the most over the top restrictions introduced

[Bletchleyite]

That means I have to make several different purchases to justify sitting in

You need to do that anyway. Purchasing one coffee then sitting in for hours is bang out of order, I'm afraid, as you are blocking a table without paying them money, preventing others who want to pay them money doing so. Nobody who isn't eating or drinking should be taking up a table. That's just rude; it's not a public library.

In my view, one drink or substantial food item (so about three quid in the till) per hour is about the right level for sitting in a coffee place (or pub[1]) all day.

[1] Spoons maybe an exception as they seem happy for you to buy one coffee and keep refilling it free.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Oct 2020 ==

ETA: Still can't find any government guidelines suggesting that this is the case.

I'd figure it's their policy due to reduced capacity, to ensure the money keeps coming in. And provided you get another hour if you buy another drink, it seems fair to me.

 

[Richard Scott]

You need to do that anyway. Purchasing one coffee then sitting in for hours is bang out of order, I'm afraid, as you are blocking a table without paying them money, preventing others who want to pay them money doing so. Nobody who isn't eating or drinking should be taking up a table. That's just rude; it's not a public library.

In my view, one drink or substantial food item per hour is about the right level for sitting in a coffee place (or pub[1]) all day.

[1] Spoons maybe an exception as they seem happy for you to buy one coffee and keep refilling it free.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Oct 2020 ==



I'd figure it's their policy due to reduced capacity, to ensure the money keeps coming in.

Under normal circumstances I'd agree but we're constantly being told that isn't the case. For the benefit of someone's wellbeing and education I think that's somewhat harsh and dictatorial. I know it's a business but some compassion needed.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Under normal circumstances I'd agree but we're constantly being told that isn't the case. For the benefit of someone's wellbeing and education I think that's somewhat harsh and dictatorial. I know it's a business but some compassion needed.

It's a business, it is not a charity. It is there to make a profit by selling food and drink for consumption on and off the premises. If someone who is taking up a table is not purchasing food and drink for consumption on the premises while occupying that table, and others wish to do so but are being prevented from doing so by their presence (and odds on they are unless there are spare tables; I normally look through the window first, so I wouldn't explicitly go up and say I was declining to go there because it was busy), then it's quite right to ask them to pay up or leave.

I'm sorry, that's how it is.

At the moment these places are pressed by reduced capacity - it'd be all very nice them being charitable, but that could kill them off and cost jobs.

@Scotrail12, are public libraries open in your area? That might be a good bet.

 

[Richard Scott]

It's a business, it is not a charity. It is there to make a profit by selling food and drink for consumption on and off the premises. If someone who is taking up a table is not purchasing food and drink for consumption on the premises while occupying that table, and others wish to do so but are being prevented from doing so by their presence, then it's quite right to ask them to pay up or leave.

I'm sorry, that's how it is.

At the moment these places are pressed by reduced capacity - it'd be all very nice them being charitable, but that could kill them off and cost jobs.

Like I said normally I would agree but I can see the other point of view.

 

[Scotrail12]

The store is really quiet and has been for all the time I've been there...

 

[Bletchleyite]

Like I said normally I would agree but I can see the other point of view.

I can see why he's aggrieved, but the coffee shop has neither a legal nor a moral obligation to provide a place of work to someone who is not going to continuously purchase food and drink items during their stay.

FWIW, I note some independent places (and pubs) have started offering things like "£X to sit in and work for N hours with unlimited tea/coffee/water", and I think that's an excellent way to regularise it. But it is not their role at all to provide work space for anyone who isn't paying for that space.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Oct 2020 ==

The store is really quiet and has been for all the time I've been there...

Then that's a bit more picky, but I still think you should keep a drink "on the go" which would be roughly one an hour. I'm sure they'd let you stay if you purchased another.

 

[adc82140]

I think a compromise is what is needed. If the cafe is at capacity, and there are customers waiting to be seated then there should be a buy something or move on rule. If it's quiet then leave them to it.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I think a compromise is what is needed. If the cafe is at capacity, and there are customers waiting to be seated then there should be a buy something or move on rule. If it's quiet then leave them to it.

