Thameslink - Expecting a letter....

[thebrood62]

Afternoon all

To my eternal chagrin I legitimately forgot to buy an off peak return ticket this morning on the thameslink app on my commute into London from Surrey. I am able to prove from hundreds of e-ticket emails (dating back to last summer) that I ALWAYS buy a ticket for the same return route and this was and is a genuine case of forgetfulness.

Of course, given that this never ever happens, a guard boarded at some stage of the journey, and of course he asked me for my ticket which told him, honestly, I forgot to buy. Bought one (usual return ticket) on the thameslink app while he was talking about a £20 fine and showed him. Apparently as it was purchased after the event, the situation now escalates and I am waiting for a letter from Thameslink to discuss next steps. I was cautioned and given the whole "saying something you later rely in court" shpeel which seemed a bit over the top. It wasn't clear that buying a ticket there and then would land me in this situation (if he did tell me I was spiralling and trying get the ticket on the app) if I'd known I clearly would have just paid the fine and put it down to a life lesson but hey, so much for trying to do the right thing.....(and one wonders if he could have used a bit of common sense/discretion and let it slide)

I did show the guard proof that I have bought tickets in the past (including every day this week) and that it was a genuine case of forgetfulness (whilst there are no barriers at the station I joined at, there are in London so the idea I was deliberately evading a fare is fanciful as I'd have had to get through at the other end...again ticket receipts will prove I do this journey a few times a week over many years) but he calmly and politely went through the motions and gave me a witness statement receipt.

Just wondered if anyone has experienced anything similar and what I can expect please? Never been in this situation before and am worried I'm going to end up in court/fined a terrific amount for a moment's lapse in concentration.

Many thanks in advance.

 

[JBuchananGB]

You can at least use the ticket you have purchased for travel on your return journey. The railway company will receive the report from the inspector and write to you about it. They will investigate your ticket history, and if they find evidence of short faring etc, they may take the matter further. If you are otherwise squeaky clean, then the will probably offer to settle with you for the single fare you forgot to pay, plus an admin fee. If you hadn't gone and bought a ticket there and then, which is the classic behaviour of the "pay-when-challenged" fare evasion brigade, you may have been issued with a Penalty Fare for the "forgotten" fare plus £100 (£50 if paid promptly). But that ship has sailed.

 

[thebrood62]

Thanks JBuchananGB. I have an unimpeachable record of buying the same ticket for the same journey over a number of weeks, months and years which is demonstrable so my conscience is clean.

How far back do they check? I got clipped for sitting in first class without a valid ticket (was in the wrong end of the train...didn't realise only the rear is declassified) before Covid and paid a fine on the spot. Would that go against me?

It's so just so so annoying that an uncharacteristic absence of engaging brain has caused all this procedural hell.

 

[WesternLancer]

Thanks JBuchananGB. I have an unimpeachable record of buying the same ticket for the same journey over a number of weeks, months and years which is demonstrable so my conscience is clean.

How far back do they check? I got clipped for sitting in first class without a valid ticket (was in the wrong end of the train...didn't realise only the rear is declassified) before Covid and paid a fine on the spot. Would that go against me?

It's so just so so annoying that an uncharacteristic absence of engaging brain has caused all this procedural hell.

sounds like that was a Penalty Fare? Unlikely that this would have any significant impact on being able to resolve this - although unfortunately you might have to pay a bit more than a Penalty Fare to resolve it

You just need to make sure you get the letter they will send (usually hard copy) and you respond to it - see other thread son here for examples

 

[SussexMan]

I am able to prove from hundreds of e-ticket emails (dating back to last summer) that I ALWAYS buy a ticket for the same return route and this was and is a genuine case of forgetfulness.

I have an unimpeachable record of buying the same ticket for the same journey over a number of weeks, months and years which is demonstrable so my conscience is clean.

