Ticket Irregularity

[rocket_Taupe]

Hi,
Ive had an issue boarding a TPE service when plans changed last minute jumping on the train and went to purchase a ticket (the conductor was asking for tickets as the train was leaving the platform) i explained i needed to buy a ticket on RST site but she refused. I presented my card which at my own fault was my expired one but i explained i could get someone to facetime or send a photo of my in date one that was at my house. She refused. I tried to show her an email of conformation of my 2026 pass but still wouldnt accepet it. After this i apologised and bought a ticket directly from the conductor. She then came back and was questioning where my place of work is and that she might report me. Weeks later she did report and had my RST facilities removed for life. Whilst i accept it was my responsibility to have my correct pass, These sanctions seem very harsh for a first time offence. Could anyone suggest if it is worth appealing or give any advise.

 

[AlterEgo]

Firstly, what has your union rep said? Have you asked them? That's your first port of call. The sanctions available to RSTL are here: https://www.raildeliverygroup.com/rst/travel-irregularities.html#TIPW

As you can see, they had little option under their policy but to permanently remove your facilities. The policy is draconian but the benefit is extremely valuable and this is part and parcel of being rail staff.

 

[rocket_Taupe]

Ive spoken with them and agree its harsh as also gone to investigation with my employer.

I know of people who have forgotten theirs and had a warning email from RST. I mean its 2026 why are these not digital now. I appriecate it was my mistake but the sanctions do seem very harsh!

 

[ModernRailways]

There has to be more to this, you say the guard refused to sell you a ticket but then that they did sell you a ticket, did this sale happen on the train or off the train?
Did you pay for a priv ticket or full standard fare when the guard charged you?
Did you still board the train after being told no and without a valid ticket? If so, which station (if you don’t want to say the station then did it have a ticket office?)
Is there a reason they asked for your details? TOC etc?

From what you have said, I would argue this isn’t misuse of staff travel facilities as you have made a simple mistake, picked up an expired pass in error, and when you have went to use it realised the error and spoken to a staff member. This wouldn’t (shouldn’t?) see your staff facilities removed.

 

[rocket_Taupe]

I had boarded the train before purchasing a ticket (Was on the phone whilst running to catch the train, Had to get back earlier due to personel reasons) When they asked for the ticket i ended my call and said i needed to purchase on on the RST site and i had my card out. She stated my card was my expired one and i was not to purchase a ticket on RST. As i knew this was my error i didnt argue i purchased one directly full fare from the TPE Conductor who then initially said she wouldnt report me and after apporaching the conudctor to thank them for their understanding and once again apologise she then decided to report me anyway. This ticket was £1.50 on the RST site i would not risk potenitally mt job and my Priv ticket on purpose.

i agree it was my responsiibilty but it was a genuine mistake and i feel a ban would be more fair than a full permanent withdrawl.

Just wondering if it is worth fighting? They have said they wont except any excuses such as late etc - Just seems harsh in my opinon.

 

[ModernRailways]

If you were to appeal it then you would need to go down the route of ‘I picked up the expired travel pass in error, when I realised I paid the full standard fare’ but this relies on you having told us what actually happened in full.
Do you still have the ticket you paid for/a receipt/bank statement? Paying for a full fare ticket should serve as good evidence.
The main reason for a full lifetime ban would be serious misuse, along with a TIR having been submitted, this again would imply there is a lot more to this than you are letting on.

One further thing is, do you hold a ‘normal’ priv or is it the Network Rail ‘RST online’ one?

Speak with your union reps, give them all the information, your management will investigate and you will likely have a meeting with them. They will relay that meeting back to RST themselves.

 

[Haywain]

The main reason for a full lifetime ban would be serious misuse, along with a TIR having been submitted, this again would imply there is a lot more to this than you are letting on.

Or some previous records of misuse.

 

[rocket_Taupe]

RST online.
All the information is supplied. If im honest its all blown out of proportion. Yeah i have a copy of my bank transaction paying the full fare price. There is literally nothing more to say it was just a genuine mistake. All has been investigated and no further action work wise which is a relief and the stress of that has gone.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Apr 2026 ==

Had no previous issues at all.

