Ticket checks at Euston

[Hellfire]

Why do Virgin have gateline staff checking tickets on some trains at Euston but not on others?

I normally get the 1630 to Preston and tickets are always checked at the gates before boarding. This despite the fact that the service runs non-stop to Preston so you would have thought the TM would have had plenty of time to do a check on the train. That has never happened in my experience.

Today I caught the 1330 and there were no ticket checks on the gate but the TM did come round between Euston and Rugby.

How do they decide which trains they are going to check before boarding?

 

[Tetchytyke]

They normally do most of their checks on the peak trains, to try and stop people with off peak tickets from boarding. That's my experience anyway.

It swings both ways. It's irritating to queue but last time I was there the bloke in front genuinely didn't realise his off peak ticket was not valid. Had he been stopped by the TM he'd have been charged a massive excess fare, so the barrier saved him.

I don't mind having my ticket checked before boarding, to be honest, as I think it is fairer to the passenger who may make a mistake. Being denied boarding is better than an excess fare to a Virgin anytime fare...

 

[Hellfire]

Yes, that fact hadn't occurred to me. Thank you for pointing it out

 

[jopsuk]

Possibly at peak times there's also (not for the 1630 admittedly) more that might try to board with tickets not valid on Virgin?

 

[dk1]

Travelling on the 11.00 Manchester last Wednesday there where no ticket checks possibly due to the following 11.20 being cancelled due to earlier disruption. Train was only 9-cars but TM de-classified G due to crowding. He also performed a full ticket check following our SSO at MKC.

 

[Hellfire]

Possibly at peak times there's also (not for the 1630 admittedly) more that might try to board with tickets not valid on Virgin?

They seem to have an almost continuous series of announcements at Euston to the effect that London Midland tickets are not valid on Virgin services. That seems to mainly apply to trains travelling to the Midlands rather than the North West and Scotland.

I don't mind queueing for a ticket check at the gate....except when incidents like the woman in front of me suddenly realising there was a check and discovering she had put her ticket in her suitcase. As happened last week.

Wouldn't it be better to have barriers at Euston as there are at Liverpool Street?

 

[6Gman]

I think that presenting your ticket at a barrier, to a trained member of staff (G4S need not apply), should be the starting point for most long-distance journeys for many, many reasons. Some of which are outlined above.

 

[Gareth Marston]

I think that presenting your ticket at a barrier, to a trained member of staff (G4S need not apply), should be the starting point for most long-distance journeys for many, many reasons. Some of which are outlined above.

Off peak tickets returning to the Cambrian are valid in evenin peak so you need more than a half trained ill informed disinterested contractor on the gates to avoid delaying everyone as you argue with them that your ticket is valid.

 

[Brucey]

I always find it odd that Virgin usually only block the part of the ramp indicated for the next train. Often the other side of the ramp is left unblocked, allowing people who can't be bothered to queue free just to walk straight onto the platform without a ticket check :roll:

 

[David Goddard]

Don't mind at all having a manual check when boarding, but detest being processed in the same way when I have got off the train and want to get on my way.

 

[dk1]

I always find it odd that Virgin usually only block the part of the ramp indicated for the next train. Often the other side of the ramp is left unblocked, allowing people who can't be bothered to queue free just to walk straight onto the platform without a ticket check :roll:

I would locate snipers at the ramp bottom to counteract

 

[tractakid]

I had a Virgin Trains only travelcard last Saturday. I arrived at Euston and wanted to get to Willesden. The automatic barriers rejected the ticket, and the staff wanted to tell me that my ticket was for Virgin Trains only. After I said I wanted LO they let me through and told me to hurry up as the train was close to departure and in front of a LM train. Considering my ticket definitely has validity behind the barriers on the next train to depart (and also LM as far as Harrow and Wealdstone) how appropriate is an interview regarding my intentions? I made the train but it would have been annoying if I'd have missed it due to an unecessary interview!

As an aside I managed to see the same Southern service three times on my journey. I saw it depart Milton Keynes, I saw it around Hemel-ish as I zoomed past it, then I saw it again once I was at Willesden Junction. Annoyingly it did just beat me to my final destination Kensington (Olympia)!

 

[Simon11]

I would locate snipers at the ramp bottom to counteract

Good idea, you wouldn't need many as they could easily cover several platforms with good long distance equipment.

 

[Jona26]

I have wondered why some Virgin TMs bother to do a ticket check on departure from Euston when a barrier check is in operation.

A common sense approach last week following a barrier check at Euston was "As your tickets were checked at the barrier I won't need to check all tickets prior to Crewe but I will be checking First Class to ensure passengers are in the correct portion of the train.

Seems to make sense.

 

[Sacro]

I have wondered why some Virgin TMs bother to do a ticket check on departure from Euston when a barrier check is in operation.

Last time I was at Euston seeing a family member away, it seemed more than easy enough to just walk around the "barrier".

 

[Devon Type4]

My main gripe with ticket barriers is that if it is located at the destination of your ticket, i.e. not a station en route, then they always seem to suck your ticket into the machine and that's the last you see of it. What if I required the ticket as evidence for refund purposes? Or for claiming against expenses. As a railway photographer it makes it harder, as you can't pass between the gates on several occasions as you might want to if there are gaps in-between trains you wish to photograph.

