Stations Managed by an Operator That Doesn't Serve Them

[MK Tom]

I find this a really perplexing phenomenon - Coleshill Parkway and Water Orton are managed by London Midland but operated solely by CrossCountry, as are Burton-on-Trent and Willington despite being managed by East Midlands Trains... are there any other cases of this? Do LM/EMT dispatch staff to these stations every day? Perhamps most importantly, why on Earth has this happened?

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Part of the XC franchise agreement states that they can't manage stations. EMT also managed Hinckley, Narborough and South Wigston without calling, as well as Melton Mowbray, Oakham and Stamford despite running only 1tpd to them.

 

[WestCoast]

Lockerbie is an example of this. Scotrail manage it, but only First TPE and Virgin Trains serve it.

 

[gnolife]

I find this a really perplexing phenomenon - Coleshill Parkway and Water Orton are managed by London Midland but operated solely by CrossCountry, as are Burton-on-Trent and Willington despite being managed by East Midlands Trains... are there any other cases of this? Do LM/EMT dispatch staff to these stations every day? Perhamps most importantly, why on Earth has this happened?

Wilnecote is another LM managed, XC only station

 

[swt_passenger]

Dean and Mottisfont & Dunbridge on the Southampton - Salisbury line are FGW stations that FGW don't call at. In this case the service changes happened after the stations were dished out.

+1 to Matt's explanation regarding XC though. Although they are a 'national TOC' and call at dozens of stations up and down the country they'd have only a handful of their own stations to manage, so it isn't cost effective for them to have a very small number of their own station and ticket office staff, or a station property department, so it was decided against basically for practical reasons.

 

[jopsuk]

Then there's Manea, served by XC, run by NXEA- as they have people in the area. It is basically a halt, mindyou, so requires only the most minimal management

It really does come down to sheer practicality. Yes, Virgin and TPE do run stations, but Scotrail have maintenance people within sensible driving distance of Lockerbie.

 

[Blindtraveler]

Lockerbie is an example of this. Scotrail manage it, but only First TPE and Virgin Trains serve it.

any ideas on this one people? Makes no sense to me as although there are Scotrail staff at Dumfries, it would surely make more sense to be a VT concern?

 

[ValleyLines142]

Glasgow Prestwick Airport operate Prestwick station, and not ScotRail.

 

[91101]

Isnt this the same with the new Southend Airport station? Entirely managed by Stobart Rail?

 

[jopsuk]

any ideas on this one people? Makes no sense to me as although there are Scotrail staff at Dumfries, it would surely make more sense to be a VT concern?

It is a bit of an anomaly, as, after all, Dunbar (which is now served by Scotrail!) is managed by EC, despite being a pretty long way (certainly by road) from the next EC station (Berwick). Carlisle would be as reasonable a "base" to manage Lockerbie from.

 

[ValleyLines142]

Isnt this the same with the new Southend Airport station? Entirely managed by Stobart Rail?

Yes, Stobart Air

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Glasgow Prestwick Airport operate Prestwick station, and not ScotRail.

Prestwick Airport station they do; Prestwick Town station is managed by ScotRail.

 

[ValleyLines142]

Prestwick Airport station they do; Prestwick Town station is managed by ScotRail.

Yes, sorry I should have been more specific.

 

[PRS]

In a similar vain, VT manage Rugby where currently LM is the TOC serving the station the most.

 

[142094]

In a similar vain, VT manage Rugby where currently LM is the TOC serving the station the most.

That happens at a few stations - Chester-le-Street is managed by Northern but most trains are run by TPE. Alnmouth is also run by Northern but only 2 services each way between Chathill and Newcastle operated by Northern call there.

 

[MK Tom]

In a similar vain, VT manage Rugby where currently LM is the TOC serving the station the most.

Yeah I kind of resent the way Virgin operate Rugby and Stafford but not MKC which they serve more frequently than either of those. It's a hangover from sectorisation where up north Intercity got big stations and Regional Railways got the rest but for some strange reason they thought south of Rugby/Wellingborough area they'd just make everything NSE regardless of size.

 

[Tiny Tim]

It's just another anomaly of our fractured railway administration. It's not logical, but it probably doesn't really make much difference to the running of these stations. Placing all stations in Network Rail's control would be a solution, but it's not a matter of any urgency.

 

[Lampshade]

It's just another anomaly of our fractured railway administration. It's not logical, but it probably doesn't really make much difference to the running of these stations. Placing all stations in Network Rail's control would be a solution, but it's not a matter of any urgency.

