SWT First Class

[Pauldubs]

Hi I'm a newbie so sorry if this has been asked before! If travelling from Clapham Junction to Exeter Central on an SWT advance ticket is it worth paying the extra for 1st class? Do you get anything other than the better seat/ quieter envoirenment?
I usually will try to go 1st if the journey's over 3 hours providing the additional cost is not excessive but as the train probably won't be that crowded and it should be easy to get a table/window seat I'm not so fussed from this journey.
Thanks in advance

Pauldubs

 

[yorkie]

Impossible to say without knowing which train you are getting, what day of the week it is, and what the price difference is.

But I don't think you get much at all on those trains. I think the seating might even be 2+2 in First but I am not sure.

There's a far bigger difference between 1st and Std on the HSTs operated by FGW on the route via Taunton, than on the SWT route via Honiton.

 

[All Line Rover]

London to Exeter with South West Trains is operated by Class 159's. First Class seating is very nice and is 2+1 - here it is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:159014_B_Exeter_St_Davids_DMCO_First_Class_Interior.JPG.

There are no free drinks or biscuits, but for a 3.5 hour journey it is definitely worth paying extra for First Class - especially since First Class Advance tickets are available at just £21! (It's just £8 more than Standard Class which is £13.)

I think the First Class Advance fares on this route are some of the cheapest per mile (or maybe per minute) in the UK! (There is an ample supply of them too, with many still being available just 14 days in Advance).

First Great Western charge £30.50 minimum - those fares are fairly rare and you'd be hard pressed to find any at short notice.
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There's a far bigger difference between 1st and Std on the HSTs operated by FGW on the route via Taunton, than on the SWT route via Honiton.

Perhaps that is because FGW's Standard Class is so bad?

London Midland's First Class is very poor, simply because London Midland's Standard Class (on 350/1's) is very good!
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Also wouldn't it be more appropriate for this thread to be in NR General Discussion?

 

[wintonian]

If traveling on a Friday or Saturday evening I wouldn't expect first class to either be quite or devoid of drunks indeed you might have to stand as I did on a 01:05 departure to Southampton this weekend.

This is a whole other thread but the guard was very helpful and wrote me note to claim back on my ticket as it clearly wasn't safe for him to check tickets on his own on a rammed train full of drunks.

You do get a cup of tea/ coffee on weekday arrivals in to London before 10:00.

450's (blue) have 2+3 in standard and 2+2 in first – Portsmouth (via Basingstoke and via Guildford and from Southampton,) Alton, SWML peak slows and some suburban services.
444's (white) have 2+2 in standard and 1+2 in first SWML to Poole and Weymouth and Portsmouth (via Guildford)
455's (red) 3+2 in standard (no first) – metro suburban trains
159's 2+2 in standard and 1+2 in first – Exeter trains
158's 2+2 in standard and 2+2 in first (I think) – Salisbury (inc Romsey Southampton figure of 6) trains
458's 3+2 in standard and 2+2 in first – Reading trains

There are some gaps but I think that is more or less right.

Edit: 450/0's have first class 450/5's only have standard class and are only seen on some suburban routes.

 

[BestWestern]

If traveling on a Friday or Saturday evening I wouldn't expect first class to either be quite or devoid of drunks indeed you might have to stand as I did on a 01:05 departure to Southampton this weekend.

This is a whole other thread but the guard was very helpful and wrote me note to claim back on my ticket as it clearly wasn't safe for him to check tickets on his own on a rammed train full of drunks.

You do get a cup of tea/ coffee on weekday arrivals in to London before 10:00.

450's (blue) have 2+3 in standard and 2+2 in first – Portsmouth (via Basingstoke and via Guildford and from Southampton,) Alton, SWML peak slows and some suburban services.
444's (white) have 2+2 in standard and 1+2 in first SWML to Poole and Weymouth and Portsmouth (via Guildford)
455's (red) 3+2 in standard (no first) – metro suburban trains
159's 2+2 in standard and 1+2 in first – Exeter trains
158's 2+2 in standard and 2+2 in first (I think) – Salisbury (inc Romsey Southampton figure of 6) trains
458's 3+2 in standard and 2+2 in first – Reading trains

There are some gaps but I think that is more or less right.

Edit: 450/0's have first class 450/5's only have standard class and are only seen on some suburban routes.

You're very nearly right! SWT's 158's also have 2+1 in First, it's very much the same layout as the 159 pictured above. When on hire to my TOC, it's the preferred section of the train in which to take a PNB

 

[thefab444]

455's (red) 3+2 in standard (no first) – metro suburban trains

SWT's 455s have 2+2 (and some tube style longitudinal seating as well) in standard, although the seats are the same as fitted to the 450s just with more space.

 

[wintonian]

Oh good.

I think the 450/5's run round the hounslow loop and up to Woking.
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SWT's 455s have 2+2 (and some tube style longitudinal seating as well) in standard, although the seats are the same as fitted to the 450s just with more space.

