"Temporary closures" and the rules surrounding them

[Purple Train]

Several lesser-used stations (Teesside Airport, Stanlow & Thornton, Kirton Lindsey, Brigg, etc.) have been "temporarily" closed "until further notice" recently, with no signs of much work being done to reopen them (which may not be true, but there has certainly been little information) or provide a replacement service.
Could anyone clarify what sort of rules are in place regarding keeping such stations open and served (if there are any), without a formal closure process?

 

[Javelin_55]

Possibly a formal closure process would be prevented by keeping those station calls in the long term timetable, and giving all service groups that call there an STP schedule until the stations reopen.

Sometimes TOCs will provide taxis to the next closest open station. Southern did this for Newhaven Marine before it was officially closed but I'm not sure if anyone ever took them up on it!

 

[swt_passenger]

Several lesser-used stations (Teesside Airport, Stanlow & Thornton, Kirton Lindsey, Brigg, etc.) have been "temporarily" closed "until further notice" recently, with no signs of much work being done to reopen them (which may not be true, but there has certainly been little information) or provide a replacement service.
Could anyone clarify what sort of rules are in place regarding keeping such stations open and served (if there are any), without a formal closure process?

No one has ever succeeded in finding any published rules every time this has been asked before. I suspect if the TOC and DfT get no formal objections an unofficial closure can go on for years.

 

[The Quincunx]

The legislation talks of the "discontinuance" of the use of stations or network. This implies permanent closure (and I believe ORR obtained a legal opinion to that effect soon after the closure provisions of the Railways Act 1994 came into force). If there is no intention to resume use, then it's regarded as a closure. If there is any realistic likelihood of a resumption, then it can be regarded as not yet a closure (there is no such thing as a "temporary closure"). The closure provisions apply if the station or network has at any time within the preceding five years been used "for or in connection with the provision of services for the carriage of passengers by railway". This sort of gives a 5-year grace period of non-use. DfT does not like it when there is more than 5 years' "temporary" closure (because this would mean that the station or network had been allowed to slip outside the scope of the closure legislation), so the nearer it gets to 5 years without any propect of re-opening, the more likely a formal closure procedure will be instigated. This was the case with the likes of Croxley Green, Newhaven Marine and Folkestone Harbour.

 

[zwk500]

Sometimes TOCs will provide taxis to the next closest open station. Southern did this for Newhaven Marine before it was officially closed but I'm not sure if anyone ever took them up on it!

IIRC some Youtubers or local news reporters attempted to take advantage of the offer and were rebuffed, as the station was within the security area of the Newhaven Port and therefore the taxi company was not allowed up to the station. I'm not sure when the security rules were changed (presuming public access from outside the port had been possible when the station was in service).

This was the case with the likes of Croxley Green, Newhaven Marine and Folkestone Harbour.

Quick point - the primary motivation for formally closing Newhaven Marine was to permit conversion of the branch into an Aggregates loading terminal. The platform base is still intact, but any trace of the station building has been swept away.

 

[The Quincunx]

The creation of the aggregates facility at Newhaven Marine was just a happy consequence. The primary reason for Newhaven Marine closing was that it no longer served its purpose of connecting with the ferries after the berth was moved.

 

[diffident]

The creation of the aggregates facility at Newhaven Marine was just a happy consequence. The primary reason for Newhaven Marine closing was that it no longer served its purpose of connecting with the ferries after the berth was moved.

This is absolutely correct, and in fact, even back in 2001-2003 when I lived in the area, the bus from Eastbourne/Seaford to Brighton still served the station even though it was barricaded off! I believe it served as a driver change point for that particular bus service for some time since I left the area also.

 

[zwk500]

The creation of the aggregates facility at Newhaven Marine was just a happy consequence. The primary reason for Newhaven Marine closing was that it no longer served its purpose of connecting with the ferries after the berth was moved.

If the primary reason for closure was the ferries why wasn't the formal closure process started as soon as the terminal moved to the top of the road? Foot passenger traffic moved up there much more than 5 years ago.

 

[The Quincunx]

If the primary reason for closure was the ferries why wasn't the formal closure process started as soon as the terminal moved to the top of the road? Foot passenger traffic moved up there much more than 5 years ago.

That is the $64,000 question. Although the ferries had gone, there was still a regular, scheduled passenger service. Albeit only once a week and that couldn't actually take passengers. But its presence indicated that there was no intention to close.

 

[zwk500]

That is the $64,000 question. Although the ferries had gone, there was still a regular, scheduled passenger service. Albeit only once a week and that couldn't actually take passengers. But its presence indicated that there was no intention to close.

Exactly, the once a week empty run could have continued ad infinitum if it wasn't the resignalling and remodelling work that needed to be done for the Aggregates terminal. Because of the scale of work needed, as the line was officially passenger it needed to meet all the passenger standards, so it was formally closed and therefore the work could be done to the freight standards, which was operationally necessary as well as a darn sight cheaper.

