Thameslink/ Class 700 Progress

[Deepgreen]

When they first started to arrive they were split with additional wagons marshalled in the formation as brake runners as the 700 brakes were isolated. We progressed to barriers and runners either end of 8 cars and now it's down to one bogie container flat as coupling adaptors either end as the 700 brakes are now in use on the hauled moves.

Will this also apply to the 707 deliveries, reducing the need to haul a medium sized freight train for braking force around with the deliveries?!

 

[Deepgreen]

Now that the 700s have been in service for a while, it has become noticeable how filthy the body-sides below the windows have become just behind the cabs, seemingly from the airflow created by the cab design. Most of them are now dark brown.

 

[jon0844]

Now that the 700s have been in service for a while, it has become noticeable how filthy the body-sides below the windows have become just behind the cabs, seemingly from the airflow created by the cab design. Most of them are now dark brown.

When National Express was painting trains white years ago, that very same thing was very obvious because of the airflow. But still the DfT decided white is good for a neutral livery design.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

Diagrams for 377/5s were posted on ukmodernemu yesterday (6 pairs largely working Bedford to Three Bridges / Brighton services). Diagrams for 700s are available elsewhere (11 12-car and 17 8-car diagrams). Everything else on Thameslink (except the daytime London Bridge to Brighton services using Southern 377s) is a 319.

Not quite...yesterday, I saw 2 700's working Sutton diagrams and at least one (if not two) on a Sevenoaks diagram

 

[JonathanH]

Diagrams for 377/5s were posted on ukmodernemu yesterday (6 pairs largely working Bedford to Three Bridges / Brighton services). Diagrams for 700s are available elsewhere (11 12-car and 17 8-car diagrams). Everything else on Thameslink (except the daytime London Bridge to Brighton services using Southern 377s) is a 319. If someone had time, it wouldn't be too difficult to work out the 319 diagrams from RTT.

Not quite...yesterday, I saw 2 700's working Sutton diagrams and at least one (if not two) on a Sevenoaks diagram

The 17 8-car 700/0 diagrams are almost evenly split between Sevenoaks, Brighton/Three Bridges and Sutton diagrams (although not all day) so that is hardly unexpected. The rest of the Sutton and Sevenoaks diagrams are 319s (with the exception of a 377/5 round the loop in the morning peak).

 

[adamedwards]

Any news on the 717s for GN Moorgates? Assuming can't be too long before we see one? Apologies if my searching has failed to spot where this info is.
Thanks

 

[Sparks807Evo]

Now that the 700s have been in service for a while, it has become noticeable how filthy the body-sides below the windows have become just behind the cabs, seemingly from the airflow created by the cab design. Most of them are now dark brown.

Yeah I've noticed that on the recent images on some of them. I reckon part of the problem is that the brushers on the automatic washers don't quite reach down there either with the swept in angle of the bodyside.

 

[spark001uk]

Now that the 700s have been in service for a while, it has become noticeable how filthy the body-sides below the windows have become just behind the cabs, seemingly from the airflow created by the cab design. Most of them are now dark brown.

That's weird! I boarded a 700/1 just this afternoon and thought the exact same thing as it arrived! It shows quite badly between carriages too, highlighting where the airflow catches them. A discreet flaring of the body just there would've worked wonders, though I don't know what that would do to loading gauge? Or indeed manufacturing cost?

 

[387star]

can't see them staying so plain

it would make sense to have a striking livery for thameslink

 

[jon0844]

Any news on the 717s for GN Moorgates? Assuming can't be too long before we see one? Apologies if my searching has failed to spot where this info is.
Thanks

Don't think they've built any yet, as they're still doing the 700s and 707s.

 

[spark001uk]

Just come to a stand outside Palace on 1W55 and driver says a safety issue has occurred, and asked if any TL staff on board could they make themselves known to him. Hmm.

More info: Driver has said this unit has been involved in a safety incident concerning both the train and himself, and is unsafe to continue past next stop. We just been turfed off at Croydon and now ecs to Brighton is all I know. Unit is 700112.

