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The 2024 US presidential election.

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AlterEgo

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Correct. Harris automatically becomes president. Win for Democrats and Biden legacy. She then runs as an incumbent president giving the Democrats a major boost. It really is the best of options imho at the moment.
Gosh, I'm not sure I see Harris winning an election against Trump. I think they need a whole new ticket.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Correct. Harris automatically becomes president. Win for Democrats and Biden legacy. She then runs as an incumbent president giving the Democrats a major boost. It really is the best of options imho at the moment.
Gosh, I'm not sure I see Harris winning an election against Trump. I think they need a whole new ticket.
 
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DarloRich

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If he steps down as a candidate due to ill health he surely also has to step down as President, no?
no - He could easily say he will no longer seek re election. It would make him a "lame duck" but he would not have to give up the top job until he is voted out.

He could easily say he has decided on health grounds that he is unable to campaign with the vigour and intensity needed to defeat the authoritarian threat of Donald Trump.

Correct. Harris automatically becomes president. Win for Democrats and Biden legacy. She then runs as an incumbent president giving the Democrats a major boost. It really is the best of options imho at the moment.
that seems ,erm, wishful thinking. Harris isn't well liked according to polling and I doubt the incumbency is worth much against Trump. He isn't your usual politician. He is an authoritarian, proto fascist, cult leader who will say and do anything to get (and keep) power. The usual rules don't apply.

It needs a new team. I now think regardless of change it will be very hard to stop Trump.
 

Gloster

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“I consider that to both continue to act as president in this increasingly uncertain world with threats to this great country and to campaign for a second term at the same time are too great a challenge. I will never fail this great country by giving less than 100% to my duties as President and so have decided, with considerable regret, not to stand for a second term.” That should do it: patriotism, a bit of dignity and sacrificing personal ambition for the good of the country. Who would dare to question Biden? Well, Trump probably would, but that can’t be avoided and it might make him look cheap.
 

simonw

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If he steps down as a candidate due to ill health he surely also has to step down as President, no?
No, President Johnson didn't stand for re-election in 1968, but stayed on until the end of his term. One wonders how the world would be had he stood and won.
 

brad465

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No, President Johnson didn't stand for re-election in 1968, but stayed on until the end of his term. One wonders how the world would be had he stood and won.
He'd have probably died in office. He died 2 days after the term following his first full term finished, but the demands of the job could well have accelerated his decline. As for how the world would be, I doubt much will have changed given he oversaw the Vietnam War which was still ongoing under Nixon and was unpopular even before Nixon took office.

Meanwhile, they say Trump supporters say putting on their own ear bandages is a sign of solidarity with him, and while for some that maybe the case, this absolutely smacks of cult-like behaviour:


Several supporters of former President Donald Trump wore bandages on their ears to the third night of the Republican National Convention (RNC) in Milwaukee, Wisconsin.

Members of the RNC's Arizona delegation said they were wearing the bandages as a sign of solidarity with the former president after he survived an assassination attempt.

One supporter said she had bandaged her own ear to help Mr Trump "set a new fashion statement" and to let him know "how much we love him".

Mr Trump has appeared at the convention wearing a bandage after he was shot in the ear while he was speaking at a Pennsylvania rally on Sunday.

The former president is due to deliver a speech at the convention on Thursday, when he is expected to be confirmed as the Republican Party's 2024 presidential nominee.

Video attached
 

Bantamzen

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Meanwhile, they say Trump supporters say putting on their own ear bandages is a sign of solidarity with him, and while for some that maybe the case, this absolutely smacks of cult-like behaviour:

I. Have. No. Words...

If Trump and his window-licking entourage get in, I fully support the wall being built around all four edges, and and all electronic communication cut with the USofA, with a grace period for anyone still sane to be able to escape...
 

simonw

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He'd have probably died in office. He died 2 days after the term following his first full term finished, but the demands of the job could well have accelerated his decline. As for how the world would be, I doubt much will have changed given he oversaw the Vietnam War which was still ongoing under Nixon and was unpopular even before Nixon took office.
I'd say that Johnson would beat Nixon and continue with his reforming agenda. With no Nixon, there's no Watergate and alsorts of changes in political fortunes would have arisen. Maybe no Reagan and no trickle down economics.
 

brad465

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I. Have. No. Words...

If Trump and his window-licking entourage get in, I fully support the wall being built around all four edges, and and all electronic communication cut with the USofA, with a grace period for anyone still sane to be able to escape...
On a more serious point linked to this I wouldn't be surprised if Trump getting in and going ahead with Project 2025 leads to one of the largest emigration waves in history: even only 1% of the population leaving in the first year would be over 3 million citizens, but more than 10 million wouldn't be out of the question, mostly to Canada and Mexico, but Europe will also I expect receive some.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

100%. It is a cult.
Makes me wonder if they would all have shot themselves had the assassination succeeded.
 

