Starting over: A redesigned London Underground (and overground) system

[Harshil]

Hi after reading the recent forum post where someone asked the forum their ideas on what main trunk routes would be if they could completely redesign the national rail tracks and have no restrictions; I wanted to start a similar forum post regarding how people would design Londons city, suburban, regional and long distance lines. Comment where you would place trunk lines and termini and how you would draw tube services through Central London and the suburbs.

 

[jopsuk]

I'd leave the network more or less where it is.

Except I'd stick it all underground. And make all junctions grade separate.

And add an extra pair of tracks to the Circle, running Circle services as high frequency stopping at all stations and the other SSR services as express.

on the GEML and GWML I'd create an extra pair of tracks for Crossrail throughout (and two more tracks up the GEML to Ipswich for local services)

on the ECML I'd add two extra tracks to Welwyn Garden City for Moorgate services.
On which, the Hertford loop services would gain their Stevenage terminus facility.
And further to this, they'd become Crossrail 3, with services running through to meet the Bexley, Bexleyheath and Abbey Wood routes. A third "north" branch would be short, following the old route to Alexandra Palace via Highgate. The Crossrail 2 western arm would not terminate at Southgate, instead also running to Welwyn Garden City.

Assuming the Hayes branch would get taken over by the Bakerloo.

I'd do the Watford DC-NLL thong, supported by an Outer London Freight Orbital. The New Cross branch would go to Bromley North and the Bakerloo northern end would head west into untouched territory

Acton to Rayners Lane would go to the District Line but using Met Line S8 stock.

Two extra Thameslink tracks for Thameslink Metro (rebranded Crossrail 4), which as well as Sutton loop would taken the remaining Southeastern metro lines.

Much of SW Metro would have been dealt with by Crossrail 2.

the reamining Windsor side SW metro and the bulk of the south central metro would be a problem. South central especially, it's a tangle of low frequency services at the moment. Any rationalisation means people would have to change trains more.

Important: All Underground, Overground, Crossrail would have platforms (re)built to be straight and level with level boarding and step free access to the street.

 

[B&I]

Starting from scratch, would you bother with the tube lines, or would you have, from day one, a network of high capacity mainline-sized trains running via a series of cross-town routes out to the suburbs and commuter towns, perhaps with additional tracks to allow separation of stopping and express services further in, and a number of orbital lines?

 

[Railsigns]

If London's Underground/Overground system was being designed from scratch, there'd be far fewer junctions, as these impact on headways and are a major cause of failures. Like any modern metro system, there would ideally be a network of fully segregated lines, with interchange stations where they intersect one another. Any connecting tracks between different lines should only be used for empty stock transfer.

 

[matt_world2004]

A spider web line layout across london will ensure thst everyone is almost equidistant from services and ensure the quickest overall journey time.

 

[mallard]

Better integration between lines; remember that much of the Underground was built by companies in competition with each other and therefore actively avoided direct interchange. While much of this has been "fixed" over the years, it still results in needlessly complex station design and the consiquent overcrowding. Ideally there would be far more "cross-platform" interchanges and far more circulation space.

On a similar note; better integration between National Rail and the Underground. The current model of having "terminals" where all NR services finish and the large numbers of passengers transfer to the tube would be replaced with several high-capacