TfW Class 170's

[John R]

Begging for praise is never a good look.

Spot on. And besides, the novelty of seeing photos of Class 170s at Cardiff Central has already worn off. They’re here and working and on time, which is really good news given all the challenges TfW, amongst others, have faced with stock availability.

 

[tomwills98]

Not sure what you're trying to imply there but the doors to the cabins have GA-looking printed stickers on them saying "First Class", yet there was seemingly no reluctance from the passengers who were sitting in them to do so, though (as I said before) they could've asked / been told that they're declassified. I'm surprised that no effort has been made to change the signage...

I'm surprised that they weren't removed with all of the other GA stickers, but it has been raised and they are/will be getting peeled off. I doubt we'll be removing the 1st class seats though so it will be similar to the "secret" 1st class section on the 166's.

 

[anamyd]

Begging for praise is never a good look.

I wasn't begging for praise; I was asking if anyone on here likes it. Do you like it...?

 

[anamyd]

I'm surprised that they weren't removed with all of the other GA stickers, but it has been raised and they are/will be getting peeled off. I doubt we'll be removing the 1st class seats though so it will be similar to the "secret" 1st class section on the 166's.

That's good to hear. The way I was responded to before was rather strange.

 

[anamyd]

Regarding First Class, several people have tweeted TFW to ask about whether it's declassified and they confirmed it is. To be fair, it should be pretty self explanatory, as there are no first class fares for the route!

Had my first journey on one yesterday, 170272 on the 1747 from Llanharan, although it was ten minutes late (which isn't anything new on the Maesteg route; don't think I've ever caught a train from Llanharan or Pontyclun that's been on time). Have to say, the seats are remarkably more comfortable than XC's units! Or is it just me? I can't tell. But I really enjoyed my journey and felt I could have done long-distance on it. At Cardiff it got further delayed (possibly waiting for crew elsewhere), and a quick check on Real Time Trains shows it terminated at Gloucester 25 minutes late.

The First Class section on the 3 car units looks much more welcoming than that on the 2 car units mind.

05:53 to Maesteg has just gone past my house now this morning and that was a Turbo.

I don't agree with "self-explanatory" as I don't think the reason you gave is sufficient. Some other people responded like that as well.

Have you been on any 170s from other operators...? If so, which, and how did "272" compare...? I've personally been on WMT and XC ones and I'm planning to get my first ride on a TfW one in the new year.

 

[anamyd]

Spot on. And besides, the novelty of seeing photos of Class 170s at Cardiff Central has already worn off. They’re here and working and on time, which is really good news given all the challenges TfW, amongst others, have faced with stock availability.

I wouldn't say the novelty has worn off. The 16/12/19 was their first "proper" day in passenger service and I had someone tell me "wow, that's really good" and another tell me it was "fancy'; was just wondering if anyone on here likes it, that's all. I didn't share it with people on here for nothing, so was a bit disappointed that it was ignored. Do you like it...?

 

[sftfan1909]

If you're looking for feedback you would be better off going to the photography part of the forum.

 

[John R]

I wouldn't say the novelty has worn off. The 16/12/19 was their first "proper" day in passenger service and I had someone tell me "wow, that's really good" and another tell me it was "fancy'; was just wondering if anyone on here likes it, that's all. I didn't share it with people on here for nothing, so was a bit disappointed that it was ignored. Do you like it...?

I don’t like it, nor do I dislike it. What interests me is that TfW have managed to get a goodly number up and running by the target date, and so the first step of transforming services in Wales has begun. It’s been good to hear the reports of their movements into Wales over the last couple of weeks but it should be business as usual for the units now.

 

[Caaardiff]

This forum is becoming very 'conversational' again and I think some posters are getting a little too excited about every little detail and the topic is starting to lose substance and is going around in circles. We all now know what a TfW 170 looks like. I find it strange that someone is almost offended that no-one commented on their photo. This isn't a forum for validation.
I mean this in the nicest way possible, but if people were that interested in photos then they would've commented on them without needing to be prompted.

Anyway, back on topic. It seems TfW are struggling with the reliability of these 170s. I had heard that some of them weren't fit for service when they started arriving, hence being sent back to tyseley for work, even now being in service reliability hasnt been top notch for newly introduced trains. I heard that one briefly failed last night heading to Maesteg.
Also it's just simply shoddy work that these have been sat in a depot for a few weeks and haven't had something as obvious as the First class stickers removed. A small detail but something that should've been picked up before entry into service. I do agree that your average standard passenger would see it as a deterrent because they would know no different.

 

[John R]

Anyway, back on topic. It seems TfW are struggling with the reliability of these 170s. I had heard that some of them weren't fit for service when they started arriving, hence being sent back to tyseley for work, even now being in service reliability hasnt been top notch for newly introduced trains. I heard that one briefly failed last night heading to Maesteg.
Also it's just simply shoddy work that these have been sat in a depot for a few weeks and haven't had something as obvious as the First class stickers removed. A small detail but something that should've been picked up before entry into service. I do agree that your average standard passenger would see it as a deterrent because they would know no different.

