Static MK1 at Huddersfield

[alexl92]

Anyone know whether there are any plans for the grounded MK1 body that sits on the disused side of platform 2 (the old plat 2) at Huddersfield? Seems a bit of a waste having it just rot there but removing it would be quite a task.

 

[WestCountry]

Anyone know whether there are any plans for the grounded MK1 body that sits on the disused side of platform 2 (the old plat 2) at Huddersfield? Seems a bit of a waste having it just rot there but removing it would be quite a task.

It is/was used by a children's charity, and was craned in in 1985 (picture on Flickr).

As far as I know it's still in use, but it's been a long time since I was up there.

 

[455driver]

Anyone know whether there are any plans for the grounded MK1 body that sits on the disused side of platform 2 (the old plat 2) at Huddersfield? Seems a bit of a waste having it just rot there but removing it would be quite a task.

Just like it was quite a task putting it in there!

 

[theblackwatch]

It is/was used by a children's charity, and was craned in in 1985 (picture on Flickr).

As far as I know it's still in use, but it's been a long time since I was up there.

My memory is obviously not that good as I thought the platform was still accessible by rail when the coach moved there, and it had just been shunted into position. It's interesting to note that this coach entered traffic with BR around 1955, and was withdrawn in February 1984, so has now been at Huddersfield station for around the same amount of time as it spent in service!

 

[alexl92]

My memory is obviously not that good as I thought the platform was still accessible by rail when the coach moved there, and it had just been shunted into position. It's interesting to note that this coach entered traffic with BR around 1955, and was withdrawn in February 1984, so has now been at Huddersfield station for around the same amount of time as it spent in service!

I'd always assumed it was shunted but apparently it's bolted to the floor! It needs a repaint though.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

AIUI, the tram-train proposals would have seen it removed, and the site it occupies used for a platform suitable for the low-floor tram-train vehicles. Not sure how they'd have shifted it though. Perhaps cutting it up on site would be the only option, as I'm not sure where you'd fit a crane capable of lifting it now that the building on Westgate has been extended.

 

[Murph]

AIUI, the tram-train proposals would have seen it removed, and the site it occupies used for a platform suitable for the low-floor tram-train vehicles. Not sure how they'd have shifted it though. Perhaps cutting it up on site would be the only option, as I'm not sure where you'd fit a crane capable of lifting it now that the building on Westgate has been extended.

There's still 4 rail mounted 75t telescopic jib cranes built in 1977, isn't there? An empty mark 1 without bogies can't be that heavy, is it? Alternatively, a big road mobile crane parked at the front of the station? If you can't get a smaller crane close, there's always the (slightly expensive) option of a big crane further away, e.g. a 250t road mobile crane could probably pick it from a fair distance. You can also do things like a tandem lift with smaller cranes, etc. It might not be an easy lift, but it would take a lot to make it impossible if you really wanted to crane it out and were willing to hire in the right plant for the job.

Alternatively, just buy a lot of cushions and scratching posts, and fit a cat flap for Felix.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

There's still 4 rail mounted 75t telescopic jib cranes built in 1977, isn't there? An empty mark 1 without bogies can't be that heavy, is it? Alternatively, a big road mobile crane parked at the front of the station? If you can't get a smaller crane close, there's always the (slightly expensive) option of a big crane further away, e.g. a 250t road mobile crane could probably pick it from a fair distance. You can also do things like a tandem lift with smaller cranes, etc. It might not be an easy lift, but it would take a lot to make it impossible if you really wanted to crane it out and were willing to hire in the right plant for the job.

Alternatively, just buy a lot of cushions and scratching posts, and fit a cat flap for Felix.

I don't think a rail mounted crane would be suitable, as the carriage is not fit to move by rail. St. George's Square is the wrong side of the substantial station buildings, meaning a crane with a fair old height would likely be needed. A crane could possibly lift it from Westgate, above the opening of the Huddersfield tunnels (and have space for the extra anchors on the crane to be deployed), though that would be quite disruptive for however long it took, likely blocking access to the bus station.

