Supermarkets and Covid-19

[Bletchleyite]

I used to do it regularly until Hotels.com started doing 10th night free, but I am an outlier who often isn’t sure how far they will get until they get there.

Yeah, I think that's quite unusual. These days even people who are riding around randomly on Rover tickets (already a niche) would probably prebook something on their phone to avoid getting somewhere and finding nothing available. Generally speaking, people who will do that sort of thing are younger, and almost all younger people are enthusiastic smartphone users, so the booking.com/hotels.com and Hostelworld apps would serve well for this.

 

[bramling]

Just picturing someone trying to nonchalantly carry a microwave through reception without being asked what they are doing!

Fortunately at our hotel there was a back entrance which led more or less directly to our room, so we were able to get it in without needing to negotiate the reception area!

They could hardly say much, as on a couple of the nights they were so empty that they weren't able to offer any evening meal service.

 

[Meerkat]

Yeah, I think that's quite unusual. These days even people who are riding around randomly on Rover tickets (already a niche) would probably prebook something on their phone to avoid getting somewhere and finding nothing available. Generally speaking, people who will do that sort of thing are younger, and almost all younger people are enthusiastic smartphone users, so the booking.com/hotels.com and Hostelworld apps would serve well for this.

It’s when I am on road trips, so if I get somewhere and there is nothing I can drive on.
Worst outcome was when I didn’t realise why a city centre hotel was so cheap until I got in the room and found something missing - never crossed my mind that there were still hotels without ensuite bathrooms!!

 

[trainophile]

Some B&Bs put No Vacancies signs out even when they are half empty. I was told once that this is because they don't want random folk turning up on the off chance, whereas when booked through a proper source like booking.com there is a "paper trail" should anything go wrong. So if I was stuck somewhere and everywhere seemed to say "no vacancies" it's still worth looking online, as some of them will have rooms available.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Some B&Bs put No Vacancies signs out even when they are half empty. I was told once that this is because they don't want random folk turning up on the off chance, whereas when booked through a proper source like booking.com there is a "paper trail" should anything go wrong. So if I was stuck somewhere and everywhere seemed to say "no vacancies" it's still worth looking online, as some of them will have rooms available.

There's also that some small places will allocate a quota of rooms to e.g. booking.com rather than having an "always on" reservation system.

 

[AM9]

Well it is as people didn't need to be queueing in the first place and also people had to stand close together otherwise they were in the road and car park. Unless we can all fly there wasn't any other option.

No, they didn't have to stand close together. Assuming they were adults, (and sober), they are responsible for their own behaviour.

 

[Richard Scott]

No, they didn't have to stand close together. Assuming they were adults, (and sober), they are responsible for their own behaviour.

Yes they did, otherwise they would have been in the road or carpark where they would have been restricting traffic flow and at risk of being run over. There physically wasn't enough space. Which bit of that in the first post didn't you understand?

 

[AM9]

Yes they did, otherwise they would have been in the road or carpark where they would have been restricting traffic flow and at risk of being run over. There physically wasn't enough space. Which bit of that in the first post didn't you understand?

You don't wilfuly cause obstruction, unless you want to cause a problem. With all these keyboard warriors here saying that they are going to deny traders of 'their' business, it should be easy for those with any commitment to the law (of obstruction of the highway). If they were standing as a queue in a car park, there would have been a response from the owners (presumably Tesco), and their risk of being "run over" would be minimal and certainly no valid point to your argument. Get over it, in some areas, people are just not taking responsibiliity. You don't disclose where your Tesco store or where you are located, but I don't see so much stupidity in my locality.

 

[david1212]

A few recent posts have drifted well away from supermarkets .... although I agree with most of the comments about Currys / PC World.

Last Thursday i did my weekly shop in Aldi on my way home from work. Pasta was low but I didn't notice any empty slots.

Hopefully the panic buying / stockpiling of a week ago has stopped. I didn't see anyone obviously bulk buying.

They were playing the message about keeping colleagues safe, hours reserved for the elderly and vulnerable plus no queuing for NHS & emergency workers every few minutes again.

 

[Richard Scott]

You don't wilfuly cause obstruction, unless you want to cause a problem. With all these keyboard warriors here saying that they are going to deny traders of 'their' business, it should be easy for those with any commitment to the law (of obstruction of the highway). If they were standing as a queue in a car park, there would have been a response from the owners (presumably Tesco), and their risk of being "run over" would be minimal and certainly no valid point to your argument. Get over it, in some areas, people are just not taking responsibiliity. You don't disclose where your Tesco store or where you are located, but I don't see so much stupidity in my locality.

