Station pilots

[xotGD]

I remember the 03 shunter and flat truck duties at Scarborough in the late 70's

Yes, the 03s always ran around with a 'Match Wagon' to ensure that they activated track circuits.

 

[delt1c]

There was official 08 haulage back in the 70's. Did it once , memory a bit hazy but the Kings cross to Leeds sleeper ( yes there was one) was conveyed north on either a Newcastle or Edinburgh sleeper service ( cant recall which) the sleeping cars were detached at Doncaster by an 08 then a 47 attatched to take it forward to Leeds

 

[Big Jumby 74]

The Cambridge station pilots, one at each end, were class 03s until late 1975/early 1976

I just missed those, and as a consequence most of the remaining early (conical exhaust fitted) 03's as well (D2000-D2032, was it?). A few survived post BR service, D2012, D2027, sure there were others!

 

[ChiefPlanner]

I seem to recall there was a 47 standng for pilot or rescue duties at Reading (General) in the 1970's , we used a spare half hour to scrub some of the dirt off the numbers just to kill time , using available resources from a toilet campartment.

How sad is that ?

 

[xotGD]

I just missed those, and as a consequence most of the remaining early (conical exhaust fitted) 03's as well (D2000-D2032, was it?). A few survived post BR service, D2012, D2027, sure there were others!

03021 and 03022 found their way to Gateshead by 1982. As you note, conical chimneys rather than flower pots.

 

[High Dyke]

Loved that pick up, 8J06 to Tinsley via Lincoln, later 6D87 to Belmont, saw it after school most days at Newark whilst waiting for the (usual) 40 on the parcels around 4.30. Newark had a Lincoln based 08 into the 80s also.

Indeed. The 08 at Newark used to berth in the Downside bay, no long gone. I believe it used to trip work out to the cement factory at Kilvington, on the Lowfields line.

 

[Harpo]

03021 and 03022 found their way to Gateshead by 1982. As you note, conical chimneys

Wizards Hats was a common term

rather than flower pots

Yes!

 

[xotGD]

Wizards Hats was a common term

Never heard that one before.

 

[Magdalia]

I just missed those, and as a consequence most of the remaining early (conical exhaust fitted) 03's as well (D2000-D2032, was it?). A few survived post BR service, D2012, D2027, sure there were others!

Growing up in Cambridge, I didn't realise that all class 03s did not look like that! In the early 1970s we still had 03004/005/007/008/016, two for the station, two for Chesterton Junction, and a spare.

Chesterton Junction originally had its own locos, departmentals 91 and 92, and these also had conical exhausts. Before my time they were taken into capital stock and numbered D2370 and D2371, later, 03370 and 03371.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

Ipswich had an 03 for the odd attachment to and from TPO services , and also for the then minimal workings to the Lower Yard and docks

 

[Adrian Barr]

08 xxx assembling TPO rake at Bristol Temple Meads.

Surely, a station pilot is a loco which spends a period of several hours at a station to do anything that needs such a loco to do it?

This would involve shunting parcels vans, adding/removing vehicles from trains, shunting from platform to platform.

Nowhere requires that sort of work today.

And hasn't for quite a while I would think.

The 08 which stabled at Bristol Temple Meads for shunting mail vans might have been one of the last pilot workings to fit this definition. It might not technically have been a "station pilot" as such in the traditional sense (I'm not sure if any survived beyond the end of British Rail) but it was usually stabled in the station.

The new "Railnet" Royal Mail terminal at Bristol Parkway opened in May 2000 and resulted in the end of mail handling at Temple Meads, but even after that I think there was still a requirement to stable mail vans at Temple Meads.

This 1995 scene is fairly typical, with 08919 stabled on one of the centre roads along with its brake van:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/railpics-online/32551113314/ (Photo: Sean Lancastle)

Even in 2001 it was still possible to see an 08 stabled in Temple Meads:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/185347149@N08/49774171902/ (Photo: Pete Wilcox)

Mail handling at Plymouth continued into the Railnet era and I seem to remember a Res 08 or 09 was stabled in the station for these duties.