Agree it's disappointing, though from the relatively rapid timescale with which they moved from Norwich and have entered service, I suspect the choice was either to enter service as they are or miss the deadline, and have even more negative publicity and criticism due to overcrowding/continued Pacer use than they have already.

I'm inclined to give TfW the benefit of the doubt so far. They've been dealt a pretty shoddy hand since taking over - not least the non-arrival of the 230s and 769s which were ordered before their time. So I can see why they would have scrambled to get the 170s into service to give some good news to passengers. More concerning to me is the longer term picture, with the delay to the handover of the Valley Lines infrastructure delaying work starting in earnest, and the implications for the EC funding if it is not delivered on time. That's for another topic though.

 

[anamyd]

If you're looking for feedback you would be better off going to the photography part of the forum.

Thanks for making me aware of that and for the suggestion.

...and reply and subsequent post acknowledged @Brissle Girl

 

[anamyd]

We all now know what a TfW 170 looks like. I find it strange that someone is almost offended that no-one commented on their photo. This isn't a forum for validation.
I mean this in the nicest way possible, but if people were that interested in photos then they would've commented on them without needing to be prompted.

I'm just very underwhelmed. I thought it was going to get some crazy reaction. I am disappointed, but I guess you have a point.

Anyway, back on topic. It seems TfW are struggling with the reliability of these 170s. I had heard that some of them weren't fit for service when they started arriving, hence being sent back to tyseley for work, even now being in service reliability hasnt been top notch for newly introduced trains. I heard that one briefly failed last night heading to Maesteg.

I don't get why they've been that bad though - people from their former / original area have been saying that they were very reliable there; also 170s in general are said to be very reliable - maybe these ones are homesick...? Are you saying that some of them have been going back to Tyseley...? As far as I know they only went to Tyseley at most once, 170270 and 170272 after having had first deliveries straight from Norwich to Cardiff (after which they were "re-delivered" to Cardiff), and all the others so far (except 170207 which is still a direct Norwich-Cardiff delivery) being delivered as Norwich-Tyseley, work carried out and then onto Cardiff.

Also it's just simply shoddy work that these have been sat in a depot for a few weeks and haven't had something as obvious as the First class stickers removed. A small detail but something that should've been picked up before entry into service. I do agree that your average standard passenger would see it as a deterrent because they would know no different.

Good to know it's not just me!

 

[sftfan1909]

Noticed today that the posters on board that show a diagram of the routes they will operate include the Vale of Glamorgan line, minus any of the circles that indicate stops. Slightly confused as to why, since I don't think they are planned to travel down that way?

Spoiler

 

[PHILIPE]

Diversionary route via Vale of Glamorgan. It was required, but not 170, to get to Bridgend lasr week to shuttle on the Maesteg Branch due to Engineering Work. It could have been a 170 if they had started operating on TFW a couple of days earlier

 

[yorkie]

If you're looking for feedback you would be better off going to the photography part of the forum.

Agreed.

Can we please stay on topic; also just a reminder that if anyone has any concerns, please use the report button. Thanks

 

[33017]

Not sure what you're trying to imply there but the doors to the cabins have GA-looking printed stickers on them saying "First Class", yet there was seemingly no reluctance from the passengers who were sitting in them to do so, though (as I said before) they could've asked / been told that they're declassified. I'm surprised that no effort has been made to change the signage...

What I'm trying to imply is the only service TfW operate with first class is Gerald. If a train operates on a route with no first class fare then all accommodation on the train is fair game. Until such time as TfW chose to alter the first class seating then anyone with a standard class ticket can sit there.

 

[anamyd]

What I'm trying to imply is the only service TfW operate with first class is Gerald. If a train operates on a route with no first class fare then all accommodation on the train is fair game. Until such time as TfW chose to alter the first class seating then anyone with a standard class ticket can sit there.

Thanks for that; I acknowledge what you're saying. My point is that some people wouldn't want to assume that they can just sit in there.

 

[John R]

For what it's worth, quite a few west turbos on GWR are still running around with yellow stripes, big "1" in the windows etc, etc, and they've been in service for well over a year now. All that's happened is that people soon twigged, and starting enjoying the marginally better accommodation. Some of them may even have been seen in Cardiff. So no big deal really. On a scale of 1 to 10 in terms of an issue I'd say it's 1 (rather appropriately!)

 

[ValleyLines142]

I don't agree with "self-explanatory" as I don't think the reason you gave is sufficient. Some other people responded like that as well.

Have you been on any 170s from other operators...? If so, which, and how did "272" compare...? I've personally been on WMT and XC ones and I'm planning to get my first ride on a TfW one in the new year.

Well there never has been First Class on the Maesteg or Ebbw Vale routes.

I've only been on CrossCountry's and West Midlands' Turbostars, and I feel they have the same seats. The seats on the TFW units seemed much more comfortable.