Or some previous records of misuse.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Apr 2026 ==

If you were to appeal it then you would need to go down the route of ‘I picked up the expired travel pass in error, when I realised I paid the full standard fare’ but this relies on you having told us what actually happened in full.
Do you still have the ticket you paid for/a receipt/bank statement? Paying for a full fare ticket should serve as good evidence.
The main reason for a full lifetime ban would be serious misuse, along with a TIR having been submitted, this again would imply there is a lot more to this than you are letting on.

One further thing is, do you hold a ‘normal’ priv or is it the Network Rail ‘RST online’ one?

Speak with your union reps, give them all the information, your management will investigate and you will likely have a meeting with them. They will relay that meeting back to RST themselves.

There is no more than i have said. The conductor was awful, Mentioned about salaries in ROCs etc Was not confrentational or anything because if i was this could affect my job it was just a genuine mistake. Hold my hands up and said i had the out of date pass but tried to explain and prove i have an in date one and my account wouldnt let me log in if i didnt have one and i purchased one directly straight away.

 

[AlterEgo]

Do you have the RST Online card? Are you Network Rail staff?

 

[SuspectUsual]

If you were to appeal it then you would need to go down the route of ‘I picked up the expired travel pass in error, when I realised I paid the full standard fare’ but this relies on you having told us what actually happened in full.

There’s also the issue of boarding without a ticket, which (as an outsider) I could imagine might be looked on rather sternly by the authorities.

 

[rocket_Taupe]

Do you have the RST Online card? Are you Network Rail staff?

I did but when the report came in i was instructed to cut my 2026 one up into 4 and then they disabled my account. yes nwr

 

[furlong]

You should definitely appeal - there is nothing to lose - but please answer the remaining questions, including which station it was and whether there was a ticket office and whether it was open at the time you travelled.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Apr 2026 ==

I think the alleged dishonesty is twofold.

Firstly, knowingly travelling with, and presenting, an expired card. (The key word you need to push back against is 'knowingly'. How is it possible you didn't know?)
If there was an open ticket office and you truly didn't know it had expired, additionally failing to purchase before boarding.(edit: online-only facilities - see next message. "buy before you board" still relevant.)

Secondly explicitly intending to purchase and use an online ticket knowing that it was invalid because you weren't in physical possession of the item required to make it valid, and by the sound of it, attempting to persuade an official to break the rules for your benefit. I think it's likely to be that last point that would be what did for you.

 

[AlterEgo]

You should definitely appeal - there is nothing to lose - but please answer the remaining questions, including which station it was and whether there was a ticket office and whether it was open at the time you travelled.

In terms of the irregularity these aren't relevant. They have a RST Online card and may only purchase online. Hence, they have travelled ticketless and presented an expired pass, both of which are grounds to have travel facilities removed for life.

I don't really agree with the harshness of RSTL here - that is so severe a penalty (the travel facilities are worth thousands of pounds to some people) that many people will just leave the industry, and likely self-defeating. But they have acted in line with their policy.

An appeal has to be made to the OP's employer.

 

[ModernRailways]

RST online.

There is no more than i have said. The conductor was awful, Mentioned about salaries in ROCs etc Was not confrentational or anything because if i was this could affect my job it was just a genuine mistake. Hold my hands up and said i had the out of date pass but tried to explain and prove i have an in date one and my account wouldnt let me log in if i didnt have one and i purchased one directly straight away.

Okay, so really it doesn’t matter that you showed an expired pass, you cannot buy a ticket on the train or at a ticket office (I am aware that a lot of staff will bend the rules but officially it’s a no).