AlterEgo

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No, President Johnson didn't stand for re-election in 1968, but stayed on until the end of his term. One wonders how the world would be had he stood and won.
He wasn't claiming to be physically unfit for office at the time though - it's a little different. Biden does seem to be unfit to be the President.
 

GRALISTAIR

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Gosh, I'm not sure I see Harris winning an election against Trump. I think they need a whole new ticket.
As I have said before, the optics would be horrible- not having Harris a female of colour but replacing her with a white male such as Newsom? ! It won’t happen.
 

AlterEgo

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As I have said before, the optics would be horrible- not having Harris a female of colour but replacing her with a white male such as Newsom? ! It won’t happen.
I agree with the optics, just don't see how Harris beats Trump, sadly.
 

Busaholic

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If he steps down as a candidate due to ill health he surely also has to step down as President, no?
I don't see that at all. He'd merely be stating he didn't think he was up to spending another four years as President, not a surprising thing for an 81 year old. Now if only a 78 year old would come to the same conclusion.
 

edwin_m

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Now if only a 78 year old would come to the same conclusion.
Not sure that would help much. If Trump were to stand down or be unable to continue for any other reason, then Vance would now step up instead, and his convention speech suggests he has similar attitudes. Eric or Don Jr for VP?
 

GRALISTAIR

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Not sure that would help much. If Trump were to stand down or be unable to continue for any other reason, then Vance would now step up instead, and his convention speech suggests he has similar attitudes. Eric or Don Jr for VP?
Indeed so.
 

AlterEgo

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Not sure that would help much. If Trump were to stand down or be unable to continue for any other reason, then Vance would now step up instead, and his convention speech suggests he has similar attitudes. Eric or Don Jr for VP?
Before the election yes. After: The Presidential line of succession mandates that the Speaker of the House of Representatives assumes the vice presidency in the event the VP becomes President.
 

Gloster

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Before the election yes. After: The Presidential line of succession mandates that the Speaker of the House of Representatives assumes the vice presidency in the event the VP becomes President.

Is this permanent or does the Speaker become the VP only until the new president has nominated a new VP and this nomination been ratified by the Senate (or House of Representatives)? I am thinking of Gerald Ford.
 

edwin_m

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Is this permanent or does the Speaker become the VP only until the new president has nominated a new VP and this nomination been ratified by the Senate (or House of Representatives)? I am thinking of Gerald Ford.
Ford's Wikipedia says he was House Minority Leader and therefore not the Speaker, and he was nominated by Nixon when Spiro Agnew resigned as VP.
https://constitutioncenter.org/the-constitution/full-text

25th Amendment​

Section 1​

In case of the removal of the President from office or of his death or resignation, the Vice President shall become President.

Section 2​

Whenever there is a vacancy in the office of the Vice President, the President shall nominate a Vice President who shall take office upon confirmation by a majority vote of both Houses of Congress.
 

Gloster

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Ford nominated Nelson Rockefeller as VP: Rockefeller had been Governor of New York, but seems never to have served in the Senate or House of Representatives. There appears to have been no VP for a bit over four months.
 

nw1

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On a more serious point linked to this I wouldn't be surprised if Trump getting in and going ahead with Project 2025 leads to one of the largest emigration waves in history: even only 1% of the population leaving in the first year would be over 3 million citizens, but more than 10 million wouldn't be out of the question, mostly to Canada and Mexico, but Europe will also I expect receive some.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==


Makes me wonder if they would all have shot themselves had the assassination succeeded.

Not an entirely serious post, but raising it as a "far out" idea:

In the event of a particularly far-right Trump presidency incorporating Project 2025, would it be time for America to split, I wonder? So that Northeasterners and Californians (amongst others) can live their lives unencumbered by backward, regressive, far-right nonsense.

Radical, I know, but the USA appears to be, in effect, two countries. The large cities and their wider urban areas (which are arguably the country's economic powerhouses) really don't seem to have much time for Trump and even less time for Project 2025 nonsense.

You could call the West and East the American Union, and the middle bit the American Confederacy. ;)

The Union could then preserve, and extend, modern liberal values while the Confederacy could indulge in more conservative ones.

Freedom of movement would of course have to be preserved: I would foresee some kind of Schengen-like system covering the two new nations so that people can settle in their chosen one freely.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Not sure that would help much. If Trump were to stand down or be unable to continue for any other reason, then Vance would now step up instead, and his convention speech suggests he has similar attitudes. Eric or Don Jr for VP?