09013 is seen stabled in the station in August 2003 - perhaps one of the last pilot workings to regularly stable and work in a station?
https://www.flickr.com/photos/54358344@N05/54294786608/ (Photo: Bob J B)

Pilots are still occasional visitors at Plymouth station but I think they would normally be working at Laira. 08644 is seen at Plymouth with sleeper stock in December 2024:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/mtu_maverick/54178192259/ (Photo: Teddy Greene)

So when was the last station pilot in London?

That's a good question. In the period immediately before the opening of Willesden PRDC mail terminal in September 1996, mail trains used to run from Euston, Kings Cross, Paddington, and Liverpool Street. However, I think the usual practice was for main line locos to arrive and depart with the stock, rather than anything that involved a station pilot.

This photo shows a class 90 in the loco stabling siding at Kings Cross in 1992 as another 90 departs with mail stock, but it wasn't acting as a pilot as such, just waiting to drop on to the next mail train arrival and take it out:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/steam60163/5536311365/ (Photo: steam60163)

The only London station where I remember seeing an 08 in the mid to late 80s is Liverpool Street. Surprisingly, the station pilot survived into the Network SouthEast era and the electrification of the station.

08833 is seen stabled at Liverpool Street in January 1987, carrying a special black livery with cockney sparrow, British Railways emblem, and "Liverpool Street Pilot" lettering.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/tigertim1950/5401399390/ (Photo: Timothy Saunders)

The same loco is seen in platform 1 next to an NSE liveried EMU (is that a 315?). The photo is undated, but the "Full Metal Jacket" poster suggests this was summer 1987.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/andy_masons_gallery/6978904358/ (Photo: Andy Mason)

The same loco is also seen stabled at Kings Cross in 1990:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/67444577@N02/6556431721/ (Photo: Andy Cole)

I don't remember Kings Cross having a regular pilot at this time, but there are several photos of this loco here in 1990/1991. There's also this photo of 08542 on Kings Cross pilot duties next to the buffer stops in December 1991: https://www.flickr.com/photos/186292278@N07/49739449026/ (Photo: Brian Stoddart)

I imagine it was there mainly to shunt release incoming mail trains. This might have been the last regular pilot at a London terminal, possibly until 1992 or so?

 

[EbbwJunction1]

Anyone got access to the early 1980s issues of "Shunter Duties"? Would be interesting to see how many pilot duties there were.

From my 1979/1980 edition of Inter City Railway Society’s “Shunter Duties”, I counted the number of duties specifically described as station pilots or with station pilot duties among others, and came up with the following, by region:
LMR 21
ER 26
ScR 9
SR 7
WR 18
for a total of 81.
Entirely possible that I missed some or miscounted in places, but it’s close enough for a big picture.
That included some 03s as well as the usual 08/09 suspects. So maybe something under a tenth of the total shunter fleet?

I have the same version (August 1979) of this publication.

I remember various duties in or around Newport, but I was surprised to find out how many there were - 10 in all.

They were split between several locations and allocated to several different duties:
Station Pilot at Newport (1);
Trip Pilots at Monmouthshire Bank / Cripple Sidings (1), Trethomas Coke Ovens (1), Alexandra (2);
Yard Pilots at East Usk Junction (2), Alexandra Dock Junction Sidings (1), Newport Docks area (2, as required).
Most of them stabled overnight at Ebbw Junction or Ebbw Sidings.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

03021 and 03022 found their way to Gateshead by 1982. As you note, conical chimneys rather than flower pots

I believe (but would need to check my records) several locos may have had their conical exchanged for flower pot over the years, and certainly one built new with flowerpot (D2070) received a conical job during its post BR career at Queenborough Wharf.

Growing up in Cambridge, I didn't realise that all class 03s did not look like that! In the early 1970s we still had 03004/005/007/008/016, two for the station, two for Chesterton Junction, and a spare.

