Starting short after 0930

[Nicholas43]

If I hold a return ticket from A to C and back which is valid via B, restricted on the outward journey to travel at or after 0930, may I start my journey short at B shortly after 0930, even though if I had started from A, I would have had to board before 0930 in order to be on the train I am proposing to board at B? Obviously I would pay separately for travel from A to B.

 

[CheapAndNerdy]

If I hold a return ticket from A to C and back which is valid via B, restricted on the outward journey to travel at or after 0930, may I start my journey short at B shortly after 0930, even though if I had started from A, I would have had to board before 0930 in order to be on the train I am proposing to board at B? Obviously I would pay separately for travel from A to B.

It depends on the precise wording of the restriction. Can you tell us the details of your ticket, or at least the restriction code?

 

[Nicholas43]

I was, probably unwisely, trying to ask a generalised question. The specific instance is actually 2 tickets with a two together railcard, restriction 7B. It's the use of the railcard which limits outward travel to after 0930.

 

[CheapAndNerdy]

The restriction for your ticket can be found at http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/7b

An extract from this restriction states:

Not valid on trains timed to depart:

• London Terminals (except those below) after 04:29 and before 09:30;

For this particular restriction code, the cut-off time is based on when the train departed a London terminal, not when you board.

In addition you would also need to comply with the rail card restriction.

 

[talldave]

...
For this particular restriction code, the cut-off time is based on when the train departs a London terminal, not when you board. So for your example, you would not be able to board after 09:30 at any station except the London terminal.
....

I'm not sure that's entirely clear? I would say you can only board a train that departed from a London Terminal at, or after, 09:30.

 

[CheapAndNerdy]

I'm not sure that's entirely clear? I would say you can only board a train that departed from a London Terminal at, or after, 09:30.

You're right. I noticed the error and removed it.

 

[bb21]

Can you actually say what ticket you have and what you intend to do because this is all very confusing trying to second guess.

There isn't a loophole here so I don't quite understand all the secrecy.

 

[Nicholas43]

Sorry. Culham to Norwich. Start at Culham at 0917, or Didcot at 0930.

 

[moliones]

The restriction on arriving at the London Terminal in the morning peak period (04.29-10.00) doesn't matter here, as the train doesn't arrive until 10.14 into Paddington. (Off-peak tickets are valid on the 9.17 from Culham or the 9.30 from Didcot, travelling to Norwich.)

I think as long as you have a ticket with no railcard applied for any travel before 9.30, then (by my understanding) that should be fine.

 

[bb21]

Ask yourself these questions below:

Does your train fall foul of the time restrictions listed in the restriction text?
Is there any break of journey restriction on the fare?
Are you travelling before 0930?

If the answer to all three are "no", which at a glance I think is the case here, then perfectly fine imo.

 

[yorkie]

Providing both the Railcard restrictions and ticket restrictions are adhered to, it's absolutely valid to start (or finish) 'short'.

Particular care needs to be taken to take account of all relevant wording; I won't comment on an algebra question as my brain has too much going on at the moment

 

[Nicholas43]

Thanks to all.

 

[Smidster]

This kind of thing is something I noticed after TPE introduced their draconian restrictions on people leaving the cities.

For example travelling from Leeds to stations on the Mid-Cheshire line there is a restriction against trains departing before 07:45. Now aside from the fact that I thought the whole purpose of the restriction was to prevent people leaving the city before a certain time, and therefore for the first bit to reach Manchester I don't see why they care, it does create some horrible little cases. For example leaving Knutsford under the leaf fall timetable there was a 07:46 train whch became the 07:44 and isn't given as valid but travel to Mobberley, the next station, and you are fine to use the same train which connects onto an earlier one out of Manchester.

My failure is trying to find logic in these things!

 

[yorkie]

The Off Peak Return (SVR) on this flow was completely unrestricted under BR.

The logic used by TPE is basically to get people to pay more money. They cannot raise that fare higher than regulation allows (they would if they could) so they restrict it.

So if you travel just before 0745 you need to "split" at a suitable station further along the line. Trainsplit will usually identify the best "split" points.