The Dartford routes

[NorthKent1989]

What potential services and diagrams would you change about the Dartford routes?

This is all hypothetical here, some of these services aren't possible.

For instance the semi fast Gillingham service running into Victoria or a semi fast service which calls at Eltham and Bexleyheath instead of Charlton, Woolwich and Abbey Wood.

Non stop runs from Dartford to London, I'm surprised this has never been a service in my lifetime at least.

Or having some stoppers or skip stops terminate at Plumstead or Sidcup

Any other suggestions.

 

[NSE]

I've only visited these lines infrequently, so I don't know them too well. But from my limited knowledge: I don't think any stations on the routes have turn back facilities? Meaning you'd be taking up valuable space by having a train sitting on the mainline waiting to turn around.

By running semi fast, this means some trains will now catch up with the ones in front. This means that a regular clock face timetable, will possibly be removed, and trains will be at irregularly spaced gaps, not so enticing for the passenger. It also would not work with trains turning round at Plumstead or somewhere else early. As a semi fast timetable would be more reliant on everything being on time. Not great when you're about to hold a line up with a terminating service. It would also mean its now going to arrive at certain junctions earlier, which are already taken up with other services. For example, by running fast from Blackheath to Bexleyheath may be great for you and you could argue why not just hold it in Barnehurst until the correct slot for the junctions to Dartford. But then you can't hold it at Barnehurst because its arriving earlier when another service is booked to stop there. So its just ripe with knock on effects. Its not impossible to change, but it would take a lot of effort.

AIUI there are half hourly skip stops to beyond Dartford via Woolwich and via Sidcup already to Gillingham and Gravesend. So I guess thats all that can be fitted in with the current timetable.

Haha, however re reading your post, saying you know these aren't possible (my bad), I would like to see a semi fast down the Bexleyheath line. Something like Victoria-Denmark Hill-Peckham Rye-Lewisham-Blackheath-Welling-Bexleyheath-Dartford then on towards Chatham.

 

[NorthKent1989]

I've only visited these lines infrequently, so I don't know them too well. But from my limited knowledge: I don't think any stations on the routes have turn back facilities? Meaning you'd be taking up valuable space by having a train sitting on the mainline waiting to turn around.

By running semi fast, this means some trains will now catch up with the ones in front. This means that a regular clock face timetable, will possibly be removed, and trains will be at irregularly spaced gaps, not so enticing for the passenger. It also would not work with trains turning round at Plumstead or somewhere else early. As a semi fast timetable would be more reliant on everything being on time. Not great when you're about to hold a line up with a terminating service. It would also mean its now going to arrive at certain junctions earlier, which are already taken up with other services. For example, by running fast from Blackheath to Bexleyheath may be great for you and you could argue why not just hold it in Barnehurst until the correct slot for the junctions to Dartford. But then you can't hold it at Barnehurst because its arriving earlier when another service is booked to stop there. So its just ripe with knock on effects. Its not impossible to change, but it would take a lot of effort.

AIUI there are half hourly skip stops to beyond Dartford via Woolwich and via Sidcup already to Gillingham and Gravesend. So I guess thats all that can be fitted in with the current timetable.

Haha, however re reading your post, saying you know these aren't possible (my bad), I would like to see a semi fast down the Bexleyheath line. Something like Victoria-Denmark Hill-Peckham Rye-Lewisham-Blackheath-Welling-Bexleyheath-Dartford then on towards Chatham.

Trains used to be able to turn back at Plumstead, for many years during the noughties the Gillingham semi fasts ran via Greenwich while the Plumstead reversers used to go into Victoria, with a fast run from Lewisham to Victoria, then for some reason the Plumstead service was diverted to Cannon Street.

I would like to see the Plumstead to Victoria service return only I would add a stop at Denmark Hill.

 

[30907]

There are still some Sidcup short workings in the peak.

 

[Busaholic]

I lived in Eltham from 1948 to 1967 and don't recollect ever hearing of trains skipping stops. On the other hand, I seem to remember when living at Hither Green in the 1970s that some trains skipped stops in the peak on the Sidcup, possibly those against the peak flow (I travelled against the flow for a year or two), but my memory's hazy.

 

[30907]

I lived in Eltham from 1948 to 1967 and don't recollect ever hearing of trains skipping stops. On the other hand, I seem to remember when living at Hither Green in the 1970s that some trains skipped stops in the peak on the Sidcup, possibly those against the peak flow (I travelled against the flow for a year or two), but my memory's hazy.

See the discussion here: http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=147733

 

[frodshamfella]

I used to commute from Bexleyheath to London, both Charing Cross and later to Cannon Street. We did have a few morning and evening fast service to CX , running Kidbrook to Waterloo East ( or the other way around) non stop.

 

[SF-02]

I can see all skip stops going within 5 years. Growth is strong even former sleepier stations like Woolwich Dockyard and Deptford. Huge housing plans by them all too. Cutting a service at Plumstead means its not there to bring people back to Abbey Wood which will be needed with Crossrail.

 

[frodshamfella]

I've just read on the web that Chris Grayling is proposing that the Bexleyheath line will only have trains to Cannon Street. I couldn't quite believe this proposal having been a commuter from the 80s on this line CX was always the more popular London termini. I'm not sure what would happen to the Victoria service, or to what would happen on the Dartford loop. Anyone know ?

 

[NorthKent1989]

I've just read on the web that Chris Grayling is proposing that the Bexleyheath line will only have trains to Cannon Street. I couldn't quite believe this proposal having been a commuter from the 80s on this line CX was always the more popular London termini. I'm not sure what would happen to the Victoria service, or to what would happen on the Dartford loop. Anyone know ?

This does seem.like a strange plan, CX and Victoria have always been the more popular services, CS never used to serve this line off peak for a few years, until 2009, not heard of this plan before

 

[Busaholic]

This does seem.like a strange plan, CX and Victoria have always been the more popular services, CS never used to serve this line off peak for a few years, until 2009, not heard of this plan before

Cannon Street had a 4tph shuttle, four coaches, to London Bridge between the peaks as its ONLY service during those hours when I last lived in London.

 

[frodshamfella]

This does seem.like a strange plan, CX and Victoria have always been the more popular services, CS never used to serve this line off peak for a few years, until 2009, not heard of this plan before

it does seem bizarre to me. When I used to commute to London, Cannon Street was a peak hours service only.