This may well be the first time that you have forgotten to buy a ticket, but would suggest you re-think your statements especially when you reply to the letter you receive. I am bemused that you think you can prove that you always buy a ticket. I think you can only prove that you have bought the tickets you have bought. How do you propose to prove that on days you didn't buy a ticket, you didn't travel?

Other than today's episode your conscience may well, and rightly, be clear, but to suggest that your record is unimpeachable is some statement.

Looking back into the history of tickets is not really relevant if it isn't an issue about railcards or short-faring. All your history will show is that you have bought some tickets and I'm uncertain how that could lead to anything. I would simply look to apologise for this instance because I really can't see what your history would show.

 

[thebrood62]

Thanks Westernlancer. I'm hoping this is pretty open and shut. It's being a slave to process that I hate the most and the threat of a financial penalty down the line for what was genuinely an honest mistake.

I can see from elsewhere on this forum that the timescale can be up to 4 months before a letter is sent and eceived.

In advance of this...will they investigate the case at all or does the letter just go straight out the door?

GTR will see that on my debit card and via Thameslink app (to what level do they have a look at things and how far would they bother going back?) that I have consistently bought the same ticket multiple times a week over the course of the last few years as and when I've travelled into London. It simply isn't plausible that I'd "take a chance" on one day out of all of those weeks, months and years, because -either way- I wouldn't get through the barriers at London Bridge or any of the terminals without a ticket would I? It's utterly rotten luck that on the rarest of occasions I've encountered upon a ticket inspector I didn't have one. I was honest and calm. I showed him the email receipts of journeys I've bought and paid for in the dozens and asked if he'd mention this in his report. Whether he does or not.....

The most annoying thing of all is that if I hadn't bought a ticket in front of them there and then to try and make good, then I'd have merely been clipped for £20 which would have been annoying BUT wouldn't have resulted in this uncertainty and stress.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 1 Oct 2025 ==

This may well be the first time that you have forgotten to buy a ticket, but would suggest you re-think your statements especially when you reply to the letter you receive. I am bemused that you think you can prove that you always buy a ticket. I think you can only prove that you have bought the tickets you have bought. How do you propose to prove that on days you didn't buy a ticket, you didn't travel?

Other than today's episode your conscience may well, and rightly, be clear, but to suggest that your record is unimpeachable is some statement.

Looking back into the history of tickets is not really relevant if it isn't an issue about railcards or short-faring. All your history will show is that you have bought some tickets and I'm uncertain how that could lead to anything. I would simply look to apologise for this instance because I really can't see what your history would show.

Thanks SussexMan. I take your points on board. I guess my point is I hope that the mitigating circumstances are that they will see I spend thousands of pounds a year on GTR -mainly only ever this return journey at roughly the same times - and that there is some degree of leniency or discretion is applied.

I guess I just want someone to tell me that the under £20 fare that I genuinely forgot to pay via the app -once- isn't going to stop me from buying Christmas presents this year if I can prove to them that I am a regular squeaky clean customer...!

 

[WesternLancer]

Thanks Westernlancer. I'm hoping this is pretty open and shut. It's being a slave to process that I hate the most and the threat of a financial penalty down the line for what was genuinely an honest mistake.

I can see from elsewhere on this forum that the timescale can be up to 4 months before a letter is sent and eceived.

In advance of this...will they investigate the case at all or does the letter just go straight out the door?

GTR will see that on my debit card and via Thameslink app (to what level do they have a look at things and how far would they bother going back?) that I have consistently bought the same ticket multiple times a week over the course of the last few years as and when I've travelled into London. It simply isn't plausible that I'd "take a chance" on one day out of all of those weeks, months and years, because -either way- I wouldn't get through the barriers at London Bridge or any of the terminals without a ticket would I? It's utterly rotten luck that on the rarest of occasions I've encountered upon a ticket inspector I didn't have one. I was honest and calm. I showed him the email receipts of journeys I've bought and paid for in the dozens and asked if he'd mention this in his report. Whether he does or not.....