 

[jopsuk]

The safe thing to do if you know you need to keep your ticket for a refund or for expenses is not to stick it in the barrier. Go to the attended gate. Easy. Tickets being retained by the barrier reduces littering.

As for the problem you describe as a photographer? Well, the ticket system, indeed the railway system, is designed for people just using it for transport. It is not designed nor run for enthusiasts. The train companies can and do make concessions for enthusiasts, but if it's a barriered and manned station, you're probably better off signing in or getting a platform ticket.

 

[Devon Type4]

Yea I had thought of that, but on the occasion in question there was no attendant around. Also one doesn't always know when you might need to have kept the ticket. I know the system isn't set up for photographs; although I can't help but feel a lot of the changes as far as ticket barriers, self service ticket machines cause rather a lot of annoyances to normal fare paying passengers. What happened to the guard, sorry, Train Managers? The best way to protect revenue would be for them to regularly walk the train, these days you can go ages without seeing one.

 

[maniacmartin]

The barriers should always be attended if they are in operation

 

[island]

Yea I had thought of that, but on the occasion in question there was no attendant around.

All ticket barriers have an attendant.

Can we please not start the debate on retaining tickets for expenses as that has been done to death in the recent past.

 

[krus_aragon]

All ticket barriers have an attendant.

... or are CCTV monitored by someone who can release the barriers on request. (Example: Cardiff Central's barriers in front of the elevators are monitored by the staff attending the main gateline at the other end of the concourse.)

 

[87 027]

In the past I have seen people on walk-up fares being denied access to peak time services to Liverpool/Manchester unless they also had a seat reservation - do they still do this? I can see the rationale, but it does go against the principle of flexibility...

 

[PermitToTravel]

?!!!
What is the rationale for this?

Were this me, and the ticket valid, I would be looking at suing the relevant TOC for my money back...

 

[142blue]

Why not send in a receipt as proof of purchase?

If you buy a ticket and hold no reservation it is no guarantee you will be able to travel if the train is busy/full.

Good luck suing them - let us know how you get on

 

[dk1]

TOCs have the right to introduce boarding controls at any time they deem they are required. You just have to get in line, wait & hope.

 

[Keith Jarrett]

They normally do most of their checks on the peak trains, to try and stop people with off peak tickets from boarding. That's my experience anyway.

It swings both ways. It's irritating to queue but last time I was there the bloke in front genuinely didn't realise his off peak ticket was not valid. Had he been stopped by the TM he'd have been charged a massive excess fare, so the barrier saved him.

I don't mind having my ticket checked before boarding, to be honest, as I think it is fairer to the passenger who may make a mistake. Being denied boarding is better than an excess fare to a Virgin anytime fare...

Let's just hope they have now received training on all the various "off peak" tickets that are valid in the peak hours. Or if not, have the means of checking the vailidity of all tickets.

A few years ago, I was travelling on one such ticket and was refused entry to the platform on account of it not being valid. Ticket checker on gate refused to consult anyone regarding the vailidty of the ticket. Checker would not even let me speak to TM to see whether TM was happy to have me on board his train with my off peak ticket. Instead I was redirected to the ticket office to get the ticket endorsed as being available for peak hour travel. Result was that I missed my train and incurred a consequential dealy of over two hour plus because of missed onward connections further north. The travel vouchers secured from Virgin for this error saw me enjoy many months of rail travel at no cost to me. I wonder if Virgin have learned anything since then?

Thankfully I now have a railcard so the railcard easement helps me out.

 

[island]

In the past I have seen people on walk-up fares being denied access to peak time services to Liverpool/Manchester unless they also had a seat reservation - do they still do this? I can see the rationale, but it does go against the principle of flexibility...

It does happen occasionally and seems appropriate to ensure the health, safety and comfort of all passengers.

Let's just hope they have now received training on all the various "off peak" tickets that are valid in the peak hours. Or if not, have the means of checking the vailidity of all tickets.

A few years ago, I was travelling on one such ticket and was refused entry to the platform on account of it not being valid. Ticket checker on gate refused to consult anyone regarding the vailidty of the ticket. Checker would not even let me speak to TM to see whether TM was happy to have me on board his train with my off peak ticket. Instead I was redirected to the ticket office to get the ticket endorsed as being available for peak hour travel. Result was that I missed my train and incurred a consequential dealy of over two hour plus because of missed onward connections further north. The travel vouchers secured from Virgin for this error saw me enjoy many months of rail travel at no cost to me. I wonder if Virgin have learned anything since then?

I think like everything else it is variable. I was for quite some time travelling frequently from London to Northampton, going northbound around 0800 and back a couple of days later in the afternoon. I was using an off-peak return from Northampton to London Terminals (which has no morning peak restriction) but just about every time I showed it to the Virgin ticket checkers they spent quite some time hemming and hawing. I eventually printed off the restriction code and other proof of the ticket's validity to have with me.