 

[Murph]

I don't think a rail mounted crane would be suitable, as the carriage is not fit to move by rail.

Bring in a couple of suitable bogies which are fit to run, lift it onto them? Possibly it would need to be hauled unbaked, but surely not rocket science to haul it at low speed sandwiched by a couple of suitable braked barrier wagons, at least to a relatively nearby siding where it can be more comprehensively dealt with?

 

[61653 HTAFC]

Bring in a couple of suitable bogies which are fit to run, lift it onto them? Possibly it would need to be hauled unbaked, but surely not rocket science to haul it at low speed sandwiched by a couple of suitable braked barrier wagons, at least to a relatively nearby siding where it can be more comprehensively dealt with?

That could work, though it was (I think) delivered by road rather than rail when it was put in place. I may have also overestimated the 'footprint' required for a road based crane.

 

[sprinterguy]

There's still 4 rail mounted 75t telescopic jib cranes built in 1977, isn't there?

Would they be able to work at a sufficient jib extension and angle in order to clear the platform canopy from the "railway" side though?

 

[Murph]

That could work, though it was (I think) delivered by road rather than rail when it was put in place. I may have also overestimated the 'footprint' required for a road based crane.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure it would be possible without too much real effort, with the aid of a good crane hire company. I've dealt with hired 75-100t mobile cranes before, and pretty sure they would be able to stretch over the station building from the front, and the footprint isn't that large. (Not sure 75-100t would be big enough from the front, you'd need a crane expert to figure out the max working load at the distance required.) With some mobile cranes, you can get away with only a partial extension of the outriggers on the non-load side, as long as they are properly down, to reduce the footprint.

 

[Murph]

Would they be able to work at a sufficient jib extension and angle in order to clear the platform canopy from the "railway" side though?

No idea. It would depend just how close you could get them and still get their outriggers down, etc. Maybe would need to be a tandem lift, or maybe not possible that way.

 

[coxy]

I was at Huddersfield Station (briefly) on the 20th Jan.

From what I could make out, the coach was on bogies, but unclear if these would actually work or not.

 

[alexl92]

I was at Huddersfield Station (briefly) on the 20th Jan.

From what I could make out, the coach was on bogies, but unclear if these would actually work or not.

The flikr link in the second post on this thread shows it being craned without bogies but that might have been a safety thing.

I don't think a rail mounted crane would be suitable, as the carriage is not fit to move by rail. St. George's Square is the wrong side of the substantial station buildings, meaning a crane with a fair old height would likely be needed.

The buildings aren't between the coach and teh square directly though, theres the carriage, a thin wall and then a paved bit of road. You'd struggle to fit a crane in there though.

Would they be able to work at a sufficient jib extension and angle in order to clear the platform canopy from the "railway" side though?

Nope! Can't be lifted directly out anyway.

Screenshot from Google Maps:
http://i1310.photobucket.com/albums/s649/04lancaa/static_zps443e819a.png

 

[Murph]

Nope! Can't be lifted directly out anyway.

Screenshot from Google Maps:
http://i1310.photobucket.com/albums/s649/04lancaa/static_zps443e819a.png

It looks like the centre line plus a reasonable margin is clear of the canopy. With the right rigging (spreader bars very close to the carriage roof), it could possibly be carefully picked, slewed clear of the canopy, then lifted. Not necessarily possible without removing some of the canopy, but not necessarily impossible either. It really comes down to what is more reasonable/important, getting it out of there, or the cost of a fresh coat of paint. If the space isn't urgently needed, I suggest a few tins of paint.

Might be better to just fit the cat flap and scratching posts

 

[tjlrailblue]

does anyone even want a mk1 coach body???

 

[Murph]

does anyone even want a mk1 coach body???

Well, if it does need to be gone from that spot, scrapping it right next to a passenger platform, in a fairly tight spot, could be enough of a pain to make getting it out worthwhile. Just talking hypothetically here, I'm not an advocate of scrapping mark 1s for the sake of it, only if that's the only realistic option.

