Thameslink Programme, South Central & South Eastern area fleet cascades etc

[thelem]

The seats are also free of supports near the aisles, so you can store bags under your seat and not fill up the aisle with luggage. A very well thought out train (Adtranz) that could perhaps be used as a model for future rolling stock here.

FCC have published mockups highlighting seats with no supports near the aisles, as a feature to aid cleaning.

Looking at the NGEMU technical spec (pdf) that seems to be covered by these two paragraphs:

It is a desirable requirement that the Unit interior floor be free from any fixed components that will obstruct, hinder and complicate cleaning.

The vehicle layout shall allow the use of industrial floor cleaning machines to access all
areas of floor.

Obviously not final at this early stage, but seats like that are being asked for.

 

[Edvid]

From Laurie at UKmodernEMU's states

Report from a friend who went round Derby on Friday 25/4: 377 501/2/4/7 sent to SR, 508 nearly ready to go; various under construction identifiable up to 516.
Also on hand: 378 002 (ready to go?), 006/009/011 complete; various coaches for 008/010/013/ 014/015; 001 and 005 already sent south).

Cheers for passing the update on, that gives us a better idea of the progress that's been made within the premises. Will add again that 505 was seen on the test track in the past, so I guess it'll be delivered after 508 which is due to leave Derby tonight (5X77 headcode as usual - will it be the first unit to be delivered on first planned date?) around 1853.

507 was on AC to MKC again last night, that makes it 3 in a row as it did the same the night before instead of the planned DC runs.

377/5s in service since:
501 - March 24
504 - March 30
502 - April 30

Almost forgot - the May 2009 timetable has been finalised and is now available.

The new timetable is more aesthetically pleasing IMO and sensibly they've added Bromley South and Sevenoaks to the Bedford-London-(wherever) sub-timetable.

The 5 temporary City terminators/starters are still in operation, and so is the Farringdon 'crowd-buster' - however the latter has swapped paths and station stops with the 1705 ex-Sevenoaks and is now just 4 cars. I've only skimmed through so there may be further alterations I haven't seen.

According to JKA, 209 is going through it's 'E' exam and should return to FCC soon. For those who don't know this was actually the first 377/2 assumed to be returned to Southern earlier so we'll see if the next unit returns to NSR as planned this weekend.

Further update: 5X77 was a non-runner yesterday :roll: so still only 4 units on the network. On the flip side, 502 was apparently in service today (starting with 1T39 1410 BDM-BTN - thanks again to JKA).

List of maiden service dates now updated.

 

[mackenzie_blu]

This 377/2 coming back is curious as Ive been told repeatly that we lost the unit and was due to lose a second on friday (something I'm not able to confirm). The only thing I can think of is because of the latest 377/5 delivery dates the deal with Southern may have been extended.

Here's the updated list of what timescales the 377/5 testing and delivery dates to the various depots.

Unit Number Selhurst Delivery Cauldwell Delivery Passenger service

377501 31/01/09 27/02/09 24/03/09
377502 04/04/09 28/04/09 29/04/09
377504 17/02/09 28/03/09 30/03/09
377507 22/04/09

 

[Edvid]

That's my thinking too. Interestingly all 8 hired 377/2s have been listed for today's services so we finally have 11 377s for 11 377 diagrams, but considering Bombardier has yet to start assembling any of the last 7 377/5s will we still be waiting for more after this year is up?

 

[westcoaster]

Might be another delivery tonight , 2053 of litchurch lane , according to GBRF GEN ta.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
Further gen to the aboth 66730 running as 5z77 heading north GBRF GEN

 

[Edvid]

And now running back South as 5X78 (correction - now shown as 5X77) with 377508 in tow according to se-gen. Thank goodness.

 

[mackenzie_blu]

That's my thinking too. Interestingly all 8 hired 377/2s have been listed for today's services so we finally have 11 377s for 11 377 diagrams, but considering Bombardier has yet to start assembling any of the last 7 377/5s will we still be waiting for more after this year is up?

No we dont have to wait till 2010 but by the time FCC have all 23 377/5 the summer holidays will be over. Thats according to the last delivery dates for all units and even that had sliped by a futher week when I was given a date!

