SWT 3 car 159 running on 2 engines

[grh]

Hi all.

Was travelling between Crewkerne and Exeter the other day.

I was sat in the leading car and when we pulled away the front engine sounded like a bag of nails. Deffining noice up through the floor and none of that turbo whistle.
The train struggled up toweard Crewkerne Tunnel then slowly built up speed.

When we came to Honiton Bank, the train just got slower and slower and slower until we ground to a hault about 1/2 mile from the Tunnel and summit. I know its quite a steep curved climb.

We rested for 5 mins then slowly moved off again reaching Exeter 30mins late.

The guard just sail sorry for the lateness, due to an engine failure.
Too me sounded like a turbo failure.


IS IT NOT POSSILBE for the other 2 engines on the train to support the running and still cope. The train was only 1/3-1/2 full. What would of happened with a FULL load???


Very interesting for your knowledge!!!


Thanks
GRAHAM

 

[Helvellyn]

I've travelled on a 6-car before that was running with all three engines on the front 3-car unit failed, so the rear unit was propelling the front one only. It arrived at Woking from Waterloo about 10 late, and was nearly 20 late at Basingstoke. As it was also night it was rather dark in the front unit, with the batteries running the emergency lights only. I think a combination of that and silence helped a few people snooze off!

 

[starrymarkb]

I've had a few 150s running on single engines - they are slow!

 

[turbo mick]

I ran with 1 engine on a 165 2 car on the north downs empty i refused to run in service due to the hills and leaf fall.went flat out through dorking deepdene 70mph and i was doing below 20mph top of dorking bank about 6miles of climbing

 

[northwichcat]

TPE keep 185s running on one engine when travelling on a negative gradient. They get all 3 switched on when they're travelling along a positive gradient.

 

[VP185]

I think a lot would depend on the general condition of the unit.... how good the remaining engines/gearboxes are, how efficent the compressors and the cooling system are.

 

[ainsworth74]

I've been on a TPE 185 that ran from Hull to Leeds with the engine in the centre car dead. Was a very comfortable ride, no noise, no vibration could get used to that! It deffinently wasn't the eco mode because we pulled out of every station without the centre engine.

 

[mumrar]

TPE keep 185s running on one engine when travelling on a negative gradient. They get all 3 switched on when they're travelling along a positive gradient.

Do you have a source for this? I'd imagine it would do all kinds of damage to transmission suddenly starting two engines and engaging drive whilst travelling at speed. I also thought (may be wrong) that all modern units have cab buttons that can only switch on/off all engines. To carry out individual isolations requires use of the isolation buttons on the underframe of each individual vehicle and I'd love to see that done whilst in motion lol :P

 

[starrymarkb]

Do you have a source for this? I'd imagine it would do all kinds of damage to transmission suddenly starting two engines and engaging drive whilst travelling at speed. I also thought (may be wrong) that all modern units have cab buttons that can only switch on/off all engines. To carry out individual isolations requires use of the isolation buttons on the underframe of each individual vehicle and I'd love to see that done whilst in motion lol :P

Its automated - the train systems handle it all.

 

[northwichcat]

Do you have a source for this?

Which one do you want as there's hundreds?

Here's RailNews's version but it was also reported by BBC, Sky, ITV and most of the major national newspapers and some regional papers: http://www.railnews.co.uk/news/environment/2008/08/05-first-transpennine-environment.html

 

[LE Greys]

I've had a few 150s running on single engines - they are slow!

I remember one that lost an engine at Truro last year, and staggered all the way to Plymouth on the leading engine only. Getting up the banks, it dropped to about 15 mph.

 

[Pumbaa]

Its automated - the train systems handle it all.

At first it required the driver activating each step as the need came ie 1 out, 2 out, all back on. Within a few months the GPS element was made functional, and now it is all automatic and out of control of the driver.

The most recent mod was to enable/disable late-running programme alterations. Previously, if the service was over a certain time amount late, the eco-mode was abandoned to give the train full power. Now it is driver discretion, ie for Manc - Liv, there's little point in taking off eco-mode when late as a) recovery time at Liverpool and Manchester, b) lowish speed limit. Whereas York - Malton with highly variable speed limits and delays can be high, the three engines running will help claw back considerable time.

 

[TheExmoorBeast]

Now just done a phone call to someone about this and it seems that the engine must be running on any coach that is at the end (leading/rear) of the train, this is, according to my contact to ensure that the head/tail light is operational + other techy bits.

If the engine on the centre car stops, it doesn't matter too much either, nor does it matter if the cab/coach(es) in the centre of a formation stop working, it is just the loss of HP, lighting & AC (open a window); If the (trailing/leading) end engine stops and cannot be restarted, then either an emergency head/tail lamp must be fitted (as appropriate).

I hope this helps.

 

[Pumbaa]

Now just done a phone call to someone about this and it seems that the engine must be running on any coach that is at the end (leading/rear) of the train, this is, according to my contact to ensure that the head/tail light is operational + other techy bits.