 

[anamyd]

Well there never has been First Class on the Maesteg or Ebbw Vale routes.

I've only been on CrossCountry's and West Midlands' Turbostars, and I feel they have the same seats. The seats on the TFW units seemed much more comfortable.

Indeed. The doors to the cabins said "First Class" on them while working those services however.

Ah, the same ones as me! I'm really looking forward to riding on a TfW 170 in the new year if the seats are more comfortable than on the average 170

Is it just me, or did I see a "mixed-use" compartment at one end as I was walking past one 170/2 unit...?

For what it's worth, quite a few west turbos on GWR are still running around with yellow stripes, big "1" in the windows etc, etc, and they've been in service for well over a year now. All that's happened is that people soon twigged, and starting enjoying the marginally better accommodation. Some of them may even have been seen in Cardiff. So no big deal really. On a scale of 1 to 10 in terms of an issue I'd say it's 1 (rather appropriately!)

Thanks for the information about the GWR Turbos; I'll keep an eye out Regardless, it's good that the stickers are apparently going to be removed (or even better, replaced with "declassified" / standard ones).

 

[Neptune]

Some of the 170’s Northern received from Scotrail had declassified 1st class areas on them. Can’t see the problem really unless the train was rammed and the 1st class area was empty because people were afraid to sit in it. Mountain out of a mole hill springs to mind here.

 

[anamyd]

Some of the 170’s Northern received from Scotrail had declassified 1st class areas on them. Can’t see the problem really unless the train was rammed and the 1st class area was empty because people were afraid to sit in it. Mountain out of a mole hill springs to mind here.

That's exactly the potential problem!

 

[John R]

That's exactly the potential problem!

Take it from me, that didn't happen on the GWR ones. If there is any sign of that happening do you think the guard wouldn't let people know, and after one or two days all the regular commuters catch on. It's dreaming up a problem that just doesn't exist.

 

[tomos dafis]

A move from Central Rivers to Canton planned for tomorrow - looks like a 170.
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/K06015/2019-12-21/detailed

 

[anamyd]

A move from Central Rivers to Canton planned for tomorrow - looks like a 170.
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/train/K06015/2019-12-21/detailed

Thanks for that; it'll be 170205

Edit 21/12/19: Cancelled. Also, only two 170s seemed to be out in service today - 170201 and 170208 just doing some of the Ebbw Vales (and the Bridgend service they do). Were only two in service because it was a Saturday...?

Edit 22/12/19: The Class 170 Wikipedia article is now showing 170271 as staying with Greater Anglia until March/April 2020.

Edit 23/12/19: Does anyone know which 170s are out today...? Thanks in advance

Edit 24/12/19: People on TfW Rail's Twitter have been noting that the destination displays (and therefore passenger information systems) aren't in use, and also that the WiFi doesn't work. I'm guessing it is planned to sort both of these issues out before the further TfW Rail-spec refurbishment, rather than during it...?

 

[NewSt]

Does anybody know what services the Class 170s are on today? Thanks in advance.

 

[aleandrail]

Thanks for that; it'll be 170205

Edit 21/12/19: Cancelled. Also, only two 170s seemed to be out in service today - 170201 and 170208 just doing some of the Ebbw Vales (and the Bridgend service they do). Were only two in service because it was a Saturday...?

Edit 22/12/19: The Class 170 Wikipedia article is now showing 170271 as staying with Greater Anglia until March/April 2020.

Edit 23/12/19: Does anyone know which 170s are out today...? Thanks in advance

170205 still at Central rivers at 6.00pm last night

 

[PHILIPE]

There were moves, 5Z70 and 5Z71, planned yesterday evening from Canton/Cardiff Cen to Landore to work 4 x 170s to Store/stable due to space at Canton and a vastly reduced service over the holiday period due to the switch on at Cardiff. They didn't appear to run though due to TFWs new terminology "Resource availability" something to be expected I suppose in view of their cancellation figure which had prevailed since Friday.

 

[Chris217]

Just spoken to a mate of mine who works for TfW. He says the 170s ain't suited to Ebbw Vale line route with all the stop starts.
They lose time due to their poorer acceleration.
It has been mentioned that they may move on to the Marches line.(talks in progress he says)
Having problems with the mk4s as well,and Arriva want the mk3s back soon as they will be going to Chiltern.
There maybe the temporary loss of the loco hauled diagrams in the new year being replaced by units until the mk4s are ready.

 

[PHILIPE]

Just spoken to a mate of mine who works for TfW. He says the 170s ain't suited to Ebbw Vale line route with all the stop starts.
They lose time due to their poorer acceleration.
It has been mentioned that they may move on to the Marches line.(talks in progress he says)
Having problems with the mk4s as well,and Arriva want the mk3s back soon as they will be going to Chiltern.
There maybe the temporary loss of the loco hauled diagrams in the new year being replaced by units until the mk4s are ready.

I'll believe this only if and when it happens. Another "My mate said" story perhaps.