The Bag Tax

[AM9]

That was an interesting one, as CFLs were and still are a rubbish replacement. Only in the last year or two has LED technology reached the point where it is a true replacement, though those of us sensitive to flicker still suffer from people installing cheap rubbish with a 50Hz pulse. (My house is now LED throughout, but I bought the expensive ones which are indistinguishable from tungsten in their light quality). I have wondered if the 50Hz pulsing on

For those locations where CFLs weren't the bset type there are Halogen bulbs. Their prices are almost the same as old type tungsten. Their life is much longer and they use about 30% less power for the same light.
LEDs are now getting better and their price is falling fast.
I wonder how much those who bought up the last of the tungsten bulbs are faring with their stock, not to mention those who got even more thirsty rough duty bulbs.

That one was silly, as one spends a tiny amount of time per day using one, so it was of almost no benefit, particularly as if one needs to vacuum for longer due to a less powerful machine, no gain is made.

The problem was that when tested, the highest power models weren't necessarily the best performers. A bit like old american gas guzzlers.

 

[radamfi]

Anybody who shops at Marks and Sparks will know that they have charged for carrier bags for some time and the scanned tills they rely on people honesty to select the number of bags they have used.

Now both Asda and Tesco tills seem to be setup the same however they have removed the bags from the tills and now you have to ask the staff minding the tills for a bag which at busy times slows things down considerably, in fact if its still like that next time I go in I intend to complain about it.

Have M&S continued to rely on honesty in the last week? I can see an argument for "hiding" the bags as if they didn't, they could turn a blind eye to people taking the bags for free, and therefore get around the new law. The issue isn't customer honesty, it is ensuring compliance with the law.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Have M&S continued to rely on honesty in the last week? I can see an argument for "hiding" the bags as if they didn't, they could turn a blind eye to people taking the bags for free, and therefore get around the new law. The issue isn't customer honesty, it is ensuring compliance with the law.

Customers are trusted to pay for everything else they take. Why not bags?

 

[alxndr]

Now both Asda and Tesco tills seem to be setup the same however they have removed the bags from the tills and now you have to ask the staff minding the tills for a bag which at busy times slows things down considerably, in fact if its still like that next time I go in I intend to complain about it.

It seems hit and miss what Tesco do, I wonder if it depends on staffing levels and whether they've had issues. Up until yesterday our Tesco Extra was purely relying on honesty, but yesterday they were being dished out. I also went in a Tesco Metro elsewhere yesterday and the bags were still freely on display, but this was much busier.

 

[jon0844]

Can't see any evidence of selling Corbyn clothing on their website so I'm guessing you've made that up.

Why would I make that up? They have a shop now, where you can buy clothing with various political messages, and at least one with Corbyn on it and 'Old Labour, New Start'. They're just £19.99 each, which is a good price for a T-Shirt </sarcasm>.

Just because you haven't seen it, doesn't mean it's not true.

The Guardian is having many issues. Too many people don't want to pay for news, and advertisers are paying less.

Now, you'd have assumed that some papers would have a readership that believes in paying a fair amount to support workers but that doesn't appear to be the case.

The site now detects ad blockers and asks for people to make a donation (like a charity) because so many people who visit are so happy to restrict what precious income the paper can get these days.
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That does rather back their point up, though, doesn't it? They aren't buying the print edition, they are reading it online.

Precisely. Paper sales simply aren't coming back.

And the Guardian is going to have to do what all the other sites have had to do, start doing more clickbait stories. That will mean far more opinion pieces and stories to create outrage, because they then get shared by supports (and 'haters') and lead to thousands of comments - which keeps page views up.

Nobody is immune, not even papers that are writing to an audience that should be fighting such changes and not accepting that journalism is going down the toilet.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Precisely. Paper sales simply aren't coming back.

Though what the Guardian is doing wrong is (in my view) not having a tablet app of the quality of the Times, with the content of the full paper in it rather than a cut-down version. If it did, more people might pay to subscribe.

 

[radamfi]

Customers are trusted to pay for everything else they take. Why not bags?

It is slightly different because if customers got used to taking bags away for free with the supermarket turning a blind eye, the supermarket would have an advantage over its competitors. Supermarkets *want* to give away bags for free (that's why they've been doing that until last Sunday) whereas they don't want to give away their merchandise. A similar concept to a company avoiding tax by trying to pay a member of staff through expenses rather than increasing their salary.