Oh ok you would think I would remember considering I was on one a couple of weeks ago, although it is pretty rare to see me on a 455.

 

[Bristol Rover]

As All Line Rover says, this route is operated by Class 159s, and the first class seating is extremely comfortable - some of the nicest I've had the pleasure of travelling on. I actually prefer them to the FGW HST seats, and they are much nicer than the XC voyager ones. Definitely worth the extra.

 

[Pauldubs]

Thanks everyone.... I'll pay the extra and upgrade to 1st!
Planning to do Clapham Junction - Exeter Central -Weymouth (via X53 bus) - Clapham Junction so I'll check out the 1st Advance fares from Weymouth as well (although last time I looked they were quite pricey!)

 

[wintonian]

Thanks everyone.... I'll pay the extra and upgrade to 1st!
Planning to do Clapham Junction - Exeter Central -Weymouth (via X53 bus) - Clapham Junction so I'll check out the 1st Advance fares from Weymouth as well (although last time I looked they were quite pricey!)

I wouldn't bother coming back from Weymouth unless it is a weekend an you can the £5 upgrade (not available with advances) or can get a cheapish first advance. Although first on the 444's isn't to bad for commuter trains and rather better than on a 450 it’s not that nice and only consists of a reclining larger seat in 1+3 layout

If you wanted you can get the X53 to Wareham and save a bit but then you miss Waymouth to Wareham on the rails.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

450's (blue) have 2+3 in standard and 2+2 in first – Portsmouth (via Basingstoke and via Guildford and from Southampton,) Alton, SWML peak slows and some suburban services.
444's (white) have 2+2 in standard and 1+2 in first SWML to Poole and Weymouth and Portsmouth (via Guildford)

I thought that it went:

Waterloo-Alton & Waterloo-Haslemere-Pompey:
450s on all trains except some 444s M-F peaks

Waterloo-Poole (stoppers):
444s on all trains except some 450s (M-F only)

Waterloo-Weymouth & Waterloo-Basingstoke-Pompey:
444s on all trains

 

[wintonian]

I thought that it went:

Waterloo-Alton & Waterloo-Haslemere-Pompey:
450s on all trains except some 444s M-F peaks

Waterloo-Poole (stoppers):
444s on all trains except some 450s (M-F only)

Waterloo-Weymouth & Waterloo-Basingstoke-Pompey:
444s on all trains

Sort of the same thing though you might be right with Waterloo - Haslemere - Portsmouth (I never go that way)

I'm fairly sure that Portsmouth via Basingstoke are 450's (they seem to be when I do it)

 

[MidnightFlyer]

They are sort of the same, but believe me when I say almost all off-peak via Haslemere runs are 450s, and almost all off-peak via Basingstoke runs are 444s!

 

[swt_passenger]

I thought that it went:

Waterloo-Haslemere-Pompey:
450s on all trains except some 444s M-F peaks

That is not how it works on weekdays. As discussed in the past, firstly there are more 444 operated services than 450s on the Portsmouth - Waterloo route over the course of an entire week day, and secondly there is no difference in the ratio during the peaks either. Of 71 up direction trains leaving from Portsmouth Harbour, Ports & SS, Havant, Haslemere and Fareham (via Havant), 38 are 444s, and 33 are 450s. (Up trains are easier to find rather than flog through every Waterloo departure.)

I think you might be assuming that what you see on Saturdays is typical - and it isn't...

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Indeed it isn't . Sorry, I took what I posted from a source which I misread. Sorry.

 

[bb21]

I wouldn't bother coming back from Weymouth unless it is a weekend an you can the £5 upgrade (not available with advances) or can get a cheapish first advance. Although first on the 444's isn't to bad for commuter trains and rather better than on a 450 it’s not that nice and only consists of a reclining larger seat in 1+3 layout

If you wanted you can get the X53 to Wareham and save a bit but then you miss Waymouth to Wareham on the rails.

Coming back from Weymouth might be worth looking at Megatrain. It'll only be standard class but they're not too bad on 444s.

I don't think there's much to see between Weymouth and Wareham, or even up to Poole. You can always stay on the X53 to Poole and change there. You miss the section of Holes Bay doing it that way, but still get some views as the train goes past Poole Park and Poole Harbour on your right. Plus you get some more views of the beautiful countryside.

 

[Pauldubs]

I've booked 1st class both ways for £13.85 to Exeter and £14.50 from Weymouth (Advance for end of Aug with Senior Rail Card discount) - though the small additional cost was worth it.

 

[Goldfish62]

As All Line Rover says, this route is operated by Class 159s, and the first class seating is extremely comfortable - some of the nicest I've had the pleasure of travelling on. I actually prefer them to the FGW HST seats, and they are much nicer than the XC voyager ones. Definitely worth the extra.

The 159 1st Class seats were, I believe, salvaged from Anglia 170s when their 1st Class seating was reduced.

Also, the 458 1st Class seats are identical to the FGW standard class seats!