With this 5th 377/5 one 377/2 should return to Southern by mid June then. Interestingly this seems to go nwith the orignal 377/2 dates tho a month later and should fit with the latest Bombarbier estimate.

 

[73110]

Went past one being delivered at Gypsy Hill well into the small hours of this morning.

Subsequently going home this morning the train (GBRF 66 and two barrier wagons either end.) was dumped behind the new shed at Selhurst.

Anyone know if it was 05 or 08?

 

[mackenzie_blu]

Went past one being delivered at Gypsy Hill well into the small hours of this morning.

Subsequently going home this morning the train (GBRF 66 and two barrier wagons either end.) was dumped behind the new shed at Selhurst.

Anyone know if it was 05 or 08?

As above, been reported at 7508

 

[Edvid]

Although too early to say, it appears that the 377/5s on test are now doing AC mileage before DC mileage (well OK they all start from Selhurst ). Following gen by JKA:

377508 made its maiden voyage last night
Coupled to 377507 on
5Z30 21+30 Selhurst depot to Milton Keynes
5Z31 23+47 Milton Keynes - Kensington Olympia
5Z32 00+54 Kensington Olympia to Milton Keynes
5Z33 02+06 Milton Keynes - Selhurst depot.

377507 today going to Cauldwell, presume to be made
ready for traffic
5Z21 10+00 Bedford to Three Bridges (377502) being diverted into
Selhurst depot to attach, then both units on
5Z22 12+39 Selhurst depot to Bedford Cauldwell.

 

[westcoaster]

also this evening there was a move booked for 2x377 back to selhurst. it was 2x377/2's

 

[Edvid]

They were 203 and 208. 203 has been noted in service with FCC this week but 208 may have returned to NSR. 209 I'm not sure about.

Oh, and 505 is currently in tow with 66730 doing the honours.

 

[mackenzie_blu]

Current status of the Electrostars on TL

377206/213 & 207/204 went to Gillingham
377203 & 377201 went to Ashford International

377501/507 in a pair today
504 solo, all three on Bedford - Brighton runs today with 504 doing its first evening run with 2T66.

508 is at Selhurst and now seems 505 is en route to join it. Seems Bombarbier are back on track. (cue it all going wrong now).

 

[Evvy73]

377505 was sitting at Selhurst depot as I came past at about 7:55am this morning. As stated by Edvid, 66730 looked to have delivered it and was still attached.

 

[Edvid]

The current situation is as follows (including a couple of altered dates):

Unit Number; Selhurst Delivery; Cauldwell Delivery; Passenger service

377501 31/01/09 27/02/09 24/03/09
377502 04/04/09 28/04/09 30/04/09
377504 17/02/09 10/03/09 30/03/09
377505 15/05/09 T B C T B C
377507 22/04/09 08/05/09 11/05/09
377508 05/05/09 T B C T B C

Another 377/2 handback day approaches - for the next 4 weeks FCC will still have at least 3 such units but with 99 diagrams they'll need at least 5 of them during that period (then 4 and 3 as 508 and 505 are brought in).

 

[mackenzie_blu]

377201/203 returned to Selhurst tonight as 5Z69 leaving Bedford at 2028 and arriving at 2200. The units were 6mins early through Blackfriars at 2119 (booked for 2125)

This leaves the units as

377201 Selhurst
377203 Selhurst
277204 Victoria Shed
377206 *
377207 Victoria Shed
377213 *
377501 Ashford
377502 Cauldwell
377504 Cauldwell
377505 Selhurst (for commissioning)
377507 Ashford
377508 Selhurst (for commissioning)

* units 377206/213 were booked to be 1E74 Ashford International but the unit was short formed. I didn't get to see what unit actually went to Ashford so I don't have that information.

317 on Thameslink

We all expected there to be no 317 with this timetable change but the new unit diagrams states a single 317/0 diagram BO 901 vaild until 09/10/09

Cricklewood depot 1659 as 5A73
reverse at Moorgate
Moorgate 1816 as 5A73
Farringdon 1818 as 2G48
Bedford 1934
the runs as 5G48 to Cricklewood (2030 a.) and stables by 2101

 

[westcoaster]

377508 is at bedford cauldwell must have arriver last night/ very early morning.