The station stopped being accessible to passengers in 2005. The aggregates terminal was proposed in 2018, resignalling scheme approved in 2019 and station closure consultation started in 2020.

 

[LondonExile]

Someone's done an FOI request regarding Teeside Airport: https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/teesside_airport_railway_station#incoming-2049556

It looks from the contents of those emails, that the station isn't owned by the railway (presumably owned by the airport?), and the platforms are in a dangerous condition where an inspection predicted that if you detrained a large number of passengers it was at risk of collapse.

If the owner decides to fix it - then it seems the closure would be lifted, but at the moment it looks like the railway has no responsibility (or possibly even permission?) to fix it, so all they can do is (temporarily) close it on safety grounds.

If it was owned by the railway, there may be different arguments around repair vs closure, but as it is, what's happened makes perfect sense.

 

[Deafdoggie]

What are the chances of a large number of people getting off there?

 

[bramling]

Several lesser-used stations (Teesside Airport, Stanlow & Thornton, Kirton Lindsey, Brigg, etc.) have been "temporarily" closed "until further notice" recently, with no signs of much work being done to reopen them (which may not be true, but there has certainly been little information) or provide a replacement service.
Could anyone clarify what sort of rules are in place regarding keeping such stations open and served (if there are any), without a formal closure process?

What is actually happening in respect of Brigg and Kirton Lindsey?

Unlike the others, their lack of service seems to be being attributed to Covid. Do we assume this is going to become permanent?

 

[Purple Train]

What is actually happening in respect of Brigg and Kirton Lindsey?

Unlike the others, their lack of service seems to be being attributed to Covid. Do we assume this is going to become permanent?

This thread might be able to provide information: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/brigg-line-what’s-the-point.225929/

 

[swt_passenger]

What are the chances of a large number of people getting off there?

Teesside Airport? Incredibly low chance. But there’s also a recent discussion of it, including all the stuff from the FOI just mentioned, here: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/closure-of-teesside-airport-station.231043/page-8

 

[Baxenden Bank]

The legislation talks of the "discontinuance" of the use of stations or network. This implies permanent closure (and I believe ORR obtained a legal opinion to that effect soon after the closure provisions of the Railways Act 1994 came into force). If there is no intention to resume use, then it's regarded as a closure. If there is any realistic likelihood of a resumption, then it can be regarded as not yet a closure (there is no such thing as a "temporary closure"). The closure provisions apply if the station or network has at any time within the preceding five years been used "for or in connection with the provision of services for the carriage of passengers by railway". This sort of gives a 5-year grace period of non-use. DfT does not like it when there is more than 5 years' "temporary" closure (because this would mean that the station or network had been allowed to slip outside the scope of the closure legislation), so the nearer it gets to 5 years without any propect of re-opening, the more likely a formal closure procedure will be instigated. This was the case with the likes of Croxley Green, Newhaven Marine and Folkestone Harbour.

Which raises the question of Barlaston and Wedgwood, served by rail replacement bus for 18 years. 23 May 2004 according to Wikipedia.

 

[Purple Train]

Someone's done an FOI request regarding Teeside Airport: https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/teesside_airport_railway_station#incoming-2049556

It looks from the contents of those emails, that the station isn't owned by the railway (presumably owned by the airport?), and the platforms are in a dangerous condition where an inspection predicted that if you detrained a large number of passengers it was at risk of collapse.

If the owner decides to fix it - then it seems the closure would be lifted, but at the moment it looks like the railway has no responsibility (or possibly even permission?) to fix it, so all they can do is (temporarily) close it on safety grounds.

If it was owned by the railway, there may be different arguments around repair vs closure, but as it is, what's happened makes perfect sense.

I presume there's a similar situation at Stanlow & Thornton then. Would I be correct?

 

[Kite159]

I presume there's a similar situation at Stanlow & Thornton then. Would I be correct?

I believe it is the access bridge causing issues at Stanlow, and that is owned by the refinery. Can't see the Refinery putting money on repairing that footbridge unless they are forced to, especially with the rubbish service levels at the station.

(Always felt like if Helsby - Ellesmere Port was at least an hourly shuttle, the station at Stanlow could get used by workers to avoid having to drive to work)

 

[Purple Train]

I believe it is the access bridge causing issues at Stanlow, and that is owned by the refinery. Can't see the Refinery putting money on repairing that footbridge unless they are forced to, especially with the rubbish service levels at the station.

(Always felt like if Helsby - Ellesmere Port was at least an hourly shuttle, the station at Stanlow could get used by workers to avoid having to drive to work)

Ah right, so yes, that is what I was thinking.
I wonder if Ellesmere Port-Helsby could be transferred to Merseyrail with battery operation (possibly a candidate for discussion in the Speculative thread?)...

