Super off peak

[pinball13]

I normally get a super off peak travelcard from Harlington (Beds) when travelling to London on a Saturday. Today though, I couldn't get that fare online or at the ticket machine.

In the end I got the super off peak fare by changing my departure station to Flitwick (one stop north of Harlington).

Is this likely to be just a glitch/mistake or a policy change?

 

[Robski]

Super off peak tickets at Harlington and a number of other GTR stations were withdrawn last week due to the expansion of the Contactless travel area tomorrow.

https://www.thameslinkrailway.com/service-updates/rail-fares-have-changed

Can I still buy a Period Off-Peak, Super Off-Peak or Off-Peak carnet ticket?​

To keep the price of tickets and pay as you go with contactless as similar as possible, these ticket types are no longer available on journeys where pay as you go with contactless is available. You will either be charged a peak or off-peak fare instead.

Off-peak fares have also been reduced to reflect the removal of Super Off-Peak tickets.

 

[jfollows]

https://www.brfares.com/!expert?orig=HLN&dest=1072&period=20251207 shows no such ticket, as explained in the previous post. Flitwick does, https://www.brfares.com/!expert?orig=FLT&dest=1072&period=20251207, as you note.

 

[Watershed]

Harlington no longer has Super Off-Peak fares to London. This is a deliberate change, performed as part of the fares 'simplification' exercise due to Harlington being one of the stations where contactless PAYG is being rolled out to tomorrow, under Phase 2a of Project Oval.

Of course, as you have seen, this has unintended side effects such as making it cheaper to buy a ticket from further afield. In due course, contactless PAYG is expected to go as far north as Bedford, so you won't be able to avoid paying the Off-Peak fare at weekends anymore.

As part of the 'simplification' you can look forward to new evening peak restrictions on the Off-Peak fares. The only real benefit is that there is now single leg pricing, so there's no extra cost for returning the next day (or later).

The only place where you'll still find Off-Peak fares is if you nominate a destination beyond the PAYG area, e.g. Three Bridges. But a Super Off-Peak Day Return from Harlington to Three Bridges is more expensive than an Off-Peak Day Return to most places in London, and you can't get a Super Off-Peak Travelcard without resorting to the Flitwick alternative.

 

[JonathanH]

Sorry, picked up the wrong fares. Seems it is cheaper to buy the weekend super off peak day travelcard from Flitwick instead of the other option which is splitting at Luton Airport Parkway.

 

[pinball13]

Personally, I can't see any benefit in this change. How would I use my Railcard with PAYG? Even if it was loaded onto my payment card, it's a Two Together card so it would have no idea when it could be applied.
Now I need to check if PAYG or getting a ticket is cheaper and check if I'm better off changing my departure station. Doesn't feel like a simplification to me.

 

[JonathanH]

How would I use my Railcard with PAYG?

You can't but many people who don't use PAYG do get more convenience, in the same way that PAYG has become almost universal for travel in London.

The main benefit is for commuters paying full fare, rather than leisure travellers.

Now I need to check if PAYG or getting a ticket is cheaper and check if I'm better off changing my departure station.

The railway would have you believe that you don't have to do that, but as you have noted, that isn't actually the case.

The problem essentially is running multiple fares structures for different point to point journeys within the region.

 

[redreni]

You can't but many people who don't use PAYG do get more convenience, in the same way that PAYG has become almost universal for travel in London.

The main benefit is for commuters paying full fare, rather than leisure travellers.


The railway would have you believe that you don't have to do that, but as you have noted, that isn't actually the case.

The problem essentially is running multiple fares structures for different point to point journeys within the region.

I don't mind people who want to pay extra for greater convenience doing so.

I would prefer it if existing fares could remain in place, however, so that those who don't want to pay extra for greater convenience, don't have to.

 

[canary fan]

You can't but many people who don't use PAYG do get more convenience, in the same way that PAYG has become almost universal for travel in London.

The main benefit is for commuters paying full fare, rather than leisure travellers.


The railway would have you believe that you don't have to do that, but as you have noted, that isn't actually the case.

The problem essentially is running multiple fares structures for different point to point journeys within the region.

The difference is though that people who use PAYG in London do have the option of using an Oyster card and railcard discounts can be loaded onto that. Surely that option needs to be expanded to contactless cards or it reduces the value of railcards.

 

[redreni]

The difference is though that people who use PAYG in London do have the option of using an Oyster card and railcard discounts can be loaded onto that. Surely that option needs to be expanded to contactless cards or it reduces the value of railcards.

Not Two Together or Network Railcards. Can't put those on Oyster.

So when the CDR off-peak returns were scrapped for journeys wholly within Zones 1-6, for example, holders of those Railcards had to choose between undiscounted PAYG single fares, discounted Anytime day single or return fares, or over-distance discounted (super) off-peak day returns. The over-distance option is often cheapest.

 

[SAPhil]

The difference is though that people who use PAYG in London do have the option of using an Oyster card and railcard discounts can be loaded onto that. Surely that option needs to be expanded to contactless cards or it reduces the value of railcards.

If you are only using Thameslink then KeyGo can be useful. For example, the contactless fare with railcard discount from St Albans to Gatwick is an absolute bargain!

 

[Haywain]

If you are only using Thameslink then KeyGo can be useful. For example, the contactless fare with railcard discount from St Albans to Gatwick is an absolute bargain!

I rather doubt that GTR will apply a Two Together discount to KeyGo.

 

[Alex365Dash]

If you are only using Thameslink then KeyGo can be useful. For example, the contactless fare with railcard discount from St Albans to Gatwick is an absolute bargain!

I rather doubt that GTR will apply a Two Together discount to KeyGo.

Two Together Railcards cannot be added to a keyGo account.

 

[jon81uk]

The difference is though that people who use PAYG in London do have the option of using an Oyster card and railcard discounts can be loaded onto that. Surely that option needs to be expanded to contactless cards or it reduces the value of railcards.

You can still get paper tickets at the same price as the contactless fares for rail journeys. So for railcards just get paper tickets same as before, the only difference is the option of single leg pricing.

 

[redreni]

You can still get paper tickets at the same price as the contactless fares for rail journeys. So for railcards just get paper tickets same as before, the only difference is the option of single leg pricing.

In Wales, you mean?

If so, don't let them scrap the good value off-peak tickets to try to drive PAYG uptake without making full provision for all Railcards. Or you'll end up in the ridiculous position we have for journeys wholly in London Z1-6 where you can only get Two Together and Network discounts on the Anytime fares.