 

[mackenzie_blu]

377508 is at bedford cauldwell must have arriver last night/ very early morning.

I had a feeling that was going to happen. Its likely to have been the last unit northbound before the core block came into affect. Good news then as its likely the unit will be in service by mid week. That gives FCC 9 Electrostars then.

**edit**

Thinking about it, isn't it abit soon for 508 to be commisioned. The units normally take a couple of weeks get get the mileage up? 508 was only delivered on the 5th May, that 10 days until it arrives at Bedford. Unless they are doing some final testing on the MML. Wouldn't hurt to test it at Farringdon a few times with all the 377/2 issues there.

Note as well that the diagrammed units from March was for 8 377 diagrams. As from sunday this increases to 15 diagrams. They stable overnight at the following locations;

2x Ashford E berthing sidings
2x Ashford down yard
5x Bedford CS
4x Bedford Cauldwell
2x Victoria CS

Also there is booked 2h 20mins stabling at Preston Park as well for diagram 612. The unit will be there from 1016 till 1436. This will happen on a daily basis once all 15 diagrams are filled, ie when theres 15-17 377/5 in services which should be about June/July.

 

[westcoaster]

377201/203 returned to Selhurst tonight as 5Z69 leaving Bedford at 2028 and arriving at 2200. The units were 6mins early through Blackfriars at 2119 (booked for 2125)

This leaves the units as

377201 Selhurst
377203 Selhurst
277204 Victoria Shed
377206 *
377207 Victoria Shed
377213 *
377501 Ashford
377502 Cauldwell
377504 Cauldwell
377505 Selhurst (for commissioning)
377507 Ashford
377508 Selhurst (for commissioning)

* units 377206/213 were booked to be 1E74 Ashford International but the unit was short formed. I didn't get to see what unit actually went to Ashford so I don't have that information.

317 on Thameslink

We all expected there to be no 317 with this timetable change but the new unit diagrams states a single 317/0 diagram BO 901 vaild until 09/10/09

Cricklewood depot 1659 as 5A73
reverse at Moorgate
Moorgate 1816 as 5A73
Farringdon 1818 as 2G48
Bedford 1934
the runs as 5G48 to Cricklewood (2030 a.) and stables by 2101

not sure about those units being where you say as there are 2x 377/2's + 1x377/5 in bedford carriage sidings, and 2x377/5 's (502+508) at cauldwell.

also the 2x317's have returned to the GN, and have been replaced by 317338 seen stabbled at cricklewod.

 

[mackenzie_blu]

Interesting. All said after 5Z69 there were three empty 8 car 319 moves through the Core south. This is simlar to what happened prior to the last timetable. All I can said on a normal week this is where the units should be.

The above information is based on what the units were actually running. It could be a case that 377201/203 went to Selhurst in exchange for 2x 377/2 from Southern. 5Z69 arrived at Selhurst minutes before I went home so if there was a move northwards I wasn't present when it happened.

Can anyone confirm whats at Ashford and Victoria sheds? If 508 really was deliveried then thats 10 days after delivery to Selhurst to arrival at Cauldwell. That seems rather quick.

 

[westcoaster]

the stableing at preston park will not hapen as the unit is to be used for driver training runs from brighton, iirc 377508 was out getting the miles under its belt within 24 hours of delivery, so it could be plausable the mileage is complete, or the mileage could have been revised.

 

[mackenzie_blu]

the stableing at preston park will not hapen as the unit is to be used for driver training runs from brighton, iirc 377508 was out getting the miles under its belt within 24 hours of delivery, so it could be plausable the mileage is complete, or the mileage could have been revised.

I hoping its a case of that, the unit has completed its testing quickly as Southern get to grips with commissioning the new units.

The stabling at preston Park will likely be done once the drivers are fully trained. Im only quoting actual diagrams here that are planned. At the moment theres nine 377 for 11 diagrams.