Why keep arguing, I told you there was nowhere for them to go, just accept the layout didn't allow for queuing outside with distancing between people. It's as simple as that.

 

[trebor79]

It is a bit inane the way they do it at the minute. Needing to log into your basket just to add items pre-checkout, and pushing people into a flow of logging in, picking a slot, doing their shopping in 2 hours and then checking out and waiting. I end up grabbing a slot a few days upfront, filling the basket with booze, checking out, and then completely changing the order and checking out again the night before when I know what I actually need.

The other thing, and one that really pushed me away from online shopping with Tesco, is that if you log in to add stuff, sometimes they silently remove existing items. I think this is when it had gone out of stock, but instead of getting a substitution, it just disappears entirely. And there's no indication that it's happened.

 

[Mojo]

I overheard a shop assistant ask a man in Asda’s last night to put his muzzle over his nose as well as mouth last night, which shocked me as I’ve never heard shop staff challenge someone before. She made no comment to me whatsoever.

 

[adc82140]

The other thing, and one that really pushed me away from online shopping with Tesco, is that if you log in to add stuff, sometimes they silently remove existing items. I think this is when it had gone out of stock, but instead of getting a substitution, it just disappears entirely. And there's no indication that it's happened.

It's the same with Asda. Stuff just disappears when you log in again. I'm now doing click and collect. You only have to order a day or so in advance, and because of that short period, substitutions are rare.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Oct 2020 ==

I overheard a shop assistant ask a man in Asda’s last night to put his muzzle over his nose as well as mouth last night, which shocked me as I’ve never heard shop staff challenge someone before. She made no comment to me whatsoever.

Good. If your nose is hanging out it's pointless, and if you are wearing it improperly you're obviously not exempt, whereas someone not wearing one at all may well be exempt.

 

[trebor79]

I overheard a shop assistant ask a man in Asda’s last night to put his muzzle over his nose as well as mouth last night, which shocked me as I’ve never heard shop staff challenge someone before. She made no comment to me whatsoever.

Good. If your nose is hanging out it's pointless, and if you are wearing it improperly you're obviously not exempt, whereas someone not wearing one at all may well be exempt.

Nope, bad and your assertion is wrong. I am exempt but do my best to wear a mask at times. As I posted earlier in the face coverings thread, my being challenged like this just resulted in me taking it off and asserting my exemption.
Sorry, but if my glasses are misting up the extent I can't see I'm "likely to cause harm to self or others". So either accept I poke my nose out or I won't wear one at all.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Oct 2020 ==

It's the same with Asda. Stuff just disappears when you log in again. I'm now doing click and collect. You only have to order a day or so in advance, and because of that short period, substitutions are rare.

It's very annoying and it wouldn't be bound the wit of man to either say "these items are likely to be substituted" or "we've removed these items, please choose an alternative". It's just lazy.
So annoying when you've ordered specific ingredients and some don't arrive, even when there are plenty of substitution options.
It's one of the many reasons I've started shopping in person again and refuse to countenance going online again.

 

[takno]

The other thing, and one that really pushed me away from online shopping with Tesco, is that if you log in to add stuff, sometimes they silently remove existing items. I think this is when it had gone out of stock, but instead of getting a substitution, it just disappears entirely. And there's no indication that it's happened.

Sainsbury's do take stuff out of the basket if it's definitely not going to be available when you amend the order. They take you through a screen telling you that they're doing it though, and suggesting a substitute. The only problem with it is that the substitute might be a lot more expensive, and you won't get a voucher for the difference like you do if they make the substitution automatically.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Sainsbury's do take stuff out of the basket if it's definitely not going to be available when you amend the order. They take you through a screen telling you that they're doing it though, and suggesting a substitute. The only problem with it is that the substitute might be a lot more expensive, and you won't get a voucher for the difference like you do if they make the substitution automatically.

I seem to recall Sainsbury's are a bit more transparent about it than Tesco.

If click and collect/delivery are that popular going forward, though, it might be time to start closing some stores to walk-ins[1] and turning them into "dark stores", perhaps with a separately stocked "Tesco Express" type operation on the same site so people can still pop in for a pint of milk and a loaf of bread. If people can't walk in and pick stuff up, you can do more precise stock control, and so like Ocado should near-never need to substitute - only if a delivery did not turn up as booked (or delivered a load of rotten fresh stuff by accident) would you need to do it.

[1] No reason you couldn't do click and collect by bicycle/on foot for smaller quantities, or arrange a taxi to meet you there.

 

[takno]

I seem to recall Sainsbury's are a bit more transparent about it than Tesco.