Mind you, Vance is a relative unknown, and would not command anything like the cult following of Trump.

That could work for or against the Republicans, I guess. If Vance went more moderate, it could work for them.
 
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Busaholic

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Not sure that would help much. If Trump were to stand down or be unable to continue for any other reason, then Vance would now step up instead, and his convention speech suggests he has similar attitudes. Eric or Don Jr for VP?
He almost certainly wouldn't get the number of votes that Trump would have, which could make a crucial difference.
 

The Ham

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Not an entirely serious post, but raising it as a "far out" idea:

In the event of a particularly far-right Trump presidency incorporating Project 2025, would it be time for America to split, I wonder? So that Northeasterners and Californians (amongst others) can live their lives unencumbered by backward, regressive, far-right nonsense.

Radical, I know, but the USA appears to be, in effect, two countries. The large cities and their wider urban areas (which are arguably the country's economic powerhouses) really don't seem to have much time for Trump and even less time for Project 2025 nonsense.

You could call the West and East the American Union, and the middle bit the American Confederacy. ;)

The Union could then preserve, and extend, modern liberal values while the Confederacy could indulge in more conservative ones.

Freedom of movement would of course have to be preserved: I would foresee some kind of Schengen-like system covering the two new nations so that people can settle in their chosen one freely.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==



Mind you, Vance is a relative unknown, and would not command anything like the cult following of Trump.

That could work for or against the Republicans, I guess. If Vance went more moderate, it could work for them.

I fear something more akin to partition (India/Pakistan).

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There's been some "suggestions" that the assassination attempt is a conspiracy given how bad the Secret Service messed up. Of course seeing the glorious leader nearly die is going to make you want to vote for them....

--------------------------------------------------------------------

Biden could be deliberately waiting for Trump to be confirmed before stepping down, so the Republicans are stuck with him
 

Busaholic

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Biden could be deliberately waiting for Trump to be confirmed before stepping down, so the Republicans are stuck with him
Who other than somebody who can no longer think straight imagines Trump will not get nominated? It's the Democrats who are, as things stand, stuck with a soon-to-be loser.
 

brad465

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Biden could be deliberately waiting for Trump to be confirmed before stepping down, so the Republicans are stuck with him
I think it's more likely that the immediate aftermath of the assassination was never going to be a good time to announce such a decision, so the process has been slowed down. However, I think, after the initial delay, the push to get Biden to step down has now accelerated, with top Democrats like the leaders of the Senate and House both reported to be applying pressure, among others.
 

Busaholic

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I think it's more likely that the immediate aftermath of the assassination was never going to be a good time to announce such a decision, so the process has been slowed down. However, I think, after the initial delay, the push to get Biden to step down has now accelerated, with top Democrats like the leaders of the Senate and House both reported to be applying pressure, among others.
If it had really been an assassination then we wouldn't be doing all this speculation! Close shave though it may have been, given it was obviously a 'lone wolf' with no apparent anti-Republican overtones and Trump escaped with no lasting injuries, either physical or mental, the event needs to recede into the background quickly and the far more imperative story of ensuring Biden doesn't get nominated again has the full attention of all Democrats.
 

Nicholas Lewis

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Biden seems determined but then you wouldn't expect anything less currently as he will want to control the timing if nothing else. So if he stands aside will it be Kamala Harris or Gavin Newsom or are there other suitable candidates.

One things for sure listening to podcast about what the Republican Trump party ticket is its going to make his first term look like an amateur production.
 

ld0595

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Biden has Parkinson's or similar, and as for the communist Kamala Harris...
Got anything yet to check back up Kamala Harris being a communist? Notice you've been kinda quiet on this comment! Genuinely interested to know.
 

railfan99

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Got anything yet to check back up Kamala Harris being a communist? Notice you've been kinda quiet on this comment! Genuinely interested to know.

See 'New York Post' of 2 November 2020

Kamala Harris’ ‘equality of outcome’ video slammed as communism pitch​


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Radical, I know, but the USA appears to be, in effect, two countries. The large cities and their wider urban areas (which are arguably the country's economic powerhouses) really don't seem to have much time for Trump and even less time for Project 2025 nonsense.

Aren't Texas and Florida the USA's 'economic powerhouses'?

Internal migration to the Sun Belt.

Both strongly Republican.

In contrast, the signs of decay in California, strongly Democratic. I've not been recently to San Francisco but media say it's overrun with (sadly) homeless people.
 
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AlterEgo

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See 'New York Post' of 2 November 2020

Kamala Harris’ ‘equality of outcome’ video slammed as communism pitch​

So one tabloid article then. Glad we can discount this now.
 
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