Tailgate through barriers prosecution

[stupidwanderer]

I boarded a train from Kew Bridge to London Waterloo and upon arrival I realised I did not have my monthly ticket and wallet in my possession as Kew Bridge does not have barriers for entry. I used a mobile app to get cash to purchase a ticket before exiting the barriers, as I was in a rush to get to a meeting I stupidly followed another passenger through the barriers so I could buy a ticket from the machine rather than consult a ticket guard which I have done in the past (previously was very time consuming). Before I could get to the machine I was stopped by a revenue officer who informed me that I may face prosecution and a criminal record even though I was intent on buying a ticket, I have a monthly ticket covering the date of offence albeit not in my possession, and willingness to pay any penalty on the spot. I gave him my correct details and he informed me I would be unable to buy a ticket for my journey from the machines if I had the chance. I should expect a letter in the coming weeks.

I know now it was a stupid mistake! What is the probability that I will get a criminal record rather than just a penalty fare/fine?

 

[yorkie]

I've closed the poll as I don't think that's going to be appropriate or helpful.

Have you contacted SWT with proof that you hold the pass?

 

[stupidwanderer]

I've closed the poll as I don't think that's going to be appropriate or helpful.

Have you contacted SWT with proof that you hold the pass?

I have called their Customer Service Centre to prove that I hold a valid pass however they were unable to advise me further in this matter. They also informed me that it is not guaranteed I will receive a letter.

 

[stupidwanderer]

I have contacted SWT however they could not advise me further until I receive a letter. They informed me that it is not guaranteed I will receive a letter either.

 

[maniacmartin]

I don't understand what you mean by using a mobile app to get cash. Can you clarify?

 

[stupidwanderer]

I don't understand what you mean by using a mobile app to get cash. Can you clarify?

I had to use my mobile phone to get cash from the cashpoint within the barriers as I did not have my wallet on me.

 

[swt_passenger]

I gave him my correct details and he informed me I would be unable to buy a ticket for my journey from the machines if I had the chance.

If he definitely said 'unable' he was probably attempting to explain that despite now having the cash, you cannot buy a ticket from Kew to Waterloo from a TVM at Waterloo.

Buying a Waterloo to Kew single or return ticket at that stage wouldn't alter the situation you found yourself in anyway. They don't confer retrospective validity, one reason why they have the time of issue printed on the front.

Personally I don't think having left your monthly pass at home will help much with the fundamental error of tailgating through a barrier.

 

[Flamingo]

I've closed the poll as I don't think that's going to be appropriate or helpful.

But it might be fun!

Digressing slightly, the OP might be on to something. Maybe we should have a poll on every thread, to decide how believable the post is, and what the punishment should be!

 

[SussexMan]

I don't understand what you mean by using a mobile app to get cash. Can you clarify?

Something like this I presume.

 

[najaB]

What is the probability that I will get a criminal record rather than just a penalty fare/fine?

I'd say almost zero probability as tailgating is a Byelaws offence which, even on conviction, isn't recordable.

 

[221129]

I'd say almost zero probability as tailgating is a Byelaws offence which, even on conviction, isn't recordable.

Also evidence of a RoRA offence surely?

 

[najaB]

Also evidence of a RoRA offence surely?

Hard to justify a RoRA prosecution if the detail of the OP's story is true: they have a valid season ticket for the journey taken, and took steps to get the money to purchase a ticket on the day.

I'm not saying that they couldn't go down that route, just that it would be be quite difficult to prove intent to travel without paying the appropriate fare as the OP has paid it (the season ticket) and can show evidence that supports their contention that they were attempting to buy a second ticket.

If I was in the TOC's prosecutions department I would go for the slam-dunk byelaws offence, rather than the questionable RoRA one.

 

[Clip]

Hard to justify a RoRA prosecution if the detail of the OP's story is true: they have a valid season ticket for the journey taken, and took steps to get the money to purchase a ticket on the day.

I'm not saying that they couldn't go down that route, just that it would be be quite difficult to prove intent to travel without paying the appropriate fare as the OP has paid it (the season ticket) and can show evidence that supports their contention that they were attempting to buy a second ticket.