If click and collect/delivery are that popular going forward, though, it might be time to start closing some stores to walk-ins[1] and turning them into "dark stores", perhaps with a separately stocked "Tesco Express" type operation on the same site so people can still pop in for a pint of milk and a loaf of bread. If people can't walk in and pick stuff up, you can do more precise stock control, and so like Ocado should near-never need to substitute - only if a delivery did not turn up as booked (or delivered a load of rotten fresh stuff by accident) would you need to do it.

[1] No reason you couldn't do click and collect by bicycle/on foot for smaller quantities, or arrange a taxi to meet you there.

Several of them have dark stores in London. I think it probably makes some sense in large densely-packed cities, and if you go the whole-hog approach like Ocado then you can eliminate the picking staff. Even with manual picking though, it usually makes sense to use a different type of building in a different location rather than closing an existing store, because you don't need a car park, or a central location or trolleys, or high footfall. It's also pointless letting your valuable existing customers from that store stare forlornly through the window at the things they are no longer allowed to acquire

The fact that you can operate it out of an open store has a lot of benefits anyway. It minimises vehicle mileages, and it means you can still provide a valuable community service without additional cost.

Finally, a dark store still doesn't solve your problems. You'll still get breakage, or misplaced items, and you still won't know 7 days out when people are making the order whether the supplier is going to have issues.

Amazon appear to manage it because you typically order less than a tenth the number of items in each order, and all of them are ambient and have a long shelf life. Even then they are often fudging it by offering slightly longer delivery times, and if you order half a dozen things they usually arrive in at least 3 separate deliveries, often from different parts of the country. Dark or not, supermarkets are generally providing a better solution to a harder problem

 

[Baxenden Bank]

Several of them have dark stores in London. I think it probably makes some sense in large densely-packed cities, and if you go the whole-hog approach like Ocado then you can eliminate the picking staff. Even with manual picking though, it usually makes sense to use a different type of building in a different location rather than closing an existing store, because you don't need a car park, or a central location or trolleys, or high footfall. It's also pointless letting your valuable existing customers from that store stare forlornly through the window at the things they are no longer allowed to acquire

The fact that you can operate it out of an open store has a lot of benefits anyway. It minimises vehicle mileages, and it means you can still provide a valuable community service without additional cost.

Finally, a dark store still doesn't solve your problems. You'll still get breakage, or misplaced items, and you still won't know 7 days out when people are making the order whether the supplier is going to have issues.

Amazon appear to manage it because you typically order less than a tenth the number of items in each order, and all of them are ambient and have a long shelf life. Even then they are often fudging it by offering slightly longer delivery times, and if you order half a dozen things they usually arrive in at least 3 separate deliveries, often from different parts of the country. Dark or not, supermarkets are generally providing a better solution to a harder problem

Amazon, in their Morrisons supermarket / Prime delivery option, are rather expensive. I compared a few of my regular, non-perishable / ambient items with the regular Tesco price (but not the regular Morrisons price though). The service doesn't appeal to me as their only unique selling point is delivery within two hours (if available in your area). I'm not bothered about something being delivered within two hours. The same applies to all products really - I want certainty of date of delivery, preferably within a reasonable time window that I can plan around but I'm not that desperate to want it right away and pay a premium price as a result.

Having had items worth £6.99 delivered by 'Royal Mail Next Day before 1200', and on another occasion three van deliveries in a single day, I really don't understand the Amazon way of doing things.

 

[Hadders]

I overheard a shop assistant ask a man in Asda’s last night to put his muzzle over his nose as well as mouth last night, which shocked me as I’ve never heard shop staff challenge someone before. She made no comment to me whatsoever.

General view of the supermarkets is that it is not the job of supermarket staff to enforce wearing of face coverings, it is the job of the police. SUpermarket staff are already suffering huge amounts of abuse during the pandemic without adding further hassle and conflict.

That said since the law changed requiring supermarket staff to wear face coverings at work some staff have expressed concern about consistency and have asked for more to be done to encourage customers to wear face coverings. Most retailers will now remind customers to wear face coverings but retail staff cannot (and must not) ask for proof of exemption etc.

Several of them have dark stores in London. I think it probably makes some sense in large densely-packed cities, and if you go the whole-hog approach like Ocado then you can eliminate the picking staff. Even with manual picking though, it usually makes sense to use a different type of building in a different location rather than closing an existing store, because you don't need a car park, or a central location or trolleys, or high footfall. It's also pointless letting your valuable existing customers from that store stare forlornly through the window at the things they are no longer allowed to acquire

The fact that you can operate it out of an open store has a lot of benefits anyway. It minimises vehicle mileages, and it means you can still provide a valuable community service without additional cost.