 

[6Gman]

does anyone even want a mk1 coach body???

There's not exactly a shortage is there?

 

[Darandio]

does anyone even want a mk1 coach body???

The DFT want to cascade it to Northern.

 

[plarailfan]

The coach came by rail from York, and was then left, for a few days in the goods yard at Huddersfield so the C & W could do some preparation work.
It was lifted out of the goods yard with a road crane. Two lorries transferred the coach round to the front of the station - one took both the bogies, while the other carried the body.
Here's a photo I took, just after they had gone underneath the railway bridge and coming into the town centre https://www.flickr.com/photos/41294...76U-6Pxipi-6Pxidt-6PMxDT-cjFhfQ-9v4wne-8udYVB

 

[kermit]

Amidst all this enthusiastic chatter about cranes, canopies and cutting torches, have we actually verified that the playgroup don't still use it?!?

 

[alexl92]

I had a look last night and it is indeed sitting on bogies and a short piece of track.

Surely a MK1 can always be found some kind of use? The Battlefield Line (I think) recently had to borrow a pair from the GCR and I've heard of a couple of others that are looking to buy more coaches soon so I'd imagine that a surplus is unlikely.

No idea if it's still used but it doesn't look like it.

 

[nlogax]

No idea if it's still used but it doesn't look like it.

With the last year or two it was internally refurbed as part of a Prince's Trust project for the nearby Yorkshire Children's Centre. I believe it's still in use.

 

[Ploughman]

Forget all thoughts about using a small crane like a 100 - 150 tonne capacity.
A 700 tonne Crane may be able to lift 700 at a tight radius around 5m but can only manage 50t at 32m radius.
How heavy is a Mk1?
What would be the distance from the coach to the nearest point were a crane could stand?
Remembering that it would need to be the centre of the crane including the outrigger distance and underground services may affect positioning as well.

I had to plan a lift of a 6t Portacabin a number of years back. I worked out that I would need a 500t crane due to the radius. Cost was about £7K we left the cabin alone and bought a new one instead, it was cheaper.

 

[Mark62]

I suspect its been quite a while since Huddersfield saw a proper train/carriage

 

[alexl92]

I suspect its been quite a while since Huddersfield saw a proper train/carriage

Gets railtours fairly frequently. I've seen Riley's Black 5 twins, the Northern Belle and Princess Elizabeth there in the past 4 years, and I know of a number of others that passed through.

 

[theblackwatch]

I had a look last night and it is indeed sitting on bogies and a short piece of track.

Surely a MK1 can always be found some kind of use? The Battlefield Line (I think) recently had to borrow a pair from the GCR and I've heard of a couple of others that are looking to buy more coaches soon so I'd imagine that a surplus is unlikely.

No idea if it's still used but it doesn't look like it.

There are plenty of Mk.1 coaches all over the country - the shortage is of ones in decent condition that could be put into service at a reasonable cost. Go to many lines and you'll find a good number of Mk.1s rotting away in a siding, having reached their 'best before' date. I gather one of the major shortages is of wheelsets, and they are considered to be one of the most valuable components on a Mk.1 now.

 

[alexl92]

There are plenty of Mk.1 coaches all over the country - the shortage is of ones in decent condition that could be put into service at a reasonable cost. Go to many lines and you'll find a good number of Mk.1s rotting away in a siding, having reached their 'best before' date. I gather one of the major shortages is of wheelsets, and they are considered to be one of the most valuable components on a Mk.1 now.

Couldn't a group of heritage railways club together to have a large batch of new wheelsets made?

 

[cjmillsnun]

There are plenty of Mk.1 coaches all over the country - the shortage is of ones in decent condition that could be put into service at a reasonable cost. Go to many lines and you'll find a good number of Mk.1s rotting away in a siding, having reached their 'best before' date. I gather one of the major shortages is of wheelsets, and they are considered to be one of the most valuable components on a Mk.1 now.

I'm surprised they didn't secure them from the Mk1 EMU fleet