The ticket auditing department

[AY1975]

I believe that in the days when most staffed stations had permanently staffed ticket barriers, or at least ticket collection for disembarking passengers, collected tickets were forwarded to a ticket auditing department.

But what did this department actually do with the collected tickets, and when was the ticket auditing department wound up?

 

[6Gman]

I believe that in the days when most staffed stations had permanently staffed ticket barriers, or at least ticket collection for disembarking passengers, collected tickets were forwarded to a ticket auditing department. But what did this department actually do with the collected tickets, and when was the ticket auditing department wound up?

I certainly remember the pouches addressed to them that would gradually make their way across the system, occasionally raided by people wishing to add to their collections!

 

[Dr Hoo]

A key part of auditing was looking for handwritten semi-blank tickets, used for obscure journeys that didn’t have printed stock.

A corrupt clerk might sell such a ticket for, say, Dingwall from the south coast and charge the passenger the correct Mileage Book fare

However, the sheet for recording such issues might be filled out for a much closer and cheaper obscure destination and the clerk pocketing the difference. (There were plenty of variations, including collusion between a clerk and passenger to share the ‘saving’.)

When an auditor visited the issuing station, they could have a note of a few samples and check the details recorded for semi-blank number 1234 or whatever.

This is just one example. Particularly if a clerk was suspected, there would be a lookout for other possibilities such as tickets issued out of sequence.

 

[Cheshire Scot]

A key part of auditing was looking for handwritten semi-blank tickets, used for obscure journeys that didn’t have printed stock. A corrupt clerk might sell such a ticket for, say, Dingwall from the south coast and charge the passenger the correct Mileage Book fare. However the sheet for recording such issues might be filled out for a much closer and cheaper obscure destination and the clerk pocketing the difference. (There were plenty of variations, including collusion between a clerk and passenger to share the ‘saving’.)

One incident I recall was where an individual was using single sided carbon paper in the paper tickets pad - double-sided was used so that the issue detail would show both on the reverse side of the issued ticket and on the copy in the pad.

I am not sure of the exact detail, but audit picked up a ticket for a longer journey for which what should have been the carbon copy on the pad showed a local journey, the issuer of course having pocketed the difference and lost his job as a result.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

I remember my dad saying that tickets collected from his London Midland station were sent off to Derby for analysis (1960s).
I don't know if that was a national thing or just the LMR.

 

[Taunton]

A key part of auditing was looking for handwritten semi-blank tickets, used for obscure journeys that didn’t have printed stock

Now a relative in Taunton described their antics in WW2, they would book a return from York to obscure Holme-on-Spalding Moor, wherever that was.

The fare (old money) 1/9, had to be written out longhand on a paper ticket in black ink, and such a long station name didn't fit the box so written squashed and indecipherable. Paid for it.

They then amended the price with their black pen to 51/9.

The Travelling Ticket Inspector on the train asked, "Where's that ?". "Down the Minehead branch". The fare looked right, so "Oh, OK then, change at Taunton". They went down the side back exit at Taunton into the blackout. On the return, it was just a ticket to York.

 

[CW2]

The LM ticket audit department was at Derby. For WR, it was Paddington. For ER, it was (I believe) Stevenage. Not sure about SR and ScR.

The "raiding to add to their own collections" referred to by @6Gman above only tells part of the story. There was a prolific "recycling" movement in place amongst bashers, enabling (fraudulent) long journeys to be made with seemingly perfectly valid tickets.

I'm glad to say that old age means I have forgotten all the details ...

 

[etr221]

My understanding is that - certainly before nationalisation in 1948 - collected tickets for inter-company (or all?) journeys went through the RCH to enable fares for such to be correctly divided. But I don't know what the process actually was.

 

[WesternLancer]

Now a relative in Taunton described their antics in WW2, they would book a return at York to obscure Holme-on-Spalding Moor, wherever that was, fare (old money) 1/9, had to be written out longhand on a paper ticket in black ink, and such a long station name didn't fit the box so written squashed and indecipherable. Paid for it. They then amended the price with their black pen to 51/9. Travelling Ticket Inspector inspector in the train "Where's that ?". "Down the Minehead branch". Fare looked right, so "Oh, OK then, change at Taunton". Down side back exit at Taunton into the blackout. On the return it was just a ticket to York.

My ‘ pre grouping atlas and gazetteer’ (I’m sure we all know it) lists a Holme station on the Selby to Market Weighton line. OS map shows a settlement of Holme upon Spalding Moor near that line.

Maybe that was the full station name. Not too far from York.

 

[norbitonflyer]

My ‘ pre grouping atlas and gazetteer’ (I’m sure we all know it) lists a Holme station on the Selby to Market Weighton line. OS map shows a settlement of Holme upon Spalding Moor near that line.

Maybe that was the full station name. Not too far from York.

According to "Disused stations" its official name was Holme until 1923, and Holme Moor thereafter, to distinguish it from the other Holme on the LNER, on the former GNR network between Abbots Ripton and Peterborough.

Disused Stations: Holme Moor Station

 

[Grumpy]

The LM ticket audit department was at Derby. For WR it was Paddington. For ER it was (I believe) Stevenage. Not sure about SR and ScR.

