Ok then,Chunnel? U mean channel tunnel?
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Thameslink/ Class 700 Progress
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Goldfish62
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I certainly read that this was the case.
Peter Mugridge
Veteran Member
Yes - I'm showing my age a bit there as that's what it was called a lot in the media around the time it was being built and opened!
BRX
Established Member
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As a loop resident - yes I would prefer that! Also if the loop service were independent of the rest of thameslink we might get a more reliable service.
Something like
Units in UK - 700001-46/101-26/8-32/4/6-45
Units to come 700047-60/127/33/35/46-55
Used in service so far - 700001-46/101-25/8/39/40/3
Currently part of testing / training fleet 700015/19/110/37
In store
Horsham 700102/24/32/6/8/45
Peterborough 700111/16/40
Hove 700129
Leaving the following at Three Bridges or Hornsey
700130/1/4/5/41/2/4
Presumably a few of the units at Horsham enter service on Monday.
Units in UK - 700001-46/101-26/8-32/4/6-45
Units to come 700047-60/127/33/35/46-55
Used in service so far - 700001-46/101-25/8/39/40/3
Currently part of testing / training fleet 700015/19/110/37
In store
Horsham 700102/24/32/6/8/45
Peterborough 700111/16/40
Hove 700129
Leaving the following at Three Bridges or Hornsey
700130/1/4/5/41/2/4
Presumably a few of the units at Horsham enter service on Monday.
Ok,no problem
Oo,thanks for posting this
Yes, first workings are
1H80 0552 Littlehampton to London Bridge
2C78 0633 Horsham to London Bridge
1H82 0629 Littlehampton to London Bridge
1H80 feeds into one of the existing Brighton off-peak diagrams, the other two work to Horsham off peak and then go back to Littlehampton in the evening peak.
1H91 1657 London Bridge to Littlehampton
1H95 1741 London Bridge to Littlehampton
There is a balancing empty stock working from Three Bridges to Horsham later.
Fincra5
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I do wonder if both 1st Class sections will be in use, given how popular 1st is on the what was the 3x4car 377s.
Interesting, thanks. I did notice that 1H99 the 1810 London Bridge to Littlehampton service is still a Southern service (and presumably still 12-377). I wonder if any people unhappy with the new trains and change in 'operator' may migrate temporarily to this service rather than the two before.
RichJF
Member
The 0803 London Bridge to Horsham TL only had 1 of the first class sections in use today.
Stew998
Member
Judging by some unhappy tweets today from some quite understandably hacked off customers this appears to be the case.
RUFJAN15
Member
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I ventured out early this morning to see the first TL departure (in passenger service) from Horsham. 700145 did the honours on the 06.33 to London Bridge, so that's another FLU in use.
Timekeeping today has been pretty dire; the best TL service on the London Bridge - Horsham route arrived 8m late, with others 10m-20m down and one curtailed at Three Bridges 27m late. Mind you, to be fair the Southern 377 services on the route have been equally bad today.
Bishopstone
Established Member
Did these new 700 diagrams run with OBS/Hosts, in the end, or just the driver?
bengley
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They had TL RPOs (now passenger hosts) on them
tsr
Established Member
Services were severely disrupted due to fourteen coaches of 377 stock managing to get stranded on a dead section of track at Bricklayers Arms Junction near London Bridge (partly owing to NR not investigating power supply issues and only testing the third rail once the rescue train also got stuck...). In fact, the trains have had to have a driver babysitting them all day, until repairs are done tonight.
This was basically nothing to do with the 700 rollout - indeed GTR Control spent some time working out ways to protect the evening 700 diagrams on the Littlehampton route from being cancelled...
This was basically nothing to do with the 700 rollout - indeed GTR Control spent some time working out ways to protect the evening 700 diagrams on the Littlehampton route from being cancelled...
RichJF
Member
I've noticed that once again the London Bridge - Horsham stoppers are delayed and behind time today. There's one 17 minutes down, one 14 minutes down and a LIttlehampton was 10 down when it arrived at London Bridge.
I hope this is not going to be the new norm & the 700's bed down on these new routes.
If these services are intended to be integrated into the Core to link up with the Great Northern services, then the reliability/timekeeping must improve.
I hope this is not going to be the new norm & the 700's bed down on these new routes.
If these services are intended to be integrated into the Core to link up with the Great Northern services, then the reliability/timekeeping must improve.
So have the services operated by class 700s that have suffered delays this week, been caused by failures of the trains themselves or have other train types/infrastructure been causing the problems?