The most annoying thing of all is that if I hadn't bought a ticket in front of them there and then to try and make good, then I'd have merely been clipped for £20 which would have been annoying BUT wouldn't have resulted in this uncertainty and stress.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 1 Oct 2025 ==


Thanks SussexMan. I take your points on board. I guess my point is I hope that the mitigating circumstances are that they will see I spend thousands of pounds a year on GTR -mainly only ever this return journey at roughly the same times - and that there is some degree of leniency or discretion is applied.

I guess I just want someone to tell me that the under £20 fare that I genuinely forgot to pay via the app -once- isn't going to stop me from buying Christmas presents this year if I can prove to them that I am a regular squeaky clean customer...!

Well the Penalty Fares are now £50 and it’s not automatic that they issue one as the staff can report anyone without a ticket for investigation and indeed do.

Likewise they could have probably given you a £50 penalty fare for this.

No idea if they look into this much before writing to you. Probably look over the inspectors notes and then generate the standard letter you typically see on here. Have a look for one if you’ve not seen it already.

Given your purchase history you can say something like ‘this was a genuine oversight on this occasion and please be assured there was no deliberate intention to evade my fare’ or some such wording.

 

[JBuchananGB]

It doesn't matter how many times you drive past a speed camera at 29mph, the day you go past at 35 it'll get you. It doesn't matter how many times you leave car park after 59 minutes when you've paid for an hour, the day you leave after 61 minutes it'll get you. It doesn't matter how many times you've travelled with the right tickets, the day you forget, they've got you. Just wait for the letter, reply apologetically, hopefully you'll be offered a settlement.

 

[thebrood62]

sounds like that was a Penalty Fare? Unlikely that this would have any significant impact on being able to resolve this

Is this the sort of thing that would be flagged when they do a search of my history? It must have been 7+ years ago.

 

[WesternLancer]

Is this the sort of thing that would be flagged when they do a search of my history? It must have been 7+ years ago.

Possibly it would be (tho the time ago probably reduces the chances of that) - but I don't think it will result in any significant chance of you not getting to resolve the matter without court action.
You can see from other threads they resolve on going deliberate fare evasion without prosecution if people co-operate with them and pay the fares owed.

 

[thebrood62]

It doesn't matter how many times you drive past a speed camera at 29mph, the day you go past at 35 it'll get you. It doesn't matter how many times you leave car park after 59 minutes when you've paid for an hour, the day you leave after 61 minutes it'll get you. It doesn't matter how many times you've travelled with the right tickets, the day you forget, they've got you. Just wait for the letter, reply apologetically, hopefully you'll be offered a settlement.

Accept your point, but the key difference is that I have long term evidence that I figuratively do regularly drive through at 29mph, I do often leave the car park after 59 minutes and plenty of consistent e-ticket receipts that demonstrate I am a regular customer.

I am certain that, on this basis, I can prove it was an honest error or at least that a reasonable person would view it that way. The most frustrating thing of all is that I didn't realise I'd land myself in this by buying my usual return ticket in front of the guard. It wasn't as if I did it just before he appeared and got found out that way, I literally told him I'd forgotten to buy a ticket (appreciate probably not the first time he's heard that so he did what he had to do) but then set about trying to make amends on the app.

 

[DeverseSam]

Accept your point, but the key difference is that I have long term evidence that I figuratively do regularly drive through at 29mph, I do often leave the car park after 59 minutes and plenty of consistent e-ticket receipts that demonstrate I am a regular customer.

But you don’t have a season ticket which many commuters do.

On the point about barriered stations, the Channel 5 series described here gives clues on how people get through, so using London Bridge maybe doesn’t support your argument:

A New Series of "Fare Dodgers At War With the Law..."

Well, that answers the mystery from a few months ago, then...