Not sure about the ER but the NER Revenue Accountant’s office was at Newcastle, where such matters were dealt with.

 

[WesternLancer]

According to "Disused stations" its official name was Holme until 1923, and Holme Moor thereafter, to distinguish it from the other Holme on the LNER, on the former GNR network between Abbots Ripton and Peterborough.

Disused Stations: Holme Moor Station

Thanks. And also for the link. I forgot to look at that always superb website.

 

[Starmill]

The village still has the Holme-on-Spalding-Moor name today. It's about a third of the way from Howden to Driffield, along the A614.

 

[norbitonflyer]

The ticket auditing process is a key element of Dorothy Sayers' "Five Red Herrings", where a ticket, and the clips it has received, are crucial in establishing a character's alibi. Sayers' pays great attention to detail in that story - the plot depends closely on the actual 1930 LMS timetable for SW Scotland -

 

[Route115?]

There was a BR Internal Audit department (which I worked for for a while) which would do spot checks at stations. There were also regional control officers, who also did their own. more frequent, checks. It could be interesting as you had to account for cash and credit card ("flimsies") separately.

Ticket analysis was used for providing management information and as mentioned done at regional centrres. This was all computerised with Aptis but with older systems (NCR 21/51, Almex, Omniprinters its so long ago that I forget) manual analysis was required, I believe the system was NPAAS - National Passenger Accounting & Analysis System). The Southern Region mostly used NCR 21s and as mentioned most tickets were preprinted but if there was no stock they had to be hand written. Ticket issuing was complicated back in the 80s.

 

[CW2]

Yes, I remember the Auditors. Suddenly one morning a man appeared at the ticket office window, produced his credentials, and demanded access to the ticket office. I scrutinized his pass carefully before letting him in. After that it was a full audit of the books, comparing receipts, cash deposits, ticket blanks, and the daily accounts. All rather imposing. After a couple of hours he highlighted a couple of minor arithmetical errors in the books (it all being manually calculated back then) but otherwise a clean bill of health.

 

[Tester]

SR was, as I recall, Dorking.

 

[Clarence Yard]

The LM ticket audit department was at Derby. For WR, it was Paddington. For ER, it was (I believe) Stevenage. Not sure about SR and ScR.

The "raiding to add to their own collections" referred to by @6Gman above only tells part of the story. There was a prolific "recycling" movement in place amongst bashers, enabling (fraudulent) long journeys to be made with seemingly perfectly valid tickets.

I'm glad to say that old age means I have forgotten all the details ...

Well remembered about Stevenage. Langley House was where it and other activities were undertaken. Iirc, it was situated to the east of the “new” station in Southgate (a road in Stevenage, not the place!) It was a parcels accounting centre too and also at one time dealt with NPS payroll input.

 

[6Gman]

But what did Stevenage/Dorking/Derby or wherever actually do with all those thousands of tickets that were returned to them?

Could they really be sorted and analysed to identify misbehaviour?

 

[Dr Hoo]

But what did Stevenage/Dorking/Derby or wherever actually do with all those thousands of tickets that were returned to them?

Could they really be sorted and analysed to identify misbehaviour?

Well presumably if there was a suspicion that there was something dodgy going on at Station X or between there and Station Y they would concentrate on bags sent in from there (rather than emptying four weeks of tickets across a division into one big bin and then hoping to find a needle in a haystack).

 

[WesternLancer]

But what did Stevenage/Dorking/Derby or wherever actually do with all those thousands of tickets that were returned to them?

Could they really be sorted and analysed to identify misbehaviour?

Yes. Interesting to think of the sort of jobs that existed like this before it became possible for computer data analysis of info they provided!

 

[Harpo]

One incident I recall was where an individual was using single sided carbon paper in the paper tickets pad - double-sided was used so that the issue detail would show both on the reverse side of the issued ticket and on the copy in the pad.

I am not sure of the exact detail, but audit picked up a ticket for a longer journey for which what should have been the carbon copy on the pad showed a local journey, the issuer of course having pocketed the difference and lost his job as a result.

I recall some BR-era Flying Squad RPIs in East Anglia found to be embezelling through excess pads misuse. Sadly one of them took his own life.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Dec 2025 ==

There was a prolific "recycling" movement in place amongst bashers, enabling (fraudulent) long journeys to be made with seemingly perfectly valid tickets.

Yes. With tales of ticket collectors booths being a source too.

 

[contrex]

Yes. With tales of ticket collectors booths being a source too.

When I were a lad in the 1960s, there were destination stations in the SR London area where you could pay in cash (no receipt, or questioning about where you got on!), and if there was no-one there, (in theory) leave a ticket on the sill of the booth. I think I can safely name East Brixton now. Also on LT Stockwell was good pre-Vic line.

 

[D6130]

IiRC, when I worked in Southern Region booking offices in 1976-77, we sent used tickets back to the ticket accountants' office at Purley....which was situated in the old South Eastern Railway engine shed in the fork of the Caterham and Tattenham Corner branches.

 

[Route115?]

I think that a lot of the information would be for commercial decisions such as determining timetables. The planners would also have used count information.

 

[gaillark]

What was the purpose of the Ticket sorting office in Crewe?
I recall guards would collect tickets on southbound trains towards Euston and place them in an envelope to be forwarded to the sorting office.