 

[The Quincunx]

Which raises the question of Barlaston and Wedgwood, served by rail replacement bus for 18 years. 23 May 2004 according to Wikipedia.

Rail replacement buses are covered by the "in connection with" bit. They only operate because there is an intention to operate a rail service (otherwise, they are just "a bus").

 

[pdeaves]

What are the chances of a large number of people getting off there?

Teesside? Very slim indeed. But, in the event of an emergency detraining situation, potentially possible. An 'open' station is available for emergencies, a 'closed' one is not (immediately; they can still be used [1] but there's an extra faff factor).

[1] Etruria was used for an emergency detraining after it had closed, for example

 

[Old Yard Dog]

The last three months have seen about 50% of the two-a-day services on the Ellesmere Port - Helsby line cancelled. The cancellations have been quite random with little obvious pattern. There have not been many occasions when both return trips have run.

The line has now been temporarily closed until 21st August at the earliest due to damage to an oil pipe spanning the railway at Stanlow. A replacement bus service is scheduled to run.

Given the low usage of the line, I wonder whether the bus will actually run during the blockade? And were replacement buses provided in earlier weeks when trains were cancelled?

In a further blow to the line, the government has just refused funding for Merseyrail to extend its Ellesmere Port services to Helsby using new trains capable of running on battery power.

 

[Llandudno]

The last three months have seen about 50% of the two-a-day services on the Ellesmere Port - Helsby line cancelled. The cancellations have been quite random with little obvious pattern. There have not been many occasions when both return trips have run.

The line has now been temporarily closed until 21st August at the earliest due to damage to an oil pipe spanning the railway at Stanlow. A replacement bus service is scheduled to run.

Given the low usage of the line, I wonder whether the bus will actually run during the blockade? And were replacement buses provided in earlier weeks when trains were cancelled?

In a further blow to the line, the government has just refused funding for Merseyrail to extend its Ellesmere Port services to Helsby using new trains capable of running on battery power.

In all fairness the line between Ellesmere Port and Helsby is a bit of basket case…!

 

[Trackman]

I believe it is the access bridge causing issues at Stanlow, and that is owned by the refinery. Can't see the Refinery putting money on repairing that footbridge unless they are forced to, especially with the rubbish service levels at the station.

Yes, it's been gated off for years although it's still there.
Think I heard you cannot leave the station as it's on the oil refinery site, although there are roads.. could just be a myth.

 

[Kite159]

The last three months have seen about 50% of the two-a-day services on the Ellesmere Port - Helsby line cancelled. The cancellations have been quite random with little obvious pattern. There have not been many occasions when both return trips have run.

The line has now been temporarily closed until 21st August at the earliest due to damage to an oil pipe spanning the railway at Stanlow. A replacement bus service is scheduled to run.

Given the low usage of the line, I wonder whether the bus will actually run during the blockade? And were replacement buses provided in earlier weeks when trains were cancelled?

In a further blow to the line, the government has just refused funding for Merseyrail to extend its Ellesmere Port services to Helsby using new trains capable of running on battery power.

I believe looking at Journey Check they normally provide a replacement bus when the train gets cancelled, although no-doubt it will be carrying fresh-air most of the time.

Shame that Merseyrail haven't been given funding to extend to Helsby, even if just 1 train an hour (although I suspect it will be easier to extend everything to keep the timetable tidy). Might have generated some custom from the houses around Ince & Elton station, plus given more connections at Helsby for stations towards Manchester/Warrington etc. Build it and they might come so to speak.

 

[_toommm_]

Yes, it's been gated off for years although it's still there.
Think I heard you cannot leave the station as it's on the oil refinery site, although there are roads.. could just be a myth.

You can definitely leave - I did it within the past two years and walked down the refinery road to Ellesmere Port station. I wasn't bothered once, although when black cars approached from behind I did feel uneasy

 

[Ianigsy]

The last three months have seen about 50% of the two-a-day services on the Ellesmere Port - Helsby line cancelled. The cancellations have been quite random with little obvious pattern. There have not been many occasions when both return trips have run.

The line has now been temporarily closed until 21st August at the earliest due to damage to an oil pipe spanning the railway at Stanlow. A replacement bus service is scheduled to run.

Given the low usage of the line, I wonder whether the bus will actually run during the blockade? And were replacement buses provided in earlier weeks when trains were cancelled?

In a further blow to the line, the government has just refused funding for Merseyrail to extend its Ellesmere Port services to Helsby using new trains capable of running on battery power.

I’d have thought that Network Rail would want to stand on principle here and ensure that if you own something which crosses an operational railway, you maintain it properly.

 

[geoffk]

A related issue is the status of Pilning and Polesworth, which are effectively useless but still have trains calling in one direction. I'm not aware of any plans to replace the footbridge at either station to allow trains to call in both directions.