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[John R]

Accept your point, but the key difference is that I have long term evidence that I figuratively do regularly drive through at 29mph, I do often leave the car park after 59 minutes and plenty of consistent e-ticket receipts that demonstrate I am a regular customer.

I am certain that, on this basis, I can prove it was an honest error or at least that a reasonable person would view it that way. The most frustrating thing of all is that I didn't realise I'd land myself in this by buying my usual return ticket in front of the guard. It wasn't as if I did it just before he appeared and got found out that way, I literally told him I'd forgotten to buy a ticket (appreciate probably not the first time he's heard that so he did what he had to do) but then set about trying to make amends on the app.

From what we see here, whether it is an "honest error" or deliberate has very little difference in the outcome in simple cases like this. Provided you cooperate you will be offered an out of court settlement which will cost you an admin fee of maybe £150 (it does vary though) and the cost of a full price ticket. A bit like being caught doing 35 in a 30 - doesn't matter whether it was accidental or deliberate, the outcome is the same.

 

[AlterEgo]

They really don't care how much money you spend. Lots of people spend a lot of money on trains, find it abhorrent and expensive, and find ways to cheat the system where they can as a way of exacting some sort of justice by committing what they see as a victimless crime. Your purchase history will show that you do buy tickets, often, but it will not prove you do it on every journey you ever take - that would be impossible to do. As others have said, arriving at a barriered station isn't proof you don't or can't evade fares there; there's the reacharound trick, tailgating, plus one other tactic which is less well known and which I will not divulge publicly.

GTR don't care. They caught you this time and they will charge you the cost of a full fare ticket plus their administration fee of around £150. That is about the long and short of it I'm afraid. It is just like the speeding camera - it is not relevant if you pass the same camera 1000 times at 29mph, when you fly past by accident at 37, you will get punished regardless of whether you are passing it with a grimace at being careless or an evil smile as you press the accelerator harder to drive as manically as possible.

 

[WesternLancer]

I’m not sure the ongoing discussion about past record of tickets is helping much here.

There is ample evidence on other threads that GTR are very likely to accept a request to settle without court action and seem to do so without requiring extensive mitigating information if they believe an honest and cooperative response is made.

 

[thebrood62]

Afternoon all. Got my letter this week. ....(attached and redacted).

Offence (on page 3 not attached) is "did enter a train for the purpose of travelling on the railway and upon inspection at (station) did not produce a valid ticket entitling travel.

Thanks in advance for your advice and guidance, my intended response (which I will send recorded 1st class) is below.

----

Dear Fare Evasion Manager

Firstly, I would like to apologise for my unintended actions which have led to this scenario.

The truth of the matter is, I made the very rare mistake of forgetting to buy a ticket via the Thameslink app before I boarded the train, and only realised my error when I was approached by the inspector.

In a panic, while he told me I was due a fine, I bought a ticket in front of him (under the false impression that this was the right thing to do) and was then told the situation would be "escalated" as I'd bought a ticket "after the event". I was not previously aware of these rules, but am now.

Whilst this was going on, I tried to show him my purchasing history which demonstrates I am a regular paying traveller from _____ to ______ and have been for many years. Whilst appearing sympathetic, I respect he had a duty to carry out and he told me I would have the opportunity to put my side of the story to you.

There was never an intent on my part to dodge the fare. I cannot explain what led me to forget to do what I do every time I travel, but I simply forgot. The money from my fare that would normally have landed in Thameslink's bank account before my journey began did so minutes later. That being said, I appreciate that I have inadvertently broken a rule and must accept the consequences.

To that end, I would prefer to keep this matter out of court and pay an associated fine or investigation costs. I have since set an alarm on my phone to remind me to buy a ticket via the app before I set off to travel so this will not happen again.

My sincerest apologies and thanks for your understanding.


Regards



____

 

[jfollows]

I suggest:

Shorten this.

You didn’t have a valid ticket, you now know that you didn’t and you won’t do it again.