Id say they could prove intent as the OP discovered before they boarded the train that they did not have their pass with them

I boarded a train from Kew Bridge to London Waterloo and upon arrival I realised I did not have my monthly ticket and wallet in my possession as Kew Bridge does not have barriers for entry.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing and they could have sortred this out at Kew Bridge before they got on the train - a quick glance seems to show a train every 15 minutes so even if they were in a rush they couldve used their app for cash before they got on the train - imsure a 15 minute wait for the next service would be a far shorter time than actually being interviewed by an RPI for tailgating - which also shows intent. Ignore this I didnt read properly

Again with hindsight - approaching the RPI to let them know of the situation before they tried to tailgate may have got them a different result here but by tailgating SWT could look at it as further intent because how do they know they wouldve bought a ticket from the machine and not just walked out?

 

[MikeWh]

Id say they could prove intent as the OP discovered before they boarded the train that they did not have their pass with them



Hindsight is a wonderful thing and they could have sortred this out at Kew Bridge before they got on the train - a quick glance seems to show a train every 15 minutes so even if they were in a rush they couldve used their app for cash before they got on the train - imsure a 15 minute wait for the next service would be a far shorter time than actually being interviewed by an RPI for tailgating - which also shows intent.

My reading of the original post was that the lack of gates at Kew Bridge meant that the missing ticket was not discovered until arrival at Waterloo.

 

[Greenback]

My reading of the original post was that the lack of gates at Kew Bridge meant that the missing ticket was not discovered until arrival at Waterloo.

I agree with this interpretation. That's exactly how I read it.

 

[Clip]

My reading of the original post was that the lack of gates at Kew Bridge meant that the missing ticket was not discovered until arrival at Waterloo.

Apologies I read it 3 or 4 times before posting but its only now that actually what you say makes more sense. I think I needed longer in bed this morning

 

[najaB]

Again with hindsight - approaching the RPI to let them know of the situation before they tried to tailgate may have got them a different result here but by tailgating SWT could look at it as further intent because how do they know they wouldve bought a ticket from the machine and not just walked out?

Agreed it wasn't a smart thing to do, and is the reason why they are here. However, if they did hold a valid season ticket for the journey taken it is difficult to say that they are guilty of

Travels or attempts to travel on a railway without having previously paid his fare, and with intent to avoid payment thereof

as they have paid the fare (even though they don't have the ticket with them).

If, as the OP claimed, they cooperated with the RPI and provided their name and address, then it's hard to make the case that they fall foul of

Every passenger by a railway shall, on request by an officer or servant of a railway company, either produce, and if so requested deliver up, a ticket showing that his fare is paid, or pay his fare from the place whence he started, or give the officer or servant his name and address; and in case of default shall be liable on summary conviction...

I'm not a lawyer, and I don't pretend to be one, but if the OP has been truthful in their posting then I would find it hard to justify a RoRA prosecution.

 

[LateThanNever]

Agreed it wasn't a smart thing to do, and is the reason why they are here. However, if they did hold a valid season ticket for the journey taken it is difficult to say that they are guilty of as they have paid the fare (even though they don't have the ticket with them).

If, as the OP claimed, they cooperated with the RPI and provided their name and address, then it's hard to make the case that they fall foul of I'm not a lawyer, and I don't pretend to be one, but if the OP has been truthful in their posting then I would find it hard to justify a RoRA prosecution.

You absolutely don't have to be. Common sense and Common Law should reign!

 

[DelayRepay]

What about bylaw 9(2)

Where the entrance to or exit from any platform or station is via a manned or an automatic ticket barrier no person shall enter or leave the station, except with permission from an authorised person, without passing through the barrier in the correct manner.

 

[najaB]

What about bylaw 9(2)

I agree that a byelaws offence has been committed which the OP has no defence against. That's why I think there's almost zero probability that they will get a criminal record. Any prosecutor worth his salt would go for the 'slam-dunk' byelaws prosecution.

 

[island]

As indicated above, it's a criminal offence to pass through the barriers otherwise than in the correct manner.

The ironic bit is that had the OP done the right thing and spoken to a staff member, he would probably have been dealt with by the usual way for someone who had forgotten a season ticket, i.e. required to purchase a new one or issued a nil paid Penalty Fare, with it refunded/cancelled when he produced a ticket that was valid at the time.