It's more valid than coming up with some insane conspiracy theory that a member of staff (and I'm not sure why the poster made a point of highlighting it would be a woman) who hates cyclists wants to exercise their new found "power" by hammering the poor little snowflakes with a request that seems more than reasonable.
-
Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!
Taking a folding bike into a station during peak hours
- Thread starter Plok77
- Start date
- Status
It's more valid than coming up with some insane conspiracy theory that a member of staff (and I'm not sure why the poster made a point of highlighting it would be a woman) who hates cyclists wants to exercise their new found "power" by hammering the poor little snowflakes with a request that seems more than reasonable.
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R
RailUK Forums
Deepgreen
Established Member
It wasn't the validity of the rant (which was hard to pin down) I was referring to, it was the garbled nature of it. However, since you mention it, I don't believe a request to fold a bike just to enter a station IS valid. To board a train - completely different.
Oh come on, those Bromptons are a fashion item as much as they are a transport device. Don't play that game with me!
Deepgreen said:
Really? Are you implying that all cyclists are perfect and never cause issues for their fellow commuters? Perhaps you'd like to tackle the issues instead of resorting to simplistic insults?
Deepgreen said:
I know how touchy cyclists are about criticism these days, and like to film everything they don't like, so perhaps one or two might like to observe how some of their fellow cyclists behave on platforms and trains. I witness on an almost daily basis folding bike owners (not all Bromptons by the way, hence the generic term) arriving onto busy commuter trains, leaving their unfolded bikes in doorwells whilst other commuters try to board while they sort themselves out, get a seat etc, then proceed to start to fold up their bikes. So having had opportunity to fold bikes on the platform, they have instead chosen to wait until boarding before completing the task. So in the light of this, it is not unreasonable to ask owners to fold their bikes prior to going through the gates, thus negating the issue above. If said owners chose to stand to one side on the platform to fold their bikes, then fair enough, but some don't.
So if a TOC, or member of station staff regularly sees this behaviour and decides for the benefit of all passengers to ask owners to fold bikes before entering onto the platforms, this is a reasonable course of action. If this causes a minor inconvenience, and it is a minor one, to cyclists then so be it. I'm afraid the railways are there for the benefit of all.
bramling
Veteran Member
Ah, now we're getting somewhere. Jealous because we can't afford one perhaps?
Plenty of commuters cause issues for their fellow commuters. Its a people issue rather than an issue with what they carry with them.
All except cyclists, it would seem to you.
Deepgreen
Established Member
An object lesson in how to hijack a thread to rant about favourite hates!
The question concerned being asked (told?) to fold a bike to enter a station, not whether the 'Brompton' is the biggest envy symbol of our age, or if cyclists are all identically evil Devil spawn.
Just for completeness, I'll attempt to bring the thread to its inevitable conclusion - Hitler and the Nazis caused all this, you know.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
No. However, there does seem to be an element who leap at the slightest chance to rant about cyclists in general in such an apoplectic rage that their posts become incoherent, and it's as tiresome as it is predictable.
The question concerned being asked (told?) to fold a bike to enter a station, not whether the 'Brompton' is the biggest envy symbol of our age, or if cyclists are all identically evil Devil spawn.
Just for completeness, I'll attempt to bring the thread to its inevitable conclusion - Hitler and the Nazis caused all this, you know.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
No. However, there does seem to be an element who leap at the slightest chance to rant about cyclists in general in such an apoplectic rage that their posts become incoherent, and it's as tiresome as it is predictable.
If either of the two posters above had taken the time they would have noted that I used to cycle myself, so I don't hate cyclists at all. I used to love being out on the open road on my bike. But I don't like the way some come across as arrogant, and above everyone else. Sadly the previous posters have displayed this exact amount of arrogance that ends up with the situations as per the original post. Reasonable people would have just said "Fair enough, it's annoying that some idiots spoil it for the majority but hey ho". And cyclists wonder why they get such a bad reputation!
bramling
Veteran Member
The above is all, of course, your own personal opinion. Others may well consider the situation and come to a completely different conclusion. This doesn't make them arrogant.
And, no, I'm not prepared to endure needless hardship because of the supposed behaviour of some others -- especially when as has been pointed out numerous times within this thread, your 'solution' doesn't actually prevent the problem behaviour anyway.
Meanwhile, I'm still failing to see what fashion has to do with the issue.