Below are all the planned departures of 377 from Bedford station. Please note that they are planned when all 11 diagrams are forefilled. Wont be awhile but this is the most likely times you'll see a 377 once FCC has 11 units.

The headcodes for the Southeastern joint services to Gillingham and Ashford international have changed.

The information below is headcode, departure from Bedford, destination and arrival at destination time.

2A04 02:10 St Pancras International 03:22
2W03 03:40 Brighton 06:32
2T05 04:10 Brighton 06:46
2T07 04:20 Brighton 06:59
1T05 05:40 Brighton 08:06
2T13 06:00 Brighton 08:27
1W84 06:56 Brighton 09:19
2T25 08:54 Brighton 11:17
5G81 09:34 Bedford Cauldwell Depot 09:54
1T21 09:40 Brighton 11:54
1T23 10:10 Brighton 12:24
5G12 10:14 Bedford Cauldwell Depot 10:16
5W16 10:56 Bedford Cauldwell Depot 11:15
2T35 11:24 Brighton 13:49
2T29 11:40 Brighton 13:54
5T39 11:54 Bedford North Sidings 11:55
2T39 12:24 Brighton 14:49
5G47 13:54 Bedford North Sidings 13:55
1T39 14:10 Brighton 16:25
2T47 14:24 Brighton 16:49
5G34 14:46 Bedford Cauldwell Depot 14:48
2T49 14:54 Brighton 17:17
5G36 15:16 Bedford Cauldwell Depot 15:18
1S03 16:22 Gillingham 18:34
5G30 16:23 Bedford North Sidings 16:24
2T57 16:32 Brighton 19:02
5G76 16:40 Bedford North Sidings 16:41
1N43 16:46 Ashford International 19:37
1S05 17:00 Gillingham 19:16
1T53 17:34 Brighton 19:59
5G97 20:10 Bedford Cauldwell Depot 20:30
5G56 20:14 Bedford Cauldwell Depot 20:16
2A24 22:10 St Pancras International 23:22
5G64 22:18 Bedford Cauldwell Depot 22:38
5T66 22:44 Bedford Cauldwell Depot 22:46
5T56 22:56 Bedford Cauldwell Depot 22:58
5G74 00:44 Bedford Cauldwell Depot 00:46

 

[jon0844]

Is there a thread, or a way to find out what's happening come tomorrow on the GN side with the new 321s? How many have they now got? I've seen two with FCC colours (one with full livery, one just purple) and I think another 321 that is presumably being covered with vinyl.

That's 3 out of 5. Will they have them all for Monday and what services will they be running on?

 

[mackenzie_blu]

Is there a thread, or a way to find out what's happening come tomorrow on the GN side with the new 321s? How many have they now got? I've seen two with FCC colours (one with full livery, one just purple) and I think another 321 that is presumably being covered with vinyl.

That's 3 out of 5. Will they have them all for Monday and what services will they be running on?

FCC GN have got four 321's. 321401/402/404/404 if I remember right.

 

[MCR247]

FCC GN have got four 321's. 321401/402/404/404 if I remember right.

so now theres to 321s numbered 404.......

 

[Aictos]

FCC GN have got four 321's. 321401/402/404/404 if I remember right.

I think you will find it's 321401/402/403/404 and I think 321405.

 

[mackenzie_blu]

I think you will find it's 321401/402/403/404 and I think 321405.

I forgot you guys got 20 carriages. Blame the fact Im stuck neck deep in 377 diagrams. Just putting together a 377 timetable including empty stock movements with station times. Hopefully a few people will find it interesting.

 

[Aictos]

I forgot you guys got 20 carriages. Blame the fact Im stuck neck deep in 377 diagrams. Just putting together a 377 timetable including empty stock movements with station times. Hopefully a few people will find it interesting.

I for one will find it interesting, both for personal use and also as a reference in the office to use.

Talking of which, I've downloaded one of your tube maps and will be using it in the office if I can find the room...

 

[westcoaster]

377508 entred passenger earning service this morning coupled to 377502, she is now running solo on the 1124 ex bedford.

 

[Edvid]

Good Lord, that was quick. Only 13 days after delivery this time...

Just out of interest, which train failed at Farringdon this morning?