 

[Bald Rick]

Just come to a stand outside Palace on 1W55 and driver says a safety issue has occurred, and asked if any TL staff on board could they make themselves known to him. Hmm.

More info: Driver has said this unit has been involved in a safety incident concerning both the train and himself, and is unsafe to continue past next stop. We just been turfed off at Croydon and now ecs to Brighton is all I know. Unit is 700112.

Not a train issue - signalling problem. Fixed.

 

[spark001uk]

Not a train issue - signalling problem. Fixed.

Ah OK thanks. I did wonder as it's down as a code IF (ARS/SSI/TDM) so did look like signalling. Not sure why driver wanted to see any on board staff though?

 

[asylumxl]

Ah OK thanks. I did wonder as it's down as a code IF (ARS/SSI/TDM) so did look like signalling. Not sure why driver wanted to see any on board staff though?

A driver did similar on a 700 operated service I was on last week. We stopped briefly for a few minutes then proceeded as normal.

Amusingly, he announced it once and nobody came. He announced it again and yet again nobody came. The third time he basically said "I know we have TL staff onboard, I saw you get on". Then a few people could be seen heading for the cab.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

The latest report on a Yahoogroup today is of 700 044 being seen in France on the way here.

 

[tsr]

Not a train issue - signalling problem. Fixed.

Not quite that simple, sadly. A spurious allegation was made (in good faith) by NR against the driver, due to an infrastructure fault which was indicated as something else entirely. That's all that I'll say on the matter.

Ah OK thanks. I did wonder as it's down as a code IF (ARS/SSI/TDM) so did look like signalling. Not sure why driver wanted to see any on board staff though?

Presumably to accompany them to the next suitable station for detraining the service, or in the event of equipment failure allegations, eg. AWS

(in any case, if authorised, of course).

Amusingly, he announced it once and nobody came. He announced it again and yet again nobody came. The third time he basically said "I know we have TL staff onboard, I saw you get on". Then a few people could be seen heading for the cab.

That's not amusing at all - if you're in a position to help, it's really rather negligent not to offer your services, and if you're identifiable as staff but not qualified to intervene, you should at least clarify to the crew. Obviously this latter situation might have been the case here, but 2 PA calls of that nature should be enough to let anyone know that something is wrong, and that it needs checking out, let alone 3.

 

[westcoaster]

700044 was this mornings delivery just saw it as I went passed the depot.

 

[westcoaster]

Now that the 700s have been in service for a while, it has become noticeable how filthy the body-sides below the windows have become just behind the cabs, seemingly from the airflow created by the cab design. Most of them are now dark brown.

The reason is there is a set of lubricators on the leading bogie by the lifeguards, it sprays libricating oil onto curves and that kicks up. Hence why it is at both ends just behind the cabs, hope that helps.

The equipment is called a flange lubricator ??????

 

[westcoaster]

Heard a 700 made it to new territory on the southern last night.

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/X49048/2017/03/16/advanced

 

[Class455]

Heard a 700 made it to new territory on the southern last night.

http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/X49048/2017/03/16/advanced

Nice to see them finally going on the East Grinstead line.

 

[Deepgreen]

The reason is there is a set of lubricators on the leading bogie by the lifeguards, it sprays libricating oil onto curves and that kicks up. Hence why it is at both ends just behind the cabs, hope that helps.

The equipment is called a flange lubricator ��

Indeed - thanks, I had assumed it was something like that. BTW, I thought 'flange lubricator' was the term for the kit located by the rail head and which is activated by depressing two nipples as the wheels passes over them?

 

[physics34]

Nice to see them finally going on the East Grinstead line.

Not nice at all to see them on the Grinny line. Wait for the passenger complaints

 

[Bald Rick]

Indeed - thanks, I had assumed it was something like that. BTW, I thought 'flange lubricator' was the term for the kit located by the rail head and which is activated by depressing two nipples as the wheels passes over them?