Last edited:
Oh, my sincere apologies. I had not realised that carrying a folded bike is such a hardship. Please let me know the TOCs that you use, and I will surely lobby them to have staff on hand at the station entrance to carry you and your bike to your preferred location on the train.....
I think I have nothing more to say. If you seriously consider carrying a bike a hardship, there's not a lot more one can say except maybe public transport really isn't for you?
Walks away shaking head slowly..... :roll:
Nice stats, but that doesn't apply when I've been hit many times, but not killed or seriously injured. So the stats don't include me, and I wouldn't ever expect them to as I never report incidents (would be pointless).
I've certainly never been hit by a car. If I was, I'd expect to come out far worse. But cars are fairly predictable.
Not saying they're so predictable when on two-wheels, but when you're generally on the pavement most of the time and only cross when it's clear, or you have lights to 'protect' you, the chances of being hit by a vehicle are slim. Stolen/getaway cars excepted.
Ironically, not using a crossing is probably safer from a bike collision point of view. You can wait until there are no bikes or cars, then cross. At lights, you would assume you're safe, and that's where the opportunity to be hit/clipped comes in.
EssexCommuter
Member
- Joined
- 6 Dec 2014
- Messages
- 54
I first started cycling in London instead of using the tube during tube strikes a couple of years ago. A friend leant me a Dahon to try. I was won over by not having to wait for the tube and having a guaranteed travel time (within a minute or two). However the Dahon was not for me. It was heavy, clumsy and took up far more room on the train than a Brompton which is what I assume you are referring to. Yes the Dahon was half the price of the Brompton I bought, but I have a better commute, take up less room on the train and can fold/unfold it more quickly. And let's not forget it's my money to spend...
EbbwJunction1
Established Member
I was sat on Cardiff Central Station last night and a cyclist came along, pushing his bike. The platform wasn't particularly busy, so he wasn't in anyone's way. He stopped near me towards the edge of the platform (I was sat on a seat), and proceeded to fold his (Brompton!) bike. This took him less than a minute, he didn't get in anyone's way whilst he was doing it, and everyone seemed to be happy.
When we got to Swansea, I saw the bike on the shelf in the same carriage as I was in. I couldn't see the rider, although I did look, so I presume that he was further away from the entrance than I was. I assume that he took it of the rack, onto the platform, opened it up and rolled it to the gateline and then out of the station.
It all looked quite sensible to me. I can see why staff might want folding bikes to be folded before the gateline, but I can also see that it isn't always necessary, provided that (as in this case) there was no disruption to any other passenger.
It seems to me that there can be fault on both sides, but it's really a matter of common sense ... but this does seem to be in short supply, sometimes!
When we got to Swansea, I saw the bike on the shelf in the same carriage as I was in. I couldn't see the rider, although I did look, so I presume that he was further away from the entrance than I was. I assume that he took it of the rack, onto the platform, opened it up and rolled it to the gateline and then out of the station.
It all looked quite sensible to me. I can see why staff might want folding bikes to be folded before the gateline, but I can also see that it isn't always necessary, provided that (as in this case) there was no disruption to any other passenger.
It seems to me that there can be fault on both sides, but it's really a matter of common sense ... but this does seem to be in short supply, sometimes!
I would say you were utterly utterly wrong
I would say its a perfectly valid request if the authorised person thinks that taking them unfolded onto the station causes an obstruction or hindrance to others.
It basically comes down to a laziness in enforcing rules and common sense. Not blaming front-line staff for this, as they have enough to deal with as it is, but it's a general attitude.
Handful of people causing problems after a few drinks? Ban alcohol on public transport.
Problems with anti-social behaviour? Make swearing in public an arrestable offence.
People not recycling? Allow council officials to sift through people's bins.
There are millions of these petty little regulations.
None of these, on their own, are particular hardships, and nor is carrying a folded bike. But they're all unnecessary annoyances, put in for administrative convenience, and little regard for the non-wrongdoers they affect. Stack them up, though, and not only do they start to become a cumulative inconvenience, they also reduce public respect for the law, particularly when most of them are unenforced, or unenforceable.
Personally, I'm all in favour of ignoring pettiness, as long as I'm not harming anyone by doing so.
Handful of people causing problems after a few drinks? Ban alcohol on public transport.
Problems with anti-social behaviour? Make swearing in public an arrestable offence.
People not recycling? Allow council officials to sift through people's bins.
There are millions of these petty little regulations.