You hold an RST online staff travel pass, you boarded a train without a valid ticket (as it was TPE and you’ve not stated the station I will assume it was a station with a ticket office), when the guard has approached you, you have asked to purchase a PRIV rate ticket from them which is against the T&Cs of your travel facilities, offering to purchase one online after boarding a train is equally not allowed. To add to this, the pass you presented was expired, and you were asking to show a photo of your current pass to gain access to a heavily discounted ticket. You have then paid for a full fare ticket but the guard has taken details and forwarded this on possibly thinking they’re preventing fraudulent use of a pass.

I would agree that this may seem overly harsh, however, you know the rules. If you knew you could catch an earlier train you should have logged in to RST and bought your ticket on the way into the station, it doesn’t take long to do. You should have prioritised purchasing a ticket versus your phone call.

I am unsure why salaries in ROCs would come up, and saying the guard was awful when they are doing their job? It is entirely possible that the way you acted and dealt with the situation is what prompted them to flag it for further investigation, if they think there may be some fraud at play then it’s best to flag it up, especially with staff passes as these offer significant savings.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Apr 2026 ==

All has been investigated and no further action work wise which is a relief and the stress of that has gone.

It may be worth your while to see if your managers and union are able to assist you with RST, even if it means a temporary ban with a marker on your file.

 

[gembercannelle]

Hence, they have travelled ticketless and presented an expired pass, both of which are grounds to have travel facilities removed for life.

Do you really mean to say that forgetting a card accidentally at home is a valid ground to have travel facilities removed for life?

 

[ModernRailways]

Do you really mean to say that forgetting a card accidentally at home is a valid ground to have travel facilities removed for life?

OP has in theory breached a few of the rules, and has ticked a few of the boxes for removal namely;

• Using a card, pass or ticket beyond availability.
• Travelling without a valid ticket.

It could also be argued by RST that by attempting to use a photo of their current pass they have also ‘attempted to use a forgery of a card, pass or ticket (includes a photocopy of the original).’ It is unlikely that they would do so, as the pass is issued and valid but is definitely an additional point of note.

 

[gembercannelle]

OP has in theory breached a few of the rules, and has ticked a few of the boxes for removal namely;

• Using a card, pass or ticket beyond availability.
• Travelling without a valid ticket.

It could also be argued by RST that by attempting to use a photo of their current pass they have also ‘attempted to use a forgery of a card, pass or ticket (includes a photocopy of the original).’ It is unlikely that they would do so, as the pass is issued and valid but is definitely an additional point of note.

They have not actually used the card because they paid the full fare. As far as I am aware, travelling without ticket should result in Penalty Fare, not in a life ban. Furthermore, they actually do have the card in their possession and are entitled to benefits. They have not forged anything. It seems odd to punish an attempt in the same way as the one would punish the actual wrongdoing.

 

[furlong]

If it was a gated station that's a further problem.
Was the destination gated?

Also was the OP wearing anything at the time that identified them as a railway employee?

They have not actually used the card because they paid the full fare. As far as I am aware, travelling without ticket should result in Penalty Fare, not in a life ban. Furthermore, they actually do have the card in their possession and are entitled to benefits. They have not forged anything. It seems odd to punish an attempt in the same way as the one would punish the actual wrongdoing.

They boarded without a ticket in what looks like an attempt to avoid paying for a short journey? Then they attempted to persuade the conductor to allow them to purchase and travel on a ticket they both knew would not be valid? That's dishonesty/corruption. The conductor correctly refused to go along with this scheme and reported the attempt?

 

[MotCO]

They have not actually used the card because they paid the full fare. As far as I am aware, travelling without ticket should result in Penalty Fare, not in a life ban. Furthermore, they actually do have the card in their possession and are entitled to benefits. They have not forged anything. It seems odd to punish an attempt in the same way as the one would punish the actual wrongdoing.

But they did try to use it, and persisted in trying to get the guard to accept an email regarding the pass, rather than immediately accept that they didn't have a valid card in their possession and have to buy an undiscounted ticket.

 

[ModernRailways]

They have not actually used the card because they paid the full fare. As far as I am aware, travelling without ticket should result in Penalty Fare, not in a life ban. Furthermore, they actually do have the card in their possession and are entitled to benefits. They have not forged anything. It seems odd to punish an attempt in the same way as the one would punish the actual wrongdoing.