 

[jon0844]

Though what the Guardian is doing wrong is (in my view) not having a tablet app of the quality of the Times, with the content of the full paper in it rather than a cut-down version. If it did, more people might pay to subscribe.

I think the paper misjudged where things were going. Fact is, nobody can keep on doing things the way they were.

The Daily Mail sussed it and has done all the things that can make it new revenue (even if it's a complete sell out, and totally dumbs down news reporting in the same way the Guardian is headed, and others).

Now The Guardian is opening shops, asking for donations (not a subscription per se, and more akin to when Wikipedia asked for donations) and clearly stirring things up more than it did. It knows it can't just talk to its audience, it needs to attract all those that despise what they read in the paper; it's all traffic.

I know three journalists that work at the Guardian (I won't name them and one is actually freelance, albeit on a retainer). I knew more, but they left. I am sure in the years ahead, the others will go - but only when they can find somewhere else TO go.

Anyway, that's off topic enough I think!
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The problem was that when tested, the highest power [vacuum cleaner] models weren't necessarily the best performers. A bit like old american gas guzzlers.

Indeed. Tests show the newer designs are more efficient, and more effective.. but that doesn't stop some people thinking 'EU' or 'Government' meddling and then want to take a stand.

The industry did well to clear out old stock though. It happily allowed people to think the EU was being evil, and used the fuss to easily sell out all those 50 year old designed vacuum cleaners that would otherwise have become illegal to sell.

Then when the ban came in, they started to advertise the compliant ones and promote how much better they were in all tests.

A result for the industry, and now an awful lot of people have a vacuum cleaners that they had no reason to buy.

I'm amazed at the fuss over the 5p charge given how we've been encouraging people to stop using bags for years. I generally stopped using single use bags years ago, unless I had no other choice.

Bags for life (including the far higher quality ones that you'll pay a few quid for) are so much more convenient for the user, that it seems mad you'd rather suffer just to 'prove a point'.

 

[northwichcat]

Why would I make that up? They have a shop now, where you can buy clothing.

Just because you haven't seen it, doesn't mean it's not true.

I've found the shop which has around 250 T-Shirts. 8 of those are pro-Labour T-Shirts and only one mentions Corbyn, so I'm not sure why you thought that one T-shirt needed highlighting. The shop doesn't even seem to promote that product any more than the others. There's 14 T-Shirts relating to cricket on there so based on the Guardian shop range of products they think more people would want to wear cricket branded clothing than Labour party branded clothing.

searching for serach term 'cricket'

http://entertainment.guardianoffers.co.uk/search/results/?search=cricket

Oh dear!

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

We spent the morning yesterday in Macclesfield, the nearest town of size to where we live and bought quite a number of items in the silk museum shop. The assistant produced a very good quality thick manila-type paper bag with cord handles in which she proceeded to carefully pack the purchases. When asked how much this bag was, she replied it was totally free.
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http://entertainment.guardianoffers.co.uk/search/results/?search=cricket

Oh dear!

I wonder if a typographical error had crept into the quoted part of that reported posting...."Originally posted by Guardian Shop"

As far as I am aware, Serach was the Jewish wife of the Khazar ruler called Sabriel, who persuaded him and a number of the Khazar nobility to convert to Judaism.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

I think the paper misjudged where things were going. Fact is, nobody can keep on doing things the way they were.

The Daily Mail sussed it and has done all the things that can make it new revenue (even if it's a complete sell out, and totally dumbs down news reporting in the same way the Guardian is headed, and others).

I love the Guardian for the tone of its reporting - and it's one of the few newspapers that I trust to report stuff relatively honestly. But it does seem to me that their management lack any sensible commercial strategy to actually make money. So far as I can tell, they basically given away their entire published content for free online - which obviously means that there's little reason for anyone to pay for the newspaper unless for some strange reason they particularly want a large, awkward-to-hold, paper copy. As you say, other newspapers have been rather more proactive in figuring out how to respond to the threat from the Internet.

 

[radamfi]

We spent the morning yesterday in Macclesfield, the nearest town of size to where we live and bought quite a number of items in the silk museum shop. The assistant produced a very good quality thick manila-type paper bag with cord handles in which she proceeded to carefully pack the purchases. When asked how much this bag was, she replied it was totally free.