Finally, a dark store still doesn't solve your problems. You'll still get breakage, or misplaced items, and you still won't know 7 days out when people are making the order whether the supplier is going to have issues.

Amazon appear to manage it because you typically order less than a tenth the number of items in each order, and all of them are ambient and have a long shelf life. Even then they are often fudging it by offering slightly longer delivery times, and if you order half a dozen things they usually arrive in at least 3 separate deliveries, often from different parts of the country. Dark or not, supermarkets are generally providing a better solution to a harder problem

If you were starting up a new online operation then you would go down the fulfilment centre route. Existing retailers have a legacy estate of stores so it makes sense to use these to fulfil online orders but the following needs to be taken into account:

- stores need to be large enough to support the full range on offer (not all stores do this, central London is a problem for many food retailers)
- there needs to be sufficient space in back areas to run the operation and marshall picked orders prior to loading etc (chilled and frozen storage space needed as well)
- there needs to be sufficient space to park the delivery vans overnight
- utilising large stores with lower turnover is a good thing as it helps make those stores more viable, assisting with stock churn etc
- fulfilment centres aren't fully automated. Some of them have varying amounts of automation but a large part of the operation is still manual pick

 

[6862]

My local Tesco (Metro), which is one of only two supermarkets in the centre of the city where I live, is now enforcing queueing again. I normally go shopping after 8pm anyway when it's quieter as I simply don't have the time to go during the day, so hopefully I won't have to queue, unless other people have the same idea again!

 

[Jamesrob637]

I was going to ask: any reports of queuing again, especially on weekends? Guess still being on furlough means I've still the flexibility to go at quieter times. No queue at a large Tesco last Friday lunch time.

 

[island]

I had some issues at a local Sainsbury’s last week but otherwise none.

 

[big_rig]

I was going to ask: any reports of queuing again, especially on weekends? Guess still being on furlough means I've still the flexibility to go at quieter times. No queue at a large Tesco last Friday lunch time.

Line for my local Waitrose in the rain today was round the corner and down the street. Probably twenty minutes worth given previous experiences, so I flagged it. In the winter if it continues I may crack and go for deliveries. I have been in line for over half an hour many times for that store (Including a few hour long waits at the height of the madness) yet the Sainsburys a few minutes walk away hasn’t had any queues for months. Like everything it is arbitrary isn’t it - another big shop on the high street has a big sign with a seemingly ever changing number of people allowed in at once, which goes up and down every week for reasons beyond me.

 

[birchesgreen]

No queue at my Co-Op today.

 

[trainophile]

No queue at my Co-Op today.

Nor mine, but it's only a little local three-aisle one. Probably half a dozen people in there, no notice of any restrictions.

 

[david1212]

I was going to ask: any reports of queuing again, especially on weekends? Guess still being on furlough means I've still the flexibility to go at quieter times. No queue at a large Tesco last Friday lunch time.

I work 4 1/2 days so up to March normally did my main shop on Friday afternoon.

I initially swapped to Thursday afternoon both to at least reduce queueing time and hopefully find stock levels better.

Since back at work full time I have kept to Thursday on my way home. Overall I have not found stock levels at 6pm significantly lower than 3pm and so far no queues at all.

While no directly answering your question maybe something to try ?

 

[trainophile]

Had to laugh... just had an email from Curry's saying "Congrats on your new tech". I know I said I don't get on with digital microwaves (so bought a manual one), but tech???

 

[3rd rail land]

Had to queue at a local Sainsbury's today. From what I could see whilst waiting they were allowing more people in at a time than last time that queuing was implemented.

 

[bramling]

Had to queue at a local Sainsbury's today. From what I could see whilst waiting they were allowing more people in at a time than last time that queuing was implemented.

My neighbour tells me long queues at my local Sainsbury’s today, along with frayed tempers due to the weather.

Another thing to bear in mind is that if we return to widespread queueing we’re not going to have so many people off work. People aren’t going to be receptive to doing their day at work and then finding they have to queue for ages (an experience many key workers had to ensure last time round).

 

[3rd rail land]

My neighbour tells me long queues at my local Sainsbury’s today, along with frayed tempers due to the weather.

Another thing to bear in mind is that if we return to widespread queueing we’re not going to have so many people off work. People aren’t going to be receptive to doing their day at work and then finding they have to queue for ages (an experience many key workers had to ensure last time round).

With all the WFH going on people could do their supermarket run during the daytime rather than after knocking off from work.

Its something I'll probably start doing to try and avoid queues as much as possible. Alternatively going first thing on a Saturday or Sunday should help in avoiding queues.