Bishopstone
Established Member
Anecdotally - ie through looking at the departure boards when I pass through Gatwick twice daily, and also when I’ve had need to use these services - the London Bridge-Horsham runs have suffered very poor punctuality and a high cancellation rate going back years.
These Horsham services are amongst the first to be binned in the event of network disruption, so commiserations to friends in Great Northern land.
These Horsham services are amongst the first to be binned in the event of network disruption, so commiserations to friends in Great Northern land.
I think they suffer disproportionately from the congestion on the slow side of East Croydon from Purley through to Norwood Junction, tight turnarounds at London Bridge and generally because of the number of stops over a reasonable length journey. Delays to Arun Valley services can also knock them out of course.
F Great Eastern
Established Member
Yes - Siemens initially proposed a couple of Grammer options and FCC had no issue with that but the DFT had the final say, same goes with some other interior aspects.
Agent_Squash
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What seats are used in 700 first class?
Travelled on the 1657 London Bridge to Littlehampton
The train was very hot perhaps the heating was a tad generous!
Tables were welcome and saw a lot of use
Announcements giving the coach number may be helpful on services where once these were announced as the norm however there were staff making sure passengers were aware of the short platforms
The screen was not displaying journey information till around Three Bridges although this is more a PIS design issue
The tables make a massive difference to the feel of the train and I can't say I felt uncomfortable other than on account of the heat!
The train was near dead after around Worthing which I guess is the norm on this service although perhaps quieter on the run up to christmas
The train was very hot perhaps the heating was a tad generous!
Tables were welcome and saw a lot of use
Announcements giving the coach number may be helpful on services where once these were announced as the norm however there were staff making sure passengers were aware of the short platforms
The screen was not displaying journey information till around Three Bridges although this is more a PIS design issue
The tables make a massive difference to the feel of the train and I can't say I felt uncomfortable other than on account of the heat!
The train was near dead after around Worthing which I guess is the norm on this service although perhaps quieter on the run up to christmas
urpert
Member
I think they’re the same as the standard class 800 seats.
More Fainsa seats, ideally what should be used in standard, they're not particularly good, but a huge step up from the disaster of a seat otherwise used lol.
Unless if the extra padding ironing-board is any good, but I'm not aware of anything in service that actually has them.
tsr
Established Member
On the subject of Horsham services, these typically suffer at the end of the morning peak and during the evening for a fair few different reasons.
The stock diagrams and stopping patterns are very complex, some of which has been temporarily further complicated rather than made better by the arrival of 700s; the crew diagrams being complex and there being few or no spare crew at the small depot at Horsham (drivers and former conductors, now OBSs, have all been affected for years by this); impenetrable working of the sidings at Horsham caused by the station staff being allowed to dictate what they want to Control, rather than a centralised plan; numerous junction conflicts en-route; needless passenger confusion by the way stopping services are advertised at Gatwick; local traffic causing overcrowding between London Bridge and Purley... you name it really.
Everything which can go wrong inevitably does and there are so many factors which affect them. Busy commuter routes such as these could actually do better under Thameslink, as there should be more focus on good service recovery, new crew workings and only 2 stock formations (8 & 12 car 700s), but there will still be parallel Southern services which will not get the same service delivery focus and that will make life harder.
I wouldn’t agree that these trains get binned unduly frequently, but they tend to miss a lot of local stops if they are delayed, which completely defeats the point of running them at all. Adding stops on other trains also tends to fail PPM on those services.
The stock diagrams and stopping patterns are very complex, some of which has been temporarily further complicated rather than made better by the arrival of 700s; the crew diagrams being complex and there being few or no spare crew at the small depot at Horsham (drivers and former conductors, now OBSs, have all been affected for years by this); impenetrable working of the sidings at Horsham caused by the station staff being allowed to dictate what they want to Control, rather than a centralised plan; numerous junction conflicts en-route; needless passenger confusion by the way stopping services are advertised at Gatwick; local traffic causing overcrowding between London Bridge and Purley... you name it really.
Everything which can go wrong inevitably does and there are so many factors which affect them. Busy commuter routes such as these could actually do better under Thameslink, as there should be more focus on good service recovery, new crew workings and only 2 stock formations (8 & 12 car 700s), but there will still be parallel Southern services which will not get the same service delivery focus and that will make life harder.
I wouldn’t agree that these trains get binned unduly frequently, but they tend to miss a lot of local stops if they are delayed, which completely defeats the point of running them at all. Adding stops on other trains also tends to fail PPM on those services.
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