Super Off Peak on Southern

[sarahj]

Thameslink have a lovely one that literally says 'If you have an Oyster, you must alight here [East Croydon] or you may be charged a Penalty Fare.'

I say before east croydon, or coulsdon south (depends on the train).' Please note that Oyster Cards, Freedom passes and those who used a contactless card to pass the barriers, are not valid beyond xxxxxxxxx unless you hold an onward ticket.'

Just had a thought, when oyster is valid to Gatwick, will that mean a) freedom passes are as well, and b) if you travel down to Brighton with an oyster/freedom, as some do, will the excess fare be charged from Boundary 6, or Gatwick? If the train does not stop at Gatwick, how will splits work. is an oyster a season where splits without stops are allowed, or a ticket were they are not?
Oh gawd, save us.

of course thats not forgetting, if Gatwick, does that mean Merstham, Rehill, Earlswood, Salfords, Horley as well, will be Oyster stations.

 

[clagmonster]

I say before east croydon, or coulsdon south (depends on the train).' Please note that Oyster Cards, Freedom passes and those who used a contactless card to pass the barriers, are not valid beyond xxxxxxxxx unless you hold an onward ticket.'

I think I'd say pay as you go Oyster cards, contactless cards, and freedom passes are not valid beyond this point, and Oyster seasons are only valid with an onwards ticket.

b) if you travel down to Brighton with an oyster/freedom, as some do, will the excess fare be charged from Boundary 6, or Gatwick? If the train does not stop at Gatwick, how will splits work. is an oyster a season where splits without stops are allowed, or a ticket were they are not?
Oh gawd, save us.

of course thats not forgetting, if Gatwick, does that mean Merstham, Rehill, Earlswood, Salfords, Horley as well, will be Oyster stations.

If the Oyster is PAYG, or a contactless payment card, then it is new ticket from the origin station.

If it is an Oyster season, it is either penalty fare or full anytime from whatever the limit of the season's validity is. There may well be Oyster Travelcard seasons available like there are for Broxbourne and Watford Jn, but that I notice that the LT fares document makes no mention of such for Grays, so it is not a certainty.

I'd be surprised if Freedom passes were made valid out to Gatwick, apart from on Boris' trains they are not valid on the Oyster extensions out to Watford Jn or Essex. But then they are valid to Swanley and Dartford. Either way, it will be penalty fare or full anytime from whatever the boundary turns out to be.

The seasons and Freedom passes will be valid on trains which don't stop at the end point of their validity, just as they are now with Boundary Zone 6 and with paper seasons. PAYG and contactless aren't valid to split unless the passenger alights from the train and touches out, so obviously there is a requirement for the train to stop in that case.
I'd be surprised if the intermediates weren't Oysterised, otherwise you'd end up with a farce.

 

[jon0844]

The GN 317s have been updated to say that people travelling with Oyster must alight at the last station IT calls at where it's valid, which is quite clever - but perhaps too clever.

The services going KGX > FPK > PBR will result in the warning being given at Finsbury Park, which is of course correct as it won't stop at any other station within the zones, but of course on another service it will be valid for more stations north.

I do think it's good that there are warnings now, but only on the 317s and perhaps the 321s. It's also good that the 317s can explain about trains that will divide later on, which is more than the platform indicators at FPK seem capable of managing. There you're just told a train will be 4-carriages, when it's actually 8 (and should be telling people about the train splitting and where to board).

Anyway, back to super off-peak tickets...!

 

[Coolzac]

If for example someone had a Super Off Return with a travelcard, could they not take the overground to Clapham Junction and then take the train from Clapham Junction onwards, even if it had departed from a London Termnal during peak hours? Or does Clapham Junction still count as 'London' with respect to ticket validity

 

[CyrusWuff]

If for example someone had a Super Off Return with a travelcard, could they not take the overground to Clapham Junction and then take the train from Clapham Junction onwards, even if it had departed from a London Termnal during peak hours? Or does Clapham Junction still count as 'London' with respect to ticket validity

The wording for the Southern Super Off-Peak (formerly Pricebuster) tickets is "Not valid on trains timed to depart London Terminals after 16:14 until 19:16", making it a blanket restriction, regardless of where you join the train.

They do note, however, that Travelcards are unrestricted inside the Travelcard Area.

 

[swt_passenger]

If for example someone had a Super Off Return with a travelcard, could they not take the overground to Clapham Junction and then take the train from Clapham Junction onwards, even if it had departed from a London Termnal during peak hours? Or does Clapham Junction still count as 'London' with respect to ticket validity

The background to the issue under discussion is that SWT's Super Off-peak restriction is different to Southerns, and IS based on where you get on the train rather than its origin. Hence the wording used in the OP: "a Poole to East Croydon was valid starting South"

 

[SickyNicky]

The wording for the Southern Super Off-Peak (formerly Pricebuster) tickets is "Not valid on trains timed to depart London Terminals after 16:14 until 19:16", making it a blanket restriction, regardless of where you join the train.

It's worth bearing in mind that online journey planners are not allowed to consider earlier stations that a train may or may not have called at when determining time restrictions. They can only consider:

The origin and destination of the journey
All locations where a passenger changes trains during a journey
The final destination of all trains travelled on during a journey
(whether or not the passenger is travelling to that final destination)

So if Clapham Junction and/or any subsequent stations aren't mentioned in the electronic version of the restrictions, the ticket will be allowed by journey planners (and thus will be valid).

 

[Bletchleyite]

They can. This can be implemented by using the "bar an entire train throughout" feature, which is incorrectly used on the 1610 ex Euston (see my other thread)