That shop is probably exempt from the charge so they could have given you a free plastic bag.

 

[jon0844]

I've found the shop which has around 250 T-Shirts. 8 of those are pro-Labour T-Shirts and only one mentions Corbyn, so I'm not sure why you thought that one T-shirt needed highlighting.

Because this was the T-shirt that was in an advert within a story (well two actually) to link to the shop. Sigh!

Clearly the Guardian picked out this one to promote from the many hundreds. If you'd like to ask why then direct your question to the Guardian, not me.

 

[northwichcat]

Because this was the T-shirt that was in an advert within a story (well two actually) to link to the shop. Sigh!

Was the article about Labour or Jeremy Corbyn? Usually adverts reflect what the audience is expected to like or dislike.

 

[jon0844]

It was a technology (mobile phone) article and, I think, a comment piece.

It would make sense to promote these T-shirts given the topical nature, but it doesn't really matter so much the content of the shirts, rather the fact that the Guardian feels the need to sell T-shirts (albeit through a third party) and other commercial ventures, which was part of my point that it is now going down routes that I don't think a newspaper should.

It's going the way of the Daily Mail and that's not good.

The proper way is to get people like you and me to pay for the content, like we did when buying newspapers, and that means changing a mindset that now expects things for free.

Until that happens, we'll have journalists being given advice on what subjects to cover, what opinion pieces to write, things NOT to write about and all other things that has been increasing in recent years. We've had some of this exposed (Telegraph) and there will be loads more in the future.

Publishing Directors now have far more control and it's become far more commercial, because it has to if these publications want to stay in business.

Anyway, maybe an admin should break away these posts as it's now got very little to do with the bag tax. To get back on topic, Ocado just delivered to me earlier and it was all bagged up, and the driver said I can just return them next time but not to worry about how many - as he'll just state I returned them today. He said they aren't bothered if they actually take them back or not!

 

[hassaanhc]

a group of students with a trolley a good mile from Asda

It isn't new behaviour. I've seen this a lot from groups of students at my uni as well . It is one mile from Asda to the furthest accommodation block. I just see it as theft and laziness, and as usual it is the students who think it is cool to behave like idiots and think they can get away with anything that ruin it for the rest of us :roll:.
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As for me, personally I prefer the "Bag for Life" things as they're larger and have more comfortable handles that don't dig into your hand and cut off circulation. I do occasionally use the normal ones if I'm trying to keep certain things separate or manage to use up all my life ones.

 

[headshot119]

It isn't new behaviour. I've seen this a lot from groups of students at my uni as well . It is one mile from Asda to the furthest accommodation block. I just see it as theft and laziness, and as usual it is the students who think it is cool to behave like idiots and think they can get away with anything that ruin it for the rest of us :roll:.
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As for me, personally I prefer the "Bag for Life" things as they're larger and have more comfortable handles that don't dig into your hand and cut off circulation. I do occasionally use the normal ones if I'm trying to keep certain things separate or manage to use up all my life ones.

My Uni had a good deal with the large Tesco Extra near one large group of halls. You could use the trolley to take it home and you'd then leave it outside your hall next to the bins. tesco sent a couple of staff round every couple of days to collect them up. Great system and some common sense from both sides.

 

[jon0844]

My Uni had a good deal with the large Tesco Extra near one large group of halls. You could use the trolley to take it home and you'd then leave it outside your hall next to the bins. tesco sent a couple of staff round every couple of days to collect them up. Great system and some common sense from both sides.

Yes, that sounds very good. Shame the trolley I saw wasn't going to the halls, and will likely end up in a ditch (along with a broken coin holder so the pound coin wasn't lost).

 

[Stats]

Does anyone on this website know of the legal position of taking a wheeled trolley owned by a supermarket off the site of that store and taken a good distance away? I note that in some urban areas where canals pass through, these type of trolleys have often been found during times of drainage or restoration works.

If you are found abandoning a trolley you can be fined under littering legislation. Furthermore several local authorities will fine retailers up to £100 for each abandoned trolley found bearing their name .