I'd say "if there aren't a couple of spare tables", because as I said I will generally not enter if I look through the window and see no spare table or a queue longer than the number of spare tables, so that's a sale lost.

It's probably a bit picky if the place is empty, but equally to me there's still a moral obligation to make purchases to justify your presence in such a place, and "one coffee per hour" is usually the rule I follow when I work in such places as I often do.

Public libraries are the place to go if you want to sit somewhere and work without making purchases, assuming they're open in Scotland at the moment, which I'm not sure about.

 

[WelshBluebird]

In terms of working at cafes and places - some (even pubs) have started offering this as an official practice.
Basically you pay a certain amount, get a table, tea / coffee all day and sometimes a pint at the end of it too.
There was an article about local pubs offering it on the BBC a few days ago and most Brewdog bars have offered it for a while.
Sure it can cost, but depending on your financial situation and your alternatives - it sometimes isn't a bad deal.

Of course there are also other alternatives usually, like specific co-working spaces and even local libraries, though I am not sure of what the current status is for most of those!

 

[trainophile]

It's really annoying when we go in a Spoons and all the alcove tables are taken with one person with an empty glass and an open laptop (usually plugged into the wall socket). Sometimes while sitting somewhere else we have observed them not moving for almost a couple of hours. Seems to be worse in university areas, unsurprisingly.

I doubt they would get away with it so much now, with the staff member on the door signing everyone in, and presumably out.

 

[duncanp]

Thought I would share this petition, which is about a school which is keeping windows and doors open in order to improve ventilation, but will not allow students to wear a coat to compensate.

If I was a parent with a child at that school, I would be having more than a few words with the head teacher.

Sign the Petition

allow students to wear coats at Blythe Bridge high school and sixth form

www.change.org

Due to the corona virus, Blythe Bridge high school and sixth form have decided to keep all the windows and doors open to keep a constant flow of air to limit the spread of the virus. However, the school dress code prevents students from wearing a coat in the classroom, this paired with the falling temperature is causing students to lose focus on their work, catch colds and causes unnecessary mistakes to be made in the class.

The argument being made by the staff is that "it is just the rules" and "we all have to abide to it". This nonchalant attitude towards the health and safety of the students that attend this school shows that the schools priorities lie with tradition and not the benefit of the individuals who attend this school. Furthermore, members of staff are not allowed to wear coats but if you are a member of the senior leadership team you can wear a coat.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Thought I would share this petition, which is about a school which is keeping windows and doors open in order to improve ventilation, but will not allow students to wear a coat to compensate.

If I was a parent with a child at that school, I would be having more than a few words with the head teacher.

Sign the Petition

allow students to wear coats at Blythe Bridge high school and sixth form

www.change.org

A minor point on that - colds are not caught because you get cold. Possibly the biggest medical myth of them all!

However, not allowing children to wear the requisite clothing to keep warm is a clear Safeguarding issue which should have whoever decided to do it hauled before the appropriate authorities and in very serious trouble.

 

[birchesgreen]

Being cold can weaken your immune system, which doesn't sound like a good idea at the moment.

 

[Yew]

Being cold can weaken your immune system, which doesn't sound like a good idea at the moment.

Indeed, but I think (and this is very rare, it's probably the only time we'll agree for the rest of the month) @Bletchleyite is right that it's mainly driven by spending more time indoors, rather than the actual temperature.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Indeed, but I think (and this is very rare, it's probably the only time we'll agree for the rest of the month) @Bletchleyite is right that it's mainly driven by spending more time indoors, rather than the actual temperature.

One coronavirus works like the others, who'd have known?

 

[birchesgreen]

Well there are other illnesses other than coronaviruses, though i realise we generally don't care about them these days.

 

[trainophile]

How are they supposed to concentrate on their lessons if they are shivering with cold? Perhaps it's time for a revival of liberty bodices.

 

[Richard Scott]

How are they supposed to concentrate on their lessons if they are shivering with cold? Perhaps it's time for a revival of liberty bodices.