None of these, on their own, are particular hardships, and nor is carrying a folded bike. But they're all unnecessary annoyances, put in for administrative convenience, and little regard for the non-wrongdoers they affect. Stack them up, though, and not only do they start to become a cumulative inconvenience, they also reduce public respect for the law, particularly when most of them are unenforced, or unenforceable.
Personally, I'm all in favour of ignoring pettiness, as long as I'm not harming anyone by doing so.
bramling
Veteran Member
Why don't you mind your own business when it comes to the transport arrangements of others?
Actually, most of the time when using the railway, I *don't* have a bike with me. Whilst I did use one for a few years, my current travel arrangements very rarely require it. Using and working on the railway, I honestly can't think of occasions when a folding bike, folded or unfolded, belonging to someone else has caused me a problem -- despite living and working in an area where folding bikes are very common indeed. Yes I can quite readily think of occasions when people have loaded non-folding bikes on trains which have caused a problem, but that's something completely different.
With all this in mind, I submit that the issue is something more in your imagination than reality.
And, since you seem to find the preferences of others so objectionable, perhaps rail travel isn't for *you*?
I'm still waiting to understand the relevance of fashion when deciding which mode of transport to use...
Last edited:
You seem to be of the opinion that carrying a folded bike is a hardship. Therefore with this in mind I simply suggested that given that the possibility exists for you to be asked to endure the human violation of carrying your own bike, that you may wish to consider avoiding situations where this possibility exists. Although frankly if you want my real thoughts on your transport situation, I would personally suggest using a high horse.
Seriously, if you honestly think carrying a folded bike is a hardship then I hope you never fall into real hardship. I honestly don't think you could cope. Asking people to do is not unreasonable, no matter how much you protest.
As for the fashion thing, look it up. There are plenty of articles on the matter if you really are determined to get to the bottom of my flippant comment. Unless of course using a search engine is too much of a hardship too...
Last edited:
Deepgreen
Established Member
Unfortunately you have proved yourself wrong again...
Surely even you can see beyond the specific instance of the OP's experience to that of the principle of arbitrary 'rules' seemingly being imposed?
bramling
Veteran Member
Right, so one has to endure unnecessary hardship, just to please your preferences. Utterly selfish and self-centred IMO.
No, it's not the end of the world and there are worse things in the world, but it's hardship one could do without - especially as its completely pointless and unnecessary, except to please you it would seem.
The position you are articulating makes things needlessly difficult for those travelling with a folding bike, creates needless hassle for railway staff, and doesn't address any of the issues you have raised. That's why it's a bad and pointless thing to do.
Last edited:
Will you please get over yourself. Nowhere have I said it is for my preference. Most passengers would prefer not to have to climb across those people with folding bikes who choose to use the doorwells to fold them in. If all owners were considerate enough to complete folding of their bikes on the platform, and out of the way of others then fine, no issue here. The fact that you continue to protest tells me you know that this is not the case, but that you cannot bring yourself to admit it through some sense of cyclist loyalty.
Let me get this straight, you agree it is reasonable and sensible to fold a bike on a platform, but you believe that people should be instructed to fold a bike before being granted access to the platform? Or have I misunderstood?
As I have said, if owners of folding bikes chose to fold them prior to boarding the train, then I would see no problem in them wheeling bikes onto platforms. However because so many do not do so, I do not see it as unreasonable to be asked to fold bikes prior to passing through the gates.
OK, I see.
It's a tricky one; I can see it from both points of view.
I do find myself in a position where I have to enforce a rule that I don't particularly agree with, and is only necessary because some people don't act responsibly, so I can see why such a rule may exist at certain stations.
However I do feel that there should be clarity that this rule does exist (if indeed it does!) and where/when it applies, so that the potential for conflict is reduced and people know where they stand.
There's an easy answer to that one. Stop stopping the trains at the far end of the platform.
There's an easy answer to that one. Stop stopping the trains at the far end of the platform.
Going by how some people think, the solution will be to stop trains stopping full stop!
(Which is something GTR has been trying to do quite effectively this year FWIW).
My 2p's worth - they should be folded at the point where there is sufficient space and that it would cause the least inconvenience to other people.
Not very crowded platform - fine to fold it up on the platform.
Ram-packed rush hour platform - fold it up before you get on the platform.
Okay, you may not be able to see whether the platform is crowded or not, but, if you're a regular commuter, then you should have a pretty good idea of how busy it's likely to be and to act accordingly.
Oh, and there is absolutely no excuse for cycling along the platform.
Last edited:
- Status