They attempted to use an expired pass, they then tried to use a photo and email of the current pass. These passes are issued specifically with the caveat they can only be used online and not on train or at booking offices.
Guards don’t issue penalty fares, they would issue a TIR which is what appears to have happened here.

Had OP not shown their pass and just asked to buy a full fare ticket then they wouldn’t be in this position.

 

[gembercannelle]

They attempted to use an expired pass, they then tried to use a photo and email of the current pass. These passes are issued specifically with the caveat they can only be used online and not on train or at booking offices.
Guards don’t issue penalty fares, they would issue a TIR which is what appears to have happened here.

Had OP not shown their pass and just asked to buy a full fare ticket then they wouldn’t be in this position.

So the OP should have said "I don't have a ticket. I did not have time to buy one because of an emergency at home and I had to rush. I am going to XX. I would like to buy a full fare ticket. This is my bank card." and there would be no consequences.
There appears to be a confusion between an enquiry about possibility to use the discount they are fully entitled to and an attempt. I still don't see how this is system is fair with respect to genuine mistakes.

 

[Fokx]

So the OP should have said "I don't have a ticket. I did not have time to buy one because of an emergency at home and I had to rush. I am going to XX. I would like to buy a full fare ticket. This is my bank card." and there would be no consequences.

Not true because it actually sounds like a revenue officer and not a conductor and they still would have potentially been issued with a penalty fare or ticket irregularity report.

There appears to be a confusion between an enquiry about possibility to use the discount they are fully entitled to and an attempt. I still don't see how this is system is fair with respect to genuine mistakes.

The weren't entitled to any discount as it was only available by booking through the online staff travel website BEFORE travel, and they also did not have the valid accompanying "Railcard" (RSTL online photo card) required either which is scanned on Transpennine Express so would have been in the same situation regardless.

 

[Trainman40083]

Two issues.. This staff travel card that has expired.. Did that expire on 30th June 2025, as all the ones I have had run from April 1st to 30th June, the following year. Do priv tickets have to be bought on line now, where travel is from a station that doesn't have a ticket office. I know you can't buy them from the ticket machines......

 

[gembercannelle]

Not true because it actually sounds like a revenue officer and not a conductor and they still would have potentially been issued with a penalty fare or ticket irregularity report.

I think the OP would happily pay the Penalty Fare. It's just the removal of facility for life seems to be rather unfair.

 

[saismee]

Two issues.. This staff travel card that has expired.. Did that expire on 30th June 2025, as all the ones I have had run from April 1st to 30th June, the following year. Do priv tickets have to be bought on line now, where travel is from a station that doesn't have a ticket office. I know you can't buy them from the ticket machines......

It depends on when it is issued. Everyone at my TOC has a 31/10/26 expiry date.

No, they don't have to be purchased online  unless using the RST Online card which OP held.

 

[AlterEgo]

Not true because it actually sounds like a revenue officer and not a conductor and they still would have potentially been issued with a penalty fare or ticket irregularity report.

No, this sounds like it's a conductor. They are perfectly capable of reporting travel irregularities and can do so. No witness statement need be taken.

 

[Haywain]

Do priv tickets have to be bought on line now, where travel is from a station that doesn't have a ticket office. I know you can't buy them from the ticket machines..

Network Rail staff have RST Online Cards, which, as per the clue in the name, can only be used online.

 

[SwindonManor]

A shame. They are strict with those passes. It's annoying how some conductors tend yo be fairly strict with the rules. Don't get me wrong, rules are there and the out of date pass was an error, but you offered to show your in date pass to them - they've probably banned you for life because let's face it the less free/¼ rate travel they have to give out, the better for their profit unfortunately. Hope it gets sorted.

 

[Trainman40083]

It depends on when it is issued. Everyone at my TOC has a 31/10/26 expiry date.

No, they don't have to be purchased online  unless using the RST Online card which OP held.

Thanks for that. I'd never heard of them.