Thameslink services to East Grinstead

[LocoRoco]

Hi All,

Does anyone know if Thameslink services will be returning to East Grinstead? Pre-pandemic we had three trains in the morning and afternoon. This was then reduced to just one morning and afternoon train during Covid. And now, when everyone is supposed to be back in the office, Thameslink completely disappeared. Strangely enough, it shows in the timetables, just cancelled every day.

 

[OliverH68]

It appears to have run yesterday but not today for some reason. It's in the system to run daily until the 4th March. From the 7th they are in as Q paths so will run as required.

 

[Carlisle]

From the 7th they are in as Q paths so will run as required.

How’s it possible to operate a meaningful passenger timetable on an ‘as required’ basis ?

 

[Mcr Warrior]

It appears to have run yesterday but not today for some reason. It's in the system to run daily until the 4th March. From the 7th they are in as Q paths so will run as required.

"Q path"? What's that? A train that only runs as needed? Who decides, and what are the main considerations?

 

[BJames]

"Q path"? What's that? A train that only runs as needed? Who decides, and what are the main considerations?

Q Paths run only when required. There's a bit of info on it here: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/y-and-q-paths-section-5.180028/ and you can see an example of it on RTT here: https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C04598/2022-02-23/detailed (note RTT description at the top of this)

In this context - is Thameslink just not sure they've got enough staff to run it, so want to protect the path for when it returns in full? Or is it something completely different?

 

[OliverH68]

In this context - is Thameslink just not sure they've got enough staff to run it, so want to protect the path for when it returns in full? Or is it something completely different?

I very much suspect this to be the case.

 

[Carlisle]

Yes, me too.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Aren't they only running them this week to provide London Bridge service whilst the Haywards Heath blockade is on?

 

[v199629]

Keeping it as a Q path (it is in the WTT) prevents other operator or freight operating companies take up the path in current or future timetables. Obviously, Thameslink can decide to restore and run the service.

It is a similar situation to the SWR off-peak Waterloo to Waterloo (Via Hounslow) services

 

[RichJF]

I've seen chat on social media in the town that some station staff have mentioned the Thameslink services are to be withdrawn. Don't quote me as 100% gospel though.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

I've seen chat on social media in the town that some station staff have mentioned the Thameslink services are to be withdrawn. Don't quote me as 100% gospel though.

Would have thought commuters along this route won't be happy without a London Bridge service in the rush hour which is what TL provides.

 

[JonathanH]

Would have thought commuters along this route won't be happy without a London Bridge service in the rush hour which is what TL provides.

Something has to give though. The people of Caterham and Tattenham Corner no longer have a peak service to Victoria. Eastbourne and the Arun Valley no longer have high peak services from London Bridge.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Something has to give though. The people of Caterham and Tattenham Corner no longer have a peak service to Victoria. Eastbourne and the Arun Valley no longer have high peak services from London Bridge.

They will have to put London Bridge peaks on again city workers are going back and they are a big source of income even if they are going in only 3 days a week.

 

[JonathanH]

They will have to put London Bridge peaks on again city workers are going back and they are a big source of income even if they are going in only 3 days a week.

That income will be earned regardless of whether there are through trains to East Grinstead though. For the time being, they will need to change at East Croydon just as they do at other times of the day. Presumably, if numbers recover further, East Grinstead will come back. The interesting thing will be whether some of the peak extras run Tuesday and Thursday only or similar (but that is the worst of all worlds for the railway to have stock effectively used twice a week).

 

[Peregrine 4903]

I've seen chat on social media in the town that some station staff have mentioned the Thameslink services are to be withdrawn. Don't quote me as 100% gospel though.

This is incorrect.

 

[Stephen42]

It appears to have run yesterday but not today for some reason. It's in the system to run daily until the 4th March. From the 7th they are in as Q paths so will run as required.

This has now changed, from 28th Feb they are only down as Q paths. According to the Thameslink timetable page the East Grinstead services aren't running this week or next week onwards, wonder if it ran by mistake on Monday and was planned to be an on the day VSTP (Very Short Term Planning) cancellation.

Q Paths run only when required. There's a bit of info on it here: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/y-and-q-paths-section-5.180028/ and you can see an example of it on RTT here: https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:C04598/2022-02-23/detailed (note RTT description at the top of this)

In this context - is Thameslink just not sure they've got enough staff to run it, so want to protect the path for when it returns in full? Or is it something completely different?

Thameslink also have limited train planning capacity. My guess is to better use that resource the intention is the post blockade timetable lasts until the May timetable change without alterations. That's a long time away and driver availability/passenger numbers could change during that period. To allow more trains 40ish Q/"Runs as required" passenger services were submited along with the standard schedules, these would have been reviewed/accepted by Network Rail alongside the other paths. Now Thameslink/Great Northern can decide when or if to reintroduce them either with control calling the services in TRUST each day or removing the Q flag if that's easy to do.

This is similar to last year where services were introduced gradually, but went through the Short Term Planning process often getting resubmitted each week.