I always liked the conical version, probably because it reminded me of my holidays to Weymouth in the 60's when 04's were part of the mix.

Of the conical locos I remember, 008/016 were at Cambridge in October 77 (may have been others hidden in the shed), 018 survived opposite Willesden DED in to the 80s, 012 & 020 at Kings, Snailwell, 022 and 026 at Lincoln, 027 at Queenborough Wharf.

 

[Sun Chariot]

The only London station where I remember seeing an 08 in the mid to late 80s is Liverpool Street. Surprisingly, the station pilot survived into the Network SouthEast era and the electrification of the station.

08833 is seen stabled at Liverpool Street in January 1987, carrying a special black livery with cockney sparrow, British Railways emblem, and "Liverpool Street Pilot" lettering.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/tigertim1950/5401399390/ (Photo: Timothy Saunders)

The same loco is seen in platform 1 next to an NSE liveried EMU (is that a 315?). The photo is undated, but the "Full Metal Jacket" poster suggests this was summer 1987.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/andy_masons_gallery/6978904358/ (Photo: Andy Mason)

08 833 Liverpool Street Pilot was painted a pseudo-GER blue (too dark and not purpley-enough, in my view) and was lined in scarlet red. I mentioned it in post 32.

My 35mm photo of it, was in its typical (and rather infruating) position, stabled in awful lighting under the road bridge (this was prior to the Broadgate development and consequential darkness at Liverpool Street station throat).

 

[D6975]

There was official 08 haulage back in the 70's. Did it once , memory a bit hazy but the Kings cross to Leeds sleeper ( yes there was one) was conveyed north on either a Newcastle or Edinburgh sleeper service ( cant recall which) the sleeping cars were detached at Doncaster by an 08 then a 47 attatched to take it forward to Leeds

There was also a Leeds/Newcastle to the West Country service that joined at Sheffield. I had 08866 on it once.

 

[The exile]

The only London station where I remember seeing an 08 in the mid to late 80s is Liverpool Street. Surprisingly, the station pilot survived into the Network SouthEast era and the electrification of the station.

Didn’t Marylebone retain one until remarkably late on(early 90s)?

 

[Sun Chariot]

Didn’t Marylebone retain one until remarkably late on(early 90s)?

I didn't see one on my Bicester-Marylebone journeys, 1991 to 1993.
I'm wracking my grey cells as to what was used to release the (then) steam excursions into Marylebone. I only have a phoro of V2 Green Arrow taking a train out of the terminus; and class 37 D6700 brought that stock in.

 

[Gloster]

I believe (but would need to check my records) several locos may have had their conical exchanged for flower pot over the years, and certainly one built new with flowerpot (D2070) received a conical job during its post BR career at Queenborough Wharf.

I always liked the conical version, probably because it reminded me of my holidays to Weymouth in the 60's when 04's were part of the mix.

Of the conical locos I remember, 008/016 were at Cambridge in October 77 (may have been others hidden in the shed), 018 survived opposite Willesden DED in to the 80s, 012 & 020 at Kings, Snailwell, 022 and 026 at Lincoln, 027 at Queenborough Wharf.

A bit of rooting around suggests that D2000-D2032 and the two ex-departmental (91/D2370 and 92/D2371) were the only ones built with conical exhausts. However, 03 129 had one in 1979 and 03162 gained one when done up in 1987 when Birkenhead South was closed.

 

[Acathater]

A bit of rooting around suggests that D2000-D2032 and the two ex-departmental (91/D2370 and 92/D2371) were the only ones built with conical exhausts. However, 03 129 had one in 1979 and 03162 gained one when done up in 1987 when Birkenhead South was closed.

Presumably damage replacements using conicals from withdrawn 04s?

 

[Big Jumby 74]

A bit of rooting around suggests that D2000-D2032

That confirms my thoughts (post #63), D2033 being the first flowerpot loco. Just found a very dark image I took of conical D2013 at York in 76.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: Today at 14:45 ==

Presumably damage replacements using conicals from withdrawn 04s?