That's a rail lubricator.

 

[JonathanH]

Nice to see them finally going on the East Grinstead line.

How exactly is 700 introduction going to work on the East Grinstead / Brighton / Littlehampton / Horsham services given a lot of these currently split / join or interwork with Victoria services?

I totally get how it will be possible from May 2018 and the change of timetables / working north of London Bridge but come July 2017 presumably some of these services change over as more 700/1s arrive.

 

[AM9]

Not nice at all to see them on the Grinny line. Wait for the passenger complaints

They'll have their rant and then get over it. If the service comprises a mix of Southern 377s and Thameslink 700s, passengers will have the choice of a comfortable stand into London or an uncomfortable stand/sit (if they are lucky).

 

[Bedpan]

They'll have their rant and then get over it. If the service comprises a mix of Southern 377s and Thameslink 700s, passengers will have the choice of a comfortable stand into London or an uncomfortable stand/sit (if they are lucky).

When I go to London and beyond I have the alternative of sitting in comfort in a 377 (or a 319 for that matter), or sitting on a seat that feels like a plank of wood, with no armrests, no table and insufficient legroom. Rarely travel when there is a need to stand. I suppose that the 700s do address the overcrowding problem if they drive people away from the railways. The 377s and 387 were a cruel tease.

I've had my rant but won't get over it - even the 4-LAVs on the Brighton line were more comfortable, and from what I remember they were pretty dire.

 

[physics34]

They'll have their rant and then get over it. If the service comprises a mix of Southern 377s and Thameslink 700s, passengers will have the choice of a comfortable stand into London or an uncomfortable stand/sit (if they are lucky).

The service to LBG will just be 700s so those punters will not have a choice...and as said before, the people who used to get a seat at Upper Warlingham, Riddlesdown and Sanderstead will probably now have to stand.

 

[physics34]

How exactly is 700 introduction going to work on the East Grinstead / Brighton / Littlehampton / Horsham services given a lot of these currently split / join or interwork with Victoria services?

I totally get how it will be possible from May 2018 and the change of timetables / working north of London Bridge but come July 2017 presumably some of these services change over as more 700/1s arrive.

I did hear the Southern 377 London Bridge to Brighton and London Bridge to Horsham workings will switch over to 700s during the summer. Not sure how concrete that is, especially as Horsham traincrew (Thameslink) depot hasnt been sorted yet.

As far as the stock and crew workings are concerned......it will require alot of alterations for sure.

 

[bramling]

The service to LBG will just be 700s so those punters will not have a choice...and as said before, the people who used to get a seat at Upper Warlingham, Riddlesdown and Sanderstead will probably now have to stand.

That will be worth watching. Even more interesting would be if anyone at Woldingham finds themselves standing as a result of the change.

 

[AM9]

When I go to London and beyond I have the alternative of sitting in comfort in a 377 (or a 319 for that matter), or sitting on a seat that feels like a plank of wood, with no armrests, no table and insufficient legroom. Rarely travel when there is a need to stand. I suppose that the 700s do address the overcrowding problem if they drive people away from the railways. The 377s and 387 were a cruel tease.

I've had my rant but won't get over it - even the 4-LAVs on the Brighton line were more comfortable, and from what I remember they were pretty dire.

It doesn't matter if the few people who don't get over it, abandon rail and drive. The fact is that the 700s are designed to move the maximum number of passengers safely in the peak on routes where the train frequency is already near or at maximum that the infrastructure can reliably handle.
In order to achieve that, less than 7% of seats have been sacrificed to prevent the expected growth regularly leaving passengers unable to even board the trains.
That seems like a reasonable way ahead to me, but of course there are always some for whom the microclimate of their personal commute may not suit them in the future. The roads await them if they can't get over the sheer inhumanity of standing on a train. Their absence in the future will not even be detectable with the expected growth in rail travel but the worsening state of the roads may well cause them to rethink their change after a while.