Thameslink Services/Timetable from May 20th 2018

[otomous]

Today's countless cancellations on GN are NOT the fault of the Canal Tunnels and driver training.

There has to be underlying staff issue at GN that is either staff unwilling to work OT and GN planning services expecting OT to be worked.

Or those who have said they would work deciding not to.

Or Unions exercising some power.

Oh the fabled “unions exercising some power” and those communist drivers “unwilling to work overtime.”

So easy to blame the people on the ground rather than investigate the government, the TOC, the whole ridiculous way our railways are structured and managed. After all, it worked during the DOO dispute and just about every other one. Media get press release blaming workforce, media repeat verbatim, repeat often enough and the masses believe it.

 

[Failed Unit]

Quite, once Brexit starts to have its effect the number of commuters will drop significantly meaning far less demand, this is a carefully orchestrated games by Grayling and chums.

Still need as many trains and drivers. It is just less standees that will change.

 

[Bromley boy]

Quite, once Brexit starts to have its effect the number of commuters will drop significantly meaning far less demand, this is a carefully orchestrated games by Grayling and chums.

I meant fewer than required to run a full service with no overtime being worked, rather than fewer overall (as LU does, drivers do a 5 day week with no overtime allowed. RMT/ASLEF actively support this as it means more jobs overall).

Many TOCs are so far below full establishment that any downturn in passenger numbers could be weathered extensively by just no longer offering overtime.

Overtime works both ways: just as drivers are not obliged to do it, so TOCs are not required to offer it.*

Last summer we had trains cancelled, managers out covering shifts and begging phone calls offering 5.5 hours overtime to do two trips. I’d imagine it’s the same everywhere.

*I haven’t done any for over a year and don’t intend to start!

 

[carriageline]

Quite, once Brexit starts to have its effect the number of commuters will drop significantly meaning far less demand, this is a carefully orchestrated games by Grayling and chums.

Question. (Serious one.) how will brexit have an effect on commuter numbers?

 

[bramling]

Question. (Serious one.) how will brexit have an effect on commuter numbers?

It probably won’t, although some people predict the world will end the day we leave the EU, with jobs galore being lost, and thus commuter journeys down.

In the longer term, any reduction in London population growth - to which an end to free movement could contribute - is likely to result in a slowing up of the numbers of people relocating out of London to the Home Counties. This won’t necessarily reduce numbers but it might mean there isn’t the apocalyptic level of commuting growth some predict - which would probably be a good thing.

 

[NorthKent1989]

People should really expect things to be a bit shaky in the first few weeks, Thameslink is a large network of main line suburban railways linked together by a small core, stop criticising and reserve judgment it will work out in the end

 

[bramling]

Oh the fabled “unions exercising some power” and those communist drivers “unwilling to work overtime.”

So easy to blame the people on the ground rather than investigate the government, the TOC, the whole ridiculous way our railways are structured and managed. After all, it worked during the DOO dispute and just about every other one. Media get press release blaming workforce, media repeat verbatim, repeat often enough and the masses believe it.

Even if it was down to unions, it’s still a failure to plan and manage by the DFT and GTR. How many years have they had to prepare for this? One wonders what exactly they were thinking - hoping for bad weather so more people did overtime? RailSham2020.

 

[bramling]

People should really expect things to be a bit shaky in the first few weeks, Thameslink is a large network of main line suburban railways linked together by a small core, stop criticising and reserve judgment it will work out in the end

I’m sure employers will be quite happy to be told that employee punctuality will be a bit shaky for a few weeks, and to stop criticising and reserve judgement.

No, people shouldn’t stop criticising. It should have worked. The deliverables had already been heavily descoped compared to what was initially promised. It’s not unreasonable to expect a published timetable to be delivered - it’s part of the basics of operating a railway.

I hope none of these people thinking this is acceptable work within the industry. It would be very concerning if that were the case.

 

[Failed Unit]

People should really expect things to be a bit shaky in the first few weeks, Thameslink is a large network of main line suburban railways linked together by a small core, stop criticising and reserve judgment it will work out in the end

What exactly have GTR done to plan for this? We are perfectly entitled to judge them. This is basic stuff they have failed to deliver. They know how many drivers they need to deliver the service. They haven’t trained enough. They have no plan B when things go wrong. Maybe it will work out. Maybe it will be the next operation princes. Whatever GTR have done nothing to be proud of and how Charles Horton can say to the press he has is beyond me.

As for lying to passengers- totally unacceptable. Shows total contempt. This weekends problems are staffing issues not engineering work.

 

[Class465fan]

People should really expect things to be a bit shaky in the first few weeks, Thameslink is a large network of main line suburban railways linked together by a small core, stop criticising and reserve judgment it will work out in the end

Will you still be saying that to the people that have probably lost their jobs due to Shameslink useless service?

 

[bramling]

Will you still be saying that to the people that have probably lost their jobs due to Shameslink useless service?

Like the term Shameslink. Shambleslink is even better, or should that be ShamblesLink/ ?

 

[Class465fan]

Like the term Shameslink. Shambleslink is even better, or should that be ShamblesLink/ ?

Sounds better.

 

[Failed Unit]

Will you still be saying that to the people that have probably lost their jobs due to Shameslink useless service?

This is Southern all over again.... many people did move jobs. Leisure travel nosedived. Maybe it is a cunning plan to hide the seat reductions.

 

[bramling]

Sounds better.

Not that there’s much of any Link/ going on at my local station. The through services have of course been abandoned for today, which has at least provided some kind of service. Still got the vile uncomfortable trains though, all ready for a 24tph service no one seems capable of delivering.

