is revenue protection as an earlier op said, but staff at the station agree with me it is crazy!

The fact is, this insane split option needs to stop, and best price should be for a direct journey. Who devises this insane complexity I wonder?????

 

[barrykas]

The fact is, this insane split option needs to stop, and best price should be for a direct journey. Who devises this insane complexity I wonder?????

In some cases, it's been inherited from British Rail days. Other factors include journeys crossing TOC boundaries, or PTE areas, or London, or the fare between one pair of stations being priced by a former InterCity® TOC with the fare to the next station being priced by a former Provincial or NSE TOC...or a simple mistake on the part of the relevant Pricing Manager.

As an example, Gerrards Cross to Kidderminster has three routes, all priced by Virgin West Coast: VWC & Connections (Advance Fares via London), Birmingham (valid via London) and Not London. Off-Peak Returns are £51.30 for "route Birmingham", £45.80 for Not London; Anytime Returns are £168/£145.

Go three stations further down the line to High Wycombe, however, and the "Not London" fare is priced by Chiltern. Off-Peak Returns are £54.40 for "route Birmingham" and £36.40 for Not London, and Anytime Returns are £172/£55.

Cheers,

Barry

 

[Markdvdman]

In some cases, it's been inherited from British Rail days. Other factors include journeys crossing TOC boundaries, or PTE areas, or London, or the fare between one pair of stations being priced by a former InterCity® TOC with the fare to the next station being priced by a former Provincial or NSE TOC...or a simple mistake on the part of the relevant Pricing Manager.

As an example, Gerrards Cross to Kidderminster has three routes, all priced by Virgin West Coast: VWC & Connections (Advance Fares via London), Birmingham (valid via London) and Not London. Off-Peak Returns are £51.30 for "route Birmingham", £45.80 for Not London; Anytime Returns are £168/£145.

Go three stations further down the line to High Wycombe, however, and the "Not London" fare is priced by Chiltern. Off-Peak Returns are £54.40 for "route Birmingham" and £36.40 for Not London, and Anytime Returns are £172/£55.

Cheers,

Barry

Exactly - inheritance is no excuse in this age of technology.

It seems like a throwback to steam.

It is overcomplicated and unnecessary.

Ridiculous as people should get the cheapest fare easily without searching for complex combinations!

 

[island]

To address your points,

• A delayed train does not automatically become off-peak. It has been known, however, in times of significant disruption, for TOCs to relax their ticketing restrictions. It is very unlikely this would happen if the 0928 came in at 0933 (when 0930 was the end of the peak for that flow).

• 
  That depends on the wording of the restriction. Some restrictions are worded in terms of trains "timed to depart" or "scheduled to depart/arrive", whereas others are worded as "departing", and a few are in terms of "boarding at".
  
  

  [*]Guards are not supposed to offer ticket splits, unless asked. Even then, as you're buying on the train, they'd be doing you a favour, and it is not a right. (Though if you'd boarded at an unstaffed station that does not have a TVM I believe you should have a far higher chance of success with the request).

I think a guard is obliged to give you a split if the ticket office was closed at your departure station.

I am not saying they should know but most staff I see use the same routes! It is not rocket science - what I have mentioned are basic not complicated splits. I am not daft - I know it is a complex minefield but really it is not hard to work out. I do suspect it is revenue protection as an earlier op said, but staff at the station agree with me it is crazy!

The fact is, this insane split option needs to stop, and best price should be for a direct journey. Who devises this insane complexity I wonder?????

One of the main reasons splits might be cheaper is because of condition 19b. When you split, you're often restricting yourself to stopping services.

 

[Markdvdman]

I have been able to buy split tickets at the station and on the train.

I have never been refused (even though in the past I have heard they did not like it).

I suspect as you have the knowledge, they are not going to refuse.

I may be wrong - can any guard clarify?

 

[Greenback]

I don't think anyone will dispute that the fares system is over complicated!

You won't (or shouldn't) be refused any ticket combination you ask for. I don't see how it can work any other way, really, given the enormous complexity of the system. Most staff see nothing at all wrong with split tickets, and I don't see why someone should be advantaged or disadvantaged by randomly getting a member of staff who may or may not know about a particular split for a particular flow.