You want to pay any unpaid fares plus their investigation costs.

If you settle out of court there is no “fine”.

 

[thebrood62]

Thank you so much for your response, jfollows. I am keen to impress upon them that this was a genuine case of forgetfulness (I know how it looks but that is the truth...my conscience is clear on that front.)

*

Dear Fare Evasion Manager

Firstly, I would like to say sorry for my unintended actions which have led to this scenario.

The truth of the matter is, I made the very rare mistake of forgetting to buy a ticket via the Thameslink app before I boarded the train at ______, and only realised my error when I was approached by the inspector.

I realise now that, despite trying to make amends in the moment, buying a ticket "after the event", as he put it, was the wrong thing to do. I have since set an alarm on my phone to remind me to buy a ticket via the app before I set off to travel so this will not happen again. You will see from my records that I am a regular customer before and since this highly regrettable incident.

To that end, I would prefer to keep this matter out of court please and am prepared to pay any unpaid fares plus your investigation costs.

My sincerest apologies and thanks for your understanding.


Regards


___

 

[jfollows]

All this stuff about “very rare mistake“ and “regular customer” is about justifying this to yourself, in my view, they won’t care, stick to the facts. I don’t want to appear harsh, but excuses won’t help you.

Just say you messed up, you realise you did, and you won’t do it again.

 

[thebrood62]

Thanks jfollows. I accept that it won't help me necessarily, but is it not better to demonstrate my contrition rather than appear arrogant/not to care in being blunt/to the point?

----

Dear Fare Evasion Manager

Firstly, I would like to say how sorry I am for my unintended actions which have led to this highly regrettable scenario.

The truth of the matter is, I forgot to buy a ticket via the Thameslink app before I boarded the train at ______, and only realised my error when I was approached by the inspector.

I realise now that, despite trying to make amends in the moment, buying a ticket "after the event", as he put it, was the wrong thing to do. I have since set an alarm on my phone to remind me to buy a ticket via the app before I set off to travel so this will not happen again.

To that end, I would prefer to keep this matter out of court please and am prepared to pay any unpaid fares plus your investigation costs.

My sincerest apologies and thanks for your understanding.


Regards

 

[jfollows]

I think your proposed letter is fine.
Good luck!

 

[z444z]

I would be grateful to settle this matter out of court and am prepared to pay the fare due as well as your investigation costs.

Changed the wording here very slightly, other than that it looks good to me.

 

[thebrood62]

Changed the wording here very slightly, other than that it looks good to me.

Thanks z444z.

Will post it recorded tomorrow and let you know the outcome, any further points (if considered necessary) would be very gratefully received.

For the benefit of those who are tracking turnaround times, this incident was at the start of October and the letter was received today (dated yesterday). Having initially been told by GTR they were operating on a four month turnaround basis, it seems they've clawed a little bit of time back.

Many thanks all.

 

[thebrood62]

Afternoon all. Pleased to report that GTR offered a settlement of just shy of £70 which I have now paid.

My conscience was always absolutely clear, it was a legitimate case of forgetfulness as demonstrable by my purchasing history and patterns, but I did end up in an anxiety/catastrophising doom spiral because you just expect the worst. From what I've seen on this forum and of other cases, thameslink do indeed appear to be receptive to co-operation so if you're in a similar boat try not to over-think it too much or lose sleep. Honesty does seem to be the best policy. It's just the waiting and wondering and being a slave to process that is so unsettling.

A big THANK YOU to those who offered advice and who provided some much needed calm and re-assurance.

Lesson learned!

Timeline

Incident: Weds 1st October
Letter received from Thameslink: Tues 13th Jan (dated 12th Jan)
Response sent to Thameslink: Weds 14th Jan (next day signed for)
Settlement letter received: Weds 21st Jan (dated 19th Jan)

 

[z444z]

Thanks for the update, glad to hear it’s sorted!