Or withdrawn 03's. Many of the very early locos went first. Just happen to have 1974 loco shed book in front of me, and (using D2xxx numbers as some never carried TOPS identities) D2000-D2003, D2006, D2011, D2015, D2019, D2023*, D2024*, D2028, D2030-D2032 (14 in all) had all gone, albeit two of these (*) had entered industrial service on Teeside and are today both (AFAIK) on the K&ESR.

The 1977 loco shed book only has original conical loco's 03008 / 016 / 017 / 021 / 022 / 025 / 026 & 029 left on the books.

PS:
Given the subject of shunters / station pilots, although not dedicated specifically to this subject, the two following works have several images of same at work in various situations, which I find very interesting, many of the locations being gone before my time:

First Generation Diesels in East Anglia - Alan C. Butcher - The Transport Treasury 2020 - ISBN 978-1-913251-04-8. See www.ttpublishing.co.uk

and also:

Lost Diesels, Lost Lines - Evan Green-Hughes - The Transport Treasury 2022 - ISBN 978-1-913251-22-2. See as above.

 

[xotGD]

Chesterton Junction originally had its own locos, departmentals 91 and 92, and these also had conical exhausts. Before my time they were taken into capital stock and numbered D2370 and D2371, later, 03370 and 03371.

03371 was another that found its way to Gateshead in its later life.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

Not mentioned up thread as far as I can see, and not one of the last pilot locos to exist by any means, but perhaps one of the first to be recognised, given it's existence in the public limelight day to day, and as such treated to a retro revamp by former colleagues at 30A.

 

[Magdalia]

Not mentioned up thread as far as I can see, and not one of the last pilot locos to exist by any means, but perhaps one of the first to be recognised, given it's existence in the public limelight day to day, and as such treated to a retro revamp by former colleagues at 30A.

Liverpool Street having a specially prepared dedicated station pilot loco was a long tradition going back to steam days with 68619:

FMcslides2689 68619 Liverpool St Pilot

Liverpool Street on the 11th of March 1961 and Stratford's favourite Holden J69 68619 is acting as Station Pilot. The loco was new from Stratford Works to the Great Eastern as number 53 in May 1904. It was renumbered 7053 by the LNER in 1924 and then to 8619 in 1947. Withdrawl was in October...

www.flickr.com

For a while D8234 held the honour:

'Pilot in 'The Yard'..

BTH Type 1 D8234 - the Liverpool Street station pilot - at work in around 1969. The loco later lost its 'D' prefix, but remained in green until it was withdrawn in 1971, and scrapped. One example - D8233 - which remained in use as a train heating unit, was later preserved, and is now at the East...

www.flickr.com

The tradition was revived with 08531 in 1977, around the same time as when Stratford did the Silver Jubilee embellishments on 47163/164.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

I have forgotten the year Scarborough lost its 03 pilot. Anyone know?

 

[Harvester]

I have forgotten the year Scarborough lost its 03 pilot. Anyone know?

It still had one in 1984. On 19th October that year 31405 failed between
Malton and Scarborough on the 21:57 York-Scarborough, and as it was the last train of the day the signal boxes behind the train closed. Hence no assistance was possible from York, so the Scarborough station pilot 03089 was sent out. The 03 could not move the entire train plus loco, so the train was split and the first portion with passengers was dragged to Scarborough arriving 197 minutes late.…..(source: Railway Observer).

This is not the first time 03089 made a main line rescue. When outstationed at Malton it once took over a failed passenger train and hauled it 20 miles to Scarborough.

 

[75A]

Brighton had an 09 in the 80's, used to move stock in and out of Top Yard from the Platforms and also via Hove & Preston Park.
Worst turn was on a Sunday night taking a refueled loco to Newhaven Yard and bringing back the other one. Keeping to 29mph down the Falmer Bank was impossible.