Time to stop silly nonsense and close the windows?

 

[island]

That means I have to make several different purchases to justify sitting in. Also doesn't work if I have an hour long tutorial which can often overrun and take time to start up etc.

ETA: Still can't find any government guidelines suggesting that this is the case.

There aren’t any government guidelines, it’s just plain old fashioned manners.

 

[py_megapixel]

Time to stop silly nonsense and close the windows?

Or allow students to wear a coat... that would be an equally suitable solution

 

[island]

@Scotrail12, are public libraries open in your area? That might be a good bet.

If it’s the same as mine you have to book a 45 minute slot (and you can’t book multiples; there are 15 minute gaps between them whilst the computers are cleaned).

 

[Skimpot flyer]

How are they supposed to concentrate on their lessons if they are shivering with cold? Perhaps it's time for a revival of liberty bodices.

Or introduce a Central Heating Replacement Service, by force-feeding the kids Ready Brek at regular intervals?
Seriously, those in charge of this school need some errr... education

 

[Richard Scott]

Or allow students to wear a coat... that would be an equally suitable solution

No, close the windows, the heating can then do its job and reduce pollution that would be caused due to windows being open. Believe me if you leave windows open and they keep their coats on they'll still be cold. They can't work effectively in coats either as they restrict movement too much when trying to write.

 

[Bletchleyite]

There aren’t any government guidelines, it’s just plain old fashioned manners.

Well, quite. It's rude to sit in a cafe without consuming paid-for food and drink while you're there - COVID or not - and it's quite right that someone taking a table there without doing so is asked to leave.

It's similar to people who go to the pub and sit there drinking tap water. At least buy a bowl of chips or something.

 

[Skimpot flyer]

Well, quite. It's rude to sit in a cafe without consuming paid-for food and drink while you're there - COVID or not - and it's quite right that someone taking a table there without doing so is asked to leave.

It's similar to people who go to the pub and sit there drinking tap water. At least buy a bowl of chips or something.

It could also be argued that people who meander around supermarkets with no cohesive plan on how to pick their items in the most efficient manner, stopping to chat with old friends and blocking the aisles unnecessarily are also forcing people outside to queue for longer than necessary. These people really ought to have more consideration for others
<sarcasm>

 

[Bletchleyite]

It could also be argued that people who meander around supermarkets with no cohesive plan on how to pick their items in the most efficient manner, stopping to chat with old friends and blocking the aisles unnecessarily are also forcing people outside to queue for longer than necessary. These people really ought to have more consideration for others

If they block the aisles, then yes, they absolutely should have more consideration. It's perfectly possible to stand to one side.

 

[trainophile]

If supermarkets keep changing the layout around, or if you're in one you aren't familiar with, there's sometimes little option but to meander around looking for what you need. That's why the one way systems are such a pain, you can't check both sides of the aisles at once without loitering.

 

[Skimpot flyer]

If supermarkets keep changing the layout around, or if you're in one you aren't familiar with, there's sometimes little option but to meander around looking for what you need. That's why the one way systems are such a pain, you can't check both sides of the aisles at once without loitering.

In large supermarkets, where aisles are wide, I completely ignore one-way systems. Coming into close contact with others for well under 60 seconds is not dangerous and some people have completely lost all rational thought.
In Morrisons, I’ve seen people wearing masks who, when heavily-discounted items with very short use-by dates are put out, will crowd in very close with no regard to distancing. The same people who will stop dead in their tracks if encountering someone coming the other way ! This is absolute madness and I will not be part of it

 

[trainophile]

It makes more sense for the reduced items to be stickered and left on their original shelves in the current situation. Besides it's fairer, as you don't get the greedy ones scooping them all into their baskets.

 

[Hadders]

It makes more sense for the reduced items to be stickered and left on their original shelves in the current situation. Besides it's fairer, as you don't get the greedy ones scooping them all into their baskets.

The problem is they don't tend to sell then because they aren't really as visible to customers. The end result is more food waste which isn't in anyone's interest.