TFW Query re Trainee Roles

[GalaxyDog]

Hi forum,

Does anyone know why TfW have started filtering their guard vacancies (Trainee Conductors) so that people who are already employed as guards elsewhere, arent allowed to apply? Surely a mix of newcomers and some people with railway nous and safety critical exerience would be a bonus to the franchise surely? It happened recently for Cardiff and it has happened with a recent Machynlleth posting. If every toc started doing this, then it would surely just mean people would be dead-ended in whichever TOC they were currently in, for good or bad? Not a thread for attacks or criticisms, genuinely just looking for answers thank you.

 

[Tevion539]

Don’t know the answer myself, however I recently passed an interview for the talent pool in Cardiff and Carmarthen as a second depot. Not sure how long I will be in the talent pool or if I will be picked out of it, but hey ho.

 

[YingYing]

Does anyone know why TfW have started filtering their guard vacancies (Trainee Conductors) so that people who are already employed as guards elsewhere, arent allowed to apply? Surely a mix of newcomers and some people with railway nous and safety critical exerience would be a bonus to the franchise surely? It happened recently for Cardiff and it has happened with a recent Machynlleth posting. If every toc started doing this, then it would surely just mean people would be dead-ended in whichever TOC they were currently in, for good or bad? Not a thread for attacks or criticisms, genuinely just looking for answers thank you.

I think if you're already a qualified guard, try to see it from a business perspective; why would they spend the time and money putting you through the trainee process again when you don't need it. They might be advertising for qualifieds at a later date and only want 'genuine' trainees to fill up their trainee course.

 

[Bld51]

Probably due to backfill. Makes business sense at times to choose the external route

 

[L401CJF]

I know a few Guards from other TOCs who applied for trainee roles and got given a job. They had induction etc then just route / traction training and out on the job without having to do the whole course.

Exception being ex Merseyrail Guards who have to sit the whole course - presumably as they don't cover semaphore signals, RA dispatch etc.

 

[GalaxyDog]

I know a few Guards from other TOCs who applied for trainee roles and got given a job. They had induction etc then just route / traction training and out on the job without having to do the whole course.

Exception being ex Merseyrail Guards who have to sit the whole course - presumably as they don't cover semaphore signals, RA dispatch etc.

This is it. I'm willing to sit induction, go through the training school [and take the pay cut, fair exchange] and go through the whole step, and thus be a Trainee in all sense of the word. But TfW have started this filtering out which is worrying indeed. They did it recently for Cardiff and now for Machynlleth.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Oct 2022 ==

I think if you're already a qualified guard, try to see it from a business perspective; why would they spend the time and money putting you through the trainee process again when you don't need it. They might be advertising for qualifieds at a later date and only want 'genuine' trainees to fill up their trainee course.

I have never seen a specific "Qualified Conductors" vacancy posting, for any depot in the last four to five years that I have been browsing the ComeAboard jobs page.

 

[tiptoptaff]

I think if you're already a qualified guard, try to see it from a business perspective; why would they spend the time and money putting you through the trainee process again when you don't need it. They might be advertising for qualifieds at a later date and only want 'genuine' trainees to fill up their trainee course.

That makes absolutely no difference at all. It costs them the same to put someone who's done the job before through it as someone who hasn't.

 

[SCDR_WMR]

There was a time when TOCs didn't like taking on 'qualified' guards from other TOCs due to wanting to imprint their own ways of working rather than have staff come in knowing what they were doing and potentially having bad habits etc.
Chiltern were like this when I joined the railway I believe.

Obviously there is something in that, possibly they've had operational incidents or issues during training where they've just thought it best to train from scratch. I've moved depots at my TOC but been open to a completely different way of working, but I could see issues with someone who was stuck in their ways.

 

[GalaxyDog]

There was a time when TOCs didn't like taking on 'qualified' guards from other TOCs due to wanting to imprint their own ways of working rather than have staff come in knowing what they were doing and potentially having bad habits etc.
Chiltern were like this when I joined the railway I believe.

Obviously there is something in that, possibly they've had operational incidents or issues during training where they've just thought it best to train from scratch. I've moved depots at my TOC but been open to a completely different way of working, but I could see issues with someone who was stuck in their ways.

I can see your line of thought here, but if this is the case, then this sours the milk for those of us who would seek promotion via switching to a better TOC and would be willing to knuckle down. If I got onto a new TOC Trainee course I would be prepared to go in with an open mind, sit the courses and do what's expected of me (and take the salary paycut as a trainee) for the long term satisfaction. Switching a TOC would be a new company culture, likely some new range of ticketing atop the standard national areas, and new traction, routes, stations and special instructions which would all need to be learnt fresh.

 

[SCDR_WMR]

I can see your line of thought here, but if this is the case, then this sours the milk for those of us who would seek promotion via switching to a better TOC and would be willing to knuckle down. If I got onto a new TOC Trainee course I would be prepared to go in with an open mind, sit the courses and do what's expected of me (and take the salary paycut as a trainee) for the long term satisfaction. Switching a TOC would be a new company culture, likely some new range of ticketing atop the standard national areas, and new traction, routes, stations and special instructions which would all need to be learnt fresh.

Absolutely, I don't agree with that way of thinking just pointing out that there was TOCs doing it.

For me, there should only be 1 genuine reason to not take an already experienced guard on and that would be due to operational incidents on file.

Having moved across a TOC (WMR/LNR) I'm glad to say there's no issue with taking on external guards here

 

[Meole]

What happens if an existing conductor fails the test at the end of the training ? Having given up their previous job it would appear they render themselves unemployed.

 

[GalaxyDog]

I'm not so sure they'd be instantly kicked off - I think they'd be given a resit. A good question, but from what i heard, candidates have been pushed through to fulfil the recruitment needs.

 

[craigybagel]

What happens if an existing conductor fails the test at the end of the training ? Having given up their previous job it would appear they render themselves unemployed.

That is indeed a risk - though surely that's a risk in any industry if you change profession and can't meet the standards required of that profession?