Tfl fare evasion and settlement

[nt1234]

Hi All. My issue pertains to travelling outside oyster zone with oyster card and not realising a bank card etc was needed in that area.

I was sent a verification letter and was wondering what chances usually are for out of court settlement or being offered a 1st time warning (based on learned friends observations in the forum)

Thanks
N

 

[WesternLancer]

Hi All. My issue pertains to travelling outside oyster zone with oyster card and not realising a bank card etc was needed in that area.

I was sent a verification letter and was wondering what chances usually are for out of court settlement or being offered a 1st time warning (based on learned friends observations in the forum)

Thanks
N

depends on the route and who stopped and questioned you. Where did this happen? - can you provide more info ref route, station boarded and station left at etc. Can you upload a copy of the letter you have been sent with your personal details removed.

 

[nt1234]

I was stopped by a TFL inspector for not having a valid ticket at Taplow from Woolwich. I have been sent a verification letter identical to what others receive saying "accept" or "deny" a claim via email in 10 days.

I have apologised and accepted.

Just wondering if such cases do get settled out of court or via email rather than formal prosecution in courts??

 

[AlterEgo]

I was stopped by a TFL inspector for not having a valid ticket at Taplow from Woolwich. I have been sent a verification letter identical to what others receive saying "accept" or "deny" a claim via email in 10 days.

I have apologised and accepted.

Just wondering if such cases do get settled out of court or via email rather than formal prosecution in courts??

It’s difficult to say. As a general rule TfL really do go after serious abuse like abusing Freedom and staff travel passes in the courts. Not too many elementary one-off cases like yours make it to the forum, but we have seen them be pragmatic and issue a warning or settle out of court for an admin fee plus any fare avoided. I’d be inclined to think they will avoid court in this case if it’s as simple as you say, although there’s no guarantee.

 

[nt1234]

Thanks. Any idea if we reply back to IAP standard email address if the same guards check our appeal? The guard we got was very rude, asking horrible questions like profession, where we lived, grew up etc? Not related to the offence at all. If the same man checks he will defo mess around

 

[Malaxa]

Out of interest, is there an onboard announcement before West Drayton stating that Oyster cards are not valid beyond that station? One could always alight there and re-book.

 

[nt1234]

Yes, that is what I did. Rebooked via Trainline after west drayton upon realising but only did it 2mins before getting caught so wasn't deemed good enough as I stupidly mentioned that I am coming from Woolwich by tapping in via Oyster. If I just kept quiet maybe would have been saved and penalty fare issued.

Do they really care for courts for 1st time offenders? Also any good stories here assuring us as I am worried for DBS and criminal record

 

[AlterEgo]

Thanks. Any idea if we reply back to IAP standard email address if the same guards check our appeal? The guard we got was very rude, asking horrible questions like profession, where we lived, grew up etc? Not related to the offence at all. If the same man checks he will defo mess around

The reply will go to the prosecutions department and the inspector who questioned you will not be involved, save for their evidential report they will have made at the time to support the referral to the prosecutions office.

 

[nt1234]

The reply will go to the prosecutions department and the inspector who questioned you will not be involved, save for their evidential report they will have made at the time to support the referral to the prosecutions office.

Thanks. Fingers crossed it doesn't mean end of career..

 

[WesternLancer]

Thanks. Fingers crossed it doesn't mean end of career..

depends if you were planning a career as a railway ticket checker

 

[Florence Rox]

The contactless fare from Woolwich to Taplow is £10.10 off peak. You paid £6.40 on the Oyster Card and £6.60 for the single ticket, assuming you were travelling off peak. The OP has actually paid more than he/she should have

 

[nt1234]

Absolutely that is such a valid point Florence. Defo paid more than what bank card would have charged.

Guys is this really a proper DBS issue? There is no policy or data to clarify as some say it shows on Enhanced DBS (and it's spent in a year) whilst some say it never even appears to begin with.

 

[island]

It depends amongst other things on the offence you are charged with.

 

[Hadders]

The contactless fare from Woolwich to Taplow is £10.10 off peak. You paid £6.40 on the Oyster Card and £6.60 for the single ticket, assuming you were travelling off peak. The OP has actually paid more than he/she should have

The OP won't have touched out at West Drayton so there will be an incomplete journey. This will be charged as a maximum fare (note not a Penalty Fare) unless the touch out is resolved.

 

[nt1234]

It depends amongst other things on the offence you are charged with.

So once the 10day letter comes through saying accept or deny- will they directly send a court summon or let us know if they have "agreed" to warn/fine us?
Do TFL take long to reply back if they reply back that is?
Not sure if they directly send summons..

