Thirteen coach train announcement at Charing Cross 26.1.2017

[Regeff]

At Charing Cross this evening, the 1654 to Dartford was diverted to run via Woolwich Arsenal rather than taking its normal Sidcup routing because of the derailment at Lewisham. The digitised station announcement system said (at least twice) that the train was formed of thirteen coaches. Has this been deliberately programmed into the system to "future proof" it? Or was someone having a little joke? - thirteen coach trains seem very unlikely ever to run.

Rather disappointingly, the reality was somewhat different. 8 coaches (2x465).

 

[Firesprite]

At Charing Cross this evening, the 1654 to Dartford was diverted to run via Woolwich Arsenal rather than taking its normal Sidcup routing because of the derailment at Lewisham. The digitised station announcement system said (at least twice) that the train was formed of thirteen coaches. Has this been deliberately programmed into the system to "future proof" it? Or was someone having a little joke? - thirteen coach trains seem very unlikely ever to run.

Rather disappointingly, the reality was somewhat different. 8 coaches (2x465).

The old boat trains to Dover Western Docks and Folkestone Harbour would have an class 419 Motor Luggage Van attached to the 12 car formation. So its been done before. With a mix of 3 and 4 car units you could end up with 13 car formation.

 

[Wilts Wanderer]

The old boat trains to Dover Western Docks and Folkestone Harbour would have an class 419 Motor Luggage Van attached to the 12 car formation. So its been done before. With a mix of 3 and 4 car units you could end up with 13 car formation.

I doubt it would fit in the platform at Charing Cross though! IIRC load 12 was a bit tight.

 

[N/100]

I doubt it would fit in the platform at Charing Cross though! IIRC load 12 was a bit tight.

IIRC the boat trains normally ran to Victoria

 

[philthetube]

I once rode down into Kent on car 9 of 8?

 

[Bromley boy]

Definitely "wishful thinking" for the foreseeable future!

Many of the metro platforms on Southeastern can't cope with more than 8 cars. Even 12 car operation is far from universal across the network.

Looking at London terminals, Charing Cross for example, only 1, 2 and 3 are genuine 12 car platforms. 4,5,6 cannot accommodate 12 car networkers (no functional sdo). Platforms 3 and 4 at Victoria are 8 car only. I'm not aware of any platforms at the three London terminals that can cope with more than 12 cars (obviously p2 at Victoria is very long but only equipped for 12 car operation).

Power supply/traction power index limitations are another factor. E.g, IIRC a 12 car networker formation can't be composed of 2*466 and 2*465 as the traction drawn by the 4 units is more than 3*465 and exceeds the maximum that the power supply can cope with, even though each formation is 12 cars long.

Plus, due to intermediate cab length, a 12 car train formed of several short units is a few feet longer than one formed of fewer (longer) units, if you catch my drift, so sighting of fixed 12 car stop marks/monitors would become very tricky indeed.

 

[Bromley boy]

I once rode down into Kent on car 9 of 8?

9, 6 and 7 car 375 formations are all possible due to the 375/3 3 car units. Again there are limits around this due to intermediate cab length and power supply - you'd never get a 12 car formation formed of 4 * 3 car units.

(Not sure about 9 of 8 though!!!)

 

[thedbdiboy]

The old boat trains to Dover Western Docks and Folkestone Harbour would have an class 419 Motor Luggage Van attached to the 12 car formation. So its been done before. With a mix of 3 and 4 car units you could end up with 13 car formation.

My thought exactly - that a ghostly SED MLV had been conjured up in the fog!

 

[Kite159]

9, 6 and 7 car 375 formations are all possible due to the 375/3 3 car units. Again there are limits around this due to intermediate cab length and power supply - you'd never get a 12 car formation formed of 4 * 3 car units.

(Not sure about 9 of 8 though!!!)

Although 12 car formation of 4x 377/3 on Southern are quite common

 

[Bletchleyite]

At Charing Cross this evening, the 1654 to Dartford was diverted to run via Woolwich Arsenal rather than taking its normal Sidcup routing because of the derailment at Lewisham. The digitised station announcement system said (at least twice) that the train was formed of thirteen coaches. Has this been deliberately programmed into the system to "future proof" it?

It can announce any number - presumably the highest one it normally needs to do is 59 for the minutes.

 

[philthetube]

9, 6 and 7 car 375 formations are all possible due to the 375/3 3 car units. Again there are limits around this due to intermediate cab length and power supply - you'd never get a 12 car formation formed of 4 * 3 car units.

(Not sure about 9 of 8 though!!!)

It was an 8 car train.

 

[meridian2]

Troop trains consisted of however many carriages could fit in a loop. C1980 I left St Pancras with a train for the north that stopped at most suburban stations as well as main line ones. There was a heavy snow fall and BR were desperate to get something moving, however slowly. Can't remember how long the train or journey was but it seemed to take the whole day.

 

[Deepgreen]

It can announce any number - presumably the highest one it normally needs to do is 59 for the minutes.

Yes, but why would a standard announcement suddenly include thirteen as a train length? Is the digital regime really so random as to permit this?

 

[GW43125]

Yes, but why would a standard announcement suddenly include thirteen as a train length? Is the digital regime really so random as to permit this?

numbers aren't done as train lengths, just the numbers are recorded and called up when necessary. Eg "platform (n) for the (N)n) service to (place), formed of (n) coaches.

I've heard of a 22-car 390 being advertised at MKC before, when two units were allocated by mistake.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Yes, but why would a standard announcement suddenly include thirteen as a train length? Is the digital regime really so random as to permit this?

Somebody slipped up when entering an unusual train length, most likely. It's not safety-critical information, nor is it information likely to do anything other than mildly annoy people standing in the wrong place, so I suspect it is not reviewed.