If the engine on the centre car stops, it doesn't matter too much either, nor does it matter if the cab/coach(es) in the centre of a formation stop working, it is just the loss of HP, lighting & AC (open a window); If the (trailing/leading) end engine stops and cannot be restarted, then either an emergency head/tail lamp must be fitted (as appropriate).

I hope this helps.

I'm presuming thats 159s, not 185s! Sounds sensible and fairly reasonable.

 

[northwichcat]

Now it is driver discretion, ie for Manc - Liv, there's little point in taking off eco-mode when late as a) recovery time at Liverpool, b) lowish speed limit.

A 185 I was on recently was 6 minutes late at Warrington Central but only 2 minutes late at Manchester Oxford Rd so it is possible to recover time on that section.

 

[TheExmoorBeast]

Correct that is a 159.

BTW, have SWT fitted Digital Doris on them, now? The last time I went, they were I believe in the process of fitting Digital Doris to them.

 

[Pumbaa]

A 185 I was on recently was 6 minutes late at Warrington Central but only 2 minutes late at Manchester Oxford Rd so it is possible to recover time on that section.

That's what I was alluding to - both directions have considerable recovery time built in. The wait at Oxford Road always irritates me! I wish TPE would consider putting in a call at South Parkway in both directions; that will alleviate waiting time in both directions (East - at Oxford Road) (West - just outside Hunts Cross to allow the Brum service have platform at South Parkway).

 

[anonymous0101]

185's are easily able to operate with one engine out as each one is rated at 750 bhp! Same applies to voyager's, 180's and 222's.

 

[devon_metro]

Correct that is a 159.

BTW, have SWT fitted Digital Doris on them, now? The last time I went, they were I believe in the process of fitting Digital Doris to them.

They've fitted Celia, another reason to not travel to Waterloo on the things.

 

[Pumbaa]

185's are easily able to operate with one engine out as each one is rated at 750 bhp! Same applies to voyager's, 180's and 222's.

185s can just about manage on one engine, although usually cancelled at next available opportunity. 220s can survive on 2, though usually canned. 221s and 180s both survive on three, and both are cancelled when gets down to 2. A 180 on 2 is the slowest heap of metal in the world...

 

[northwichcat]

A 180 on 2 is the slowest heap of metal in the world...

But no-one would notice if it was running between Stockport and Hazel Grove.

 

[anonymous0101]

But no-one would notice if it was running between Stockport and Hazel Grove.

Sorry i meant to write with the loss of one engine, not just one engine. AFAIK voyagers are timed for 4 out of 5 engines running lol

 

[fgwrich]

They've fitted Celia, another reason to not travel to Waterloo on the things.

Seconded - although in my case the only time i travel on them is when the free bee tickets come out...cheers SWT' Season Tickets...

Although...having said that, they can be fun when Celia has a malfunction...especially on the onboard trolley anouncements - to which she sounds more like she's trying to sell Kegs...instead of Cakes

i too have had a SWT 159 Run on two engines...although that was in the height of last summer and only to waterloo, still though, it certainly didn't sound to healthy from baingstoke to wimbledon way, before shutting down completly...

 

[TheExmoorBeast]

Oh well, I think I'll stick to the FGW route in the future.

I mean it is no great hardship to drive to most locations on the Waterloo - Exeter route anyway, Exeter is only just over half-hour from me, beyond that I'm now obliged to use either FGW or Cross Country anyway. If I do have to go towards Salisbury and Basingstoke then I drive to Yeovil and minimise the time I am on them anyway.

 

[Drsatan]

I travelled on a FGW 158 from Southampton Central to Romsey with just one working engine back in 2007. Even though Redbridge Junction - Romsey is as flat as a pancake the unit didn't go faster than 45mph (I think the linespeed is 75mph). Bear in mind that the unit was 85-90% full, so the added weight of those passengers would have had an adverse affect on performance.

 

[boing_uk]

I think in the two years I have been commuting with Northern I have had about five or six journeys where the engines on the 158's have not been working properly.

Usually it is either one engine is idling and the other running or one engine dead.

Although to be fair, Northerns 158's are in general complete and utter sheds, particularly the old Alphaline ones. The Perkins engined units struggle to get up Pleasington bank at anything above 45mph, even if they are flat out all the way from Bamber Bridge.

Given that I have ridden in 158888 when it was on hire, its amazing to think what these units *could* be like if they had the right amount of money thrown at them, and not just some paint.

On a side note, I have noticed also in the last 12 months that more and more of the 142's have started hunting on sections of track where they never suffered before. The other morning, the unit I was on, the oscillation was so severe and sudden the driver braked and every time the unit got above about 60mph, off it went. Is this a vehicle-only problem, or a vehicle/PW interaction problem?

 

[Edvid]

185s can just about manage on one engine, although usually cancelled at next available opportunity.

Some weeks back I was in a 185 running on one engine from Leeds to Manchester Piccadilly (where it was taken out of service). We lost a considerable amount of time, which wasn't surprising especially given the gradient west of Huddersfield.