There is a charity called Trolleywise who you can report an abandoned trolley and they will collect it and contribute to planting a tree for each trolley collected. http://www.trolleywise.co.uk

 

[northwichcat]

It isn't new behaviour. I've seen this a lot from groups of students at my uni as well . It is one mile from Asda to the furthest accommodation block. I just see it as theft and laziness, and as usual it is the students who think it is cool to behave like idiots and think they can get away with anything that ruin it for the rest of us :roll:.

Unfortunately the £1 deposits for trolleys actually increased the likelihood of trolleys being taken outside the supermarket premises. Possibly some people see it as their trolley to use how they see fit until they retrieve their £1.

 

[krus_aragon]

Unfortunately the £1 deposits for trolleys actually increased the likelihood of trolleys being taken outside the supermarket premises. Possibly some people see it as their trolley to use how they see fit until they retrieve their £1.

How does that follow? Surely the obvious way to retrieve the £1 is to do so at the trolley park: an incentive not to take the trolley away.
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On the topic of disappearing baskets: the same happened in parts of Wales too. We've had all the kerfuffle yo're having, and got over it. It's just that a lot of he British press didn't bother covering it.

On a related note, our local Co-op is happy for (primarily elderly) locals to use their trundle-baskets to take their shopping home, as long as they return with the basket on thier next shop. It makes for repeat business...

 

[Peter Mugridge]

At Tesco New Malden ( and presumably a lot of other stores ) they have prevented trolley theft by the simple expedient of fitting them with a brake system which locks the wheels if they are taken beyond the boundary of the car park.

Presumably some form of RFID equipment?

It would seem to me to be common sense for all supermarkets to adopt this device.

 

[Groningen]

The Conservatives have gone green or is it a way to make up for lost taxes.

 

[Domh245]

At Tesco New Malden ( and presumably a lot of other stores ) they have prevented trolley theft by the simple expedient of fitting them with a brake system which locks the wheels if they are taken beyond the boundary of the car park.

Presumably some form of RFID equipment?

It would seem to me to be common sense for all supermarkets to adopt this device.

I thought it was something to do with magnets in the wheels, which also helps with the travelator up to the second floor. Those devices have been around for a while, possibly something to do with the nearby school (!)

 

[jon0844]

At Tesco New Malden ( and presumably a lot of other stores ) they have prevented trolley theft by the simple expedient of fitting them with a brake system which locks the wheels if they are taken beyond the boundary of the car park.

Presumably some form of RFID equipment?

It would seem to me to be common sense for all supermarkets to adopt this device.

The Asda trolleys I see students using, which seem particularly popular for helping move furniture etc, all gave these. Tesco also has them, where the brakes kick in at the red line.

It appears it must be easy to avoid the brakes kicking in as all the trolleys I see are free wheeling.

 

[90019]

At Tesco New Malden ( and presumably a lot of other stores ) they have prevented trolley theft by the simple expedient of fitting them with a brake system which locks the wheels if they are taken beyond the boundary of the car park.

My nearest Asda has that.

Only problem is, the point you can't take a trolley past is so close to the shop, that you can't get them into the car park.

 

[jon0844]

Having now looked up how the trolley locks work, I can imagine that Asda and Tesco have failed to maintain the system (either changing the batteries in the trolleys, or keeping the RF based system in operation).

Meanwhile, I also found this; http://www.instructables.com/id/EMP-shopping-cart-locker/

Which if you had a really sick sense of humour could cause chaos if used in a store!

 

[D6975]

How does that follow? Surely the obvious way to retrieve the £1 is to do so at the trolley park: an incentive not to take the trolley away.

Not if there's already a trolley at their destination, they can plug one into the other and get their pound back. This happened where I live, the car park at the back of the flats gradually acquired a crocodile of trolleys.

 

[bnm]

The Conservatives have gone green or is it a way to make up for lost taxes.

This isn't a tax. No revenue from the sale of carrier bags (bar the VAT) goes to government. Retailers have to report annually the following:

- the number of single-use carrier bags supplied
- the gross and net proceeds of the charge
- any VAT in the gross proceeds
- what was done with the proceeds from the charge
- any reasonable costs and how they break down

And if you're worried about the minuscule amount of VAT you'll give the Govt by paying 5p per bag, then don't buy them.

 

[northwichcat]

How does that follow? Surely the obvious way to retrieve the £1 is to do so at the trolley park: an incentive not to take the trolley away.

I didn't say it results in people taking the trolley and not returning them but taking it further than they should.