 

[Megafuss]

Like the term Shameslink. Shambleslink is even better, or should that be ShamblesLink/ ?

ThamesStink

 

[Class465fan]

Can't wait for the 24tph (yipee more chaos). In their bubble world that would work but not in reality. They can't even get this new timetable right...

 

[Class465fan]

ThamesStink

Better

 

[sefton]

Can't wait for the 24tph (yipee more chaos). In their bubble world that would work but not in reality. They can't even get this new timetable right...

I am not. Platforms A and B at St Pancras are struggling to cope now.

 

[Hadders]

People should really expect things to be a bit shaky in the first few weeks, Thameslink is a large network of main line suburban railways linked together by a small core, stop criticising and reserve judgment it will work out in the end

A bit shaky?!!

I dread to think what really bad would be in your world.

The implementation of the new timetable has been a complete disaster. The sad thing is many of us predicted this would happen and we were shouted down and told everything would be ok.

As if having fewer trains with fewer carriages and fewer seats taking longer to make the journey wasn’t bad enough we now have to play GTR bingo when trying to get to work. What time will I have to leave home to have a chance of getting to work on time.

 

[Failed Unit]

I am not. Platforms A and B at St Pancras are struggling to cope now.

Actually you raise an interesting point. I wonder if they will have a queuing system in place when the service collapses. A large concourse like kings cross struggles. Yes the load is spread but I can see some of those platforms getting dangerous.

 

[Hadders]

Actually you raise an interesting point. I wonder if they will have a queuing system in place when the service collapses. A large concourse like kings cross struggles. Yes the load is spread but I can see some of those platforms getting dangerous.

Agreed. I’d like to know what the plan is when an escalator gets taken out for maintenance. It’ll be a nightmare. You can queue departing passengers on the concourse but you can’t do that with arriving passengers.

 

[NorthKent1989]

ThamesStink

Like the term Shameslink. Shambleslink is even better, or should that be ShamblesLink/ ?

Will you still be saying that to the people that have probably lost their jobs due to Shameslink useless service?

PhlegmsStink anyone?

 

[radamfi]

Are they stopping Arun Valley trains at Ifield and Littlehaven today? Lots of 2-hour gaps in Thameslink service to Horsham today.

 

[NorthKent1989]

Can't wait for the 24tph (yipee more chaos). In their bubble world that would work but not in reality. They can't even get this new timetable right...

Thameslink should stick to 18-20tph at a push! 16tph would be too low I doubt it'll cope with 24tph

People should really expect things to be a bit shaky in the first few weeks, Thameslink is a large network of main line suburban railways linked together by a small core, stop criticising and reserve judgment it will work out in the end

If someone promised something big by a particular date, a date, years in anticipation then I would expect it to work on ckockwork on that very date!

 

[bramling]

Actually you raise an interesting point. I wonder if they will have a queuing system in place when the service collapses. A large concourse like kings cross struggles. Yes the load is spread but I can see some of those platforms getting dangerous.

I can picture it now. The northbound GN service delayed so platform full of those passengers, whilst all the St Albans lot turn up and raise hell at being held back when their service is running fine. Bet they will be the first ones complaining about the expanded service.

Farringdon I suspect could prove problematic at times with its narrow northbound platform, and those islands at London Bridge aren’t that wide either.

 

[MikeWM]

Avoided GN altogether today as I went to Norfolk instead... But the number of cancellations of the semi-fasts and slows from Cambridge, especially this morning, still looks alarming.

However, I do need to travel to London tomorrow. Any idea where Monday's 'planned' timetable might be? Railplan2020 site doesn't have it yet and no mention anywhere else that I can see. I assume it will be similar on paper to the theoretical version of Saturdays, but would have been nice if someone had confirmed that.

(I suspect I'll take the theoretical time hit and go on GA again, which will probably end up quicker in the end)

 

[paul332]

Frequency isn't the issue. 24 timetabled tph is perfectly doable with ATO, which can easily cope with 30tph so plenty of scope for recovery. The problem is availability of staff trained on the routes. In fact higher frequency will ease out-of-sequence passenger congestion as there'll be more trains to each destination (although fewer destinations would help - get rid of Rainham for a start). The industry just needs to focus on getting enough trained staff.

 

[Hadders]

Avoided GN altogether today as I went to Norfolk instead... But the number of cancellations of the semi-fasts and slows from Cambridge, especially this morning, still looks alarming.

However, I do need to travel to London tomorrow. Any idea where Monday's 'planned' timetable might be? Railplan2020 site doesn't have it yet and no mention anywhere else that I can see. I assume it will be similar on paper to the theoretical version of Saturdays, but would have been nice if someone had confirmed that.

(I suspect I'll take the theoretical time hit and go on GA again, which will probably end up quicker in the end)

Journey planners are showing trains running through the core tomorrow!!! I doubt that is right.

That said I've just checked NRE and it's showing some journeys as cancelled from Stevenage to St Pancras tomorrow morning eg. the 0732 service.

I suspect it'll be a case of playing GTR bingo in the morning.....

 

[jon0844]

Core trains from GN side won't run I'm sure. It's a repeat of the Saturday timetable I think

 

[jon0844]

Good to see today that Hatfield (which had a festival with over 14000 people) managed to get everyone home without any problems. Two 12 car 700s were stopped and it was amazing to see how they swallowed up 1700 people with ease. In fact, the last two coaches never even really got anyone in them as people didn't walk down that far!

SDO worked great, but clearly demonstrated that it could not work in regular service. For one, people don't all walk down. For two, anyone who wanted to alight would never be able to get through four coaches in time.. tonight, trains were held until everyone was on, so time wasn't an issue.