Or privatise the stations/contract the running of the station out to local companies.

 

[Eagle]

That happens at a few stations - Chester-le-Street is managed by Northern but most trains are run by TPE. Alnmouth is also run by Northern but only 2 services each way between Chathill and Newcastle operated by Northern call there.

Off the top of my head:

Cheltenham: operated by FGW, majority operator is XC.
Swanwick: operated by SWT, majority is Southern.
Sheffield: EMT, plurality is Northern.
Derby: EMT, plurality is XC.
Cambridge: NXEA, plurality is FCC.

And so on.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

Deleted

 

[MK Tom]

London Midland run more services than Virgin at Rugby, Stafford, Coventry, Birmingham International, Crewe and Runcorn yet I think Virgin manage all of those. I always assumed that was purely because these stations used to be Intercity rather than Regional Railways. If it's just a question of importance then MKC and Watford Junction should be run by Virgin too. London Midland's branding makes MKC look like a local stop rather than an intercity one.

Is it me or is the whole Water Orton/Coleshill/Wilnecote area kind of forgotten about on today's railway? Might just be because I never have any reason to use it... also why are there no local Birmingham services on the [four track] Cross Country line towards Nuneaton?

 

[Eagle]

There are 4tph provided by each of NXEA and FCC at Cambridge: the former 1tph to Norwich, 1tph to Ipswich and 2tph to Liverpool St; the latter 1tph to Kings Lynn and 3tph to Kings Cross.

Ah right, thought Cambridge to King's Cross was 4tph.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Is it me or is the whole Water Orton/Coleshill/Wilnecote area kind of forgotten about on today's railway? Might just be because I never have any reason to use it... also why are there no local Birmingham services on the [four track] Cross Country line towards Nuneaton?

Because there are no stations on that section of line, paralleling as it does the Cross-City. Also adding local stoppers would interfere with long-distance services to Derby and beyond.

 

[Big Chris]

Cambridge to Kings Cross is 4tph, one slow one semi fast and two non stop.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

EDIT - My mistake - There are 4tph to Kings Cross ex-Cambridge

 

[MK Tom]

Because there are no stations on that section of line, paralleling as it does the Cross-City. Also adding local stoppers would interfere with long-distance services to Derby and beyond.

Like I said a lot of that bit is four track, and people want the Camp Hill line reopened which is closer to that part of the Cross City line than this is. It just seems to me to be the line that everyone forgot.

 

[harz99]

any ideas on this one people? Makes no sense to me as although there are Scotrail staff at Dumfries, it would surely make more sense to be a VT concern?

Lockerbie is my local station nowadays, and I must admit my first thought was Scotrail because the station is located in Scotland; but the Dunbar/East Coast issue rather dispels that theory.

Currently, on pure number of services calling it should be Tpex, although under this reasoning, a few years back before the XC split up it would have been Virgin.

The Ticket Office staff are multi functional and despatch certain trains, and can on occasion be seen shovelling snow off platforms! Not something I could ever see many Virgin Ticket Office staff doing.

For relief cover the T/O staff seem to be shared with Dumfries, not sure who does general cleaning though.

One thing for sure though, we could really do with some additional calling services, especially post morning peak southbound and back from the south late into the evening.

 

[Oswyntail]

.... Placing all stations in Network Rail's control would be a solution...

Agreed. Does anyone know why this was not done originally? I can see lots of benefit in a single station operator nationally, but what would be the down side?

 

[Tiny Tim]

Agreed. Does anyone know why this was not done originally? I can see lots of benefit in a single station operator nationally, but what would be the down side?

I seem to remember that originally Railtrack operated all the stations, but devolved some of them down to the TOCs. I've no idea why, unless it was just Failtrack doing what it did best, getting rid of as much responsibility as possible.

 

[tbtc]

Lockerbie is my local station nowadays, and I must admit my first thought was Scotrail because the station is located in Scotland; but the Dunbar/East Coast issue rather dispels that theory.

Currently, on pure number of services calling it should be Tpex, although under this reasoning, a few years back before the XC split up it would have been Virgin

I guess that Lockerbie is more of a "provincial" station, albeit one which only gets long distance services, than an "intercity" station.

Presumably with franchise changes, when the Manchester - Scotland services are electrified there'll be more more Transpennine services to Lockerbie.

Scotrail makes sense as they do run the other "provincial" stations in/around Dumfriesshire (albeit don't serve Lockerbie themselves).