 

[Hadders]

TfL will reply to your letter, it's likely to take a few weeks (probably 2-4 but it depends on their workload).

If they do decide to prosecute it's unlikley that you will have to appear at court in person. It'll be dealt with under what's called the Single Justice Procedure Notice which meas if you plead guilty it dealt with on the 'paperwork' unless you request a hearing in person.

Let us know when you hear back from them and we can advise.

 

[nt1234]

TfL will reply to your letter, it's likely to take a few weeks (probably 2-4 but it depends on their workload).

If they do decide to prosecute it's unlikley that you will have to appear at court in person. It'll be dealt with under what's called the Single Justice Procedure Notice which meas if you plead guilty it dealt with on the 'paperwork' unless you request a hearing in person.

Let us know when you hear back from them and we can advise.

Thank you so much! 1 week and no response yet. Do they reply via email or all comms are through post?!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 10 Jul 2023 ==

It depends amongst other things on the offence you are charged with.

But having had a look online the bylaws dont show on DBS..

 

[island]

But having had a look online the bylaws dont show on DBS.

That’s correct, but not all railway offences are byelaw offences.

 

[nt1234]

That’s correct, but not all railway offences are byelaw offences.

The Railway Act is more serious but byelaws are

That’s correct, but not all railway offences are byelaw offences.

they have a choice right? Whether they want to prosecute via railway act or byelaws? Will they convey via email or post?

 

[30907]

The Railway Act is more serious but byelaws are

they have a choice right? Whether they want to prosecute via railway act or byelaws? Will they convey via email or post?

The letter comes in the post. In your particular circumstances I would expect them to use the Byelaws.

 

[nt1234]

Hello all. No news still after 20 days!! Is this normal?
Thanks

 

[island]

They have up to 6 months from the date of the violation.

 

[nt1234]

Hi Friends

More than 1 month now and I haven't heard since we apologised via email to them. Is this what usually happens?

Thanks
N

 

[dakta]

Can be, as above they have 6 months

 

[Huntergreed]

Hi Friends

More than 1 month now and I haven't heard since we apologised via email to them. Is this what usually happens?

Thanks
N

It is peak season. School/university holidays, height of summer. Cases are likely in a backlog. They have six months, so unfortunately all you can do at the moment is wait.

 

[nt1234]

It is peak season. School/university holidays, height of summer. Cases are likely in a backlog. They have six months, so unfortunately all you can do at the moment is wait.

They scare people by saying reply within 10days and also send letters vv soon but then sit on things for 6 months- this is sheer hypocrisy! Conscious they have volume to deal with but they are playing with minds. The mental pressure is real..


Has anybody had resolution earlier than 6 months?

Thanks friends

 

[Fawkes Cat]

They scare people by saying reply within 10days and also send letters vv soon but then sit on things for 6 months- this is sheer hypocrisy! Conscious they have volume to deal with but they are playing with minds. The mental pressure is real..


Has anybody had resolution earlier than 6 months?

Thanks friends

From what we see here, it’s unusual for things to run for the full six months - so there’s not a policy of using delay as an informal punishment. But the law does allow TfL up to six months if they want to prosecute, so we can’t promise anything less than that.

 

[nt1234]

Hi All

So I have had a response today after 45days. The email states that the allegation made against us is that we were attempting to travel paying an incorrect fare (pay less but travel further) + legal action was being considered by them.

And we have been asked to provide more details about our case inspite of giving them all the information when they first asked.

My question is that has somebody had similar experience that they ask more information via email.

Hope this does not mean that they have made their mind for legal action.
Thanks all.

 

[Hadders]

Who is the email from?

Can you paste a copy of it in this thread (with any personal details redacted). We will be happy to proof read your draft reply if you post that as well.

 

[nt1234]

The response is from Ian Crawford | Investigator/Prosecutor | Investigations Appeals & Prosecutions | Compliance, Policing, Operations & Security | Surface Transport
The main elements of email received-
The report stated that you only purched tickets through an online mobile application when you reaslised that there were Revenue Inspectors on board checking tickets. Therefore, the allegation is that you attempted to travel to Reading on a £3.65 ticket.

The facts of this case are being considered and I must advise you that legal action is being considered.

If there is anything else you wish to add as to why Transport for London should not pursue further legal action against you, please provide this, along with two x 26-30 Railcards.


We got 2 tickets 1 person had the railcard 26-30 but other did not and the ticket was also full price (on train line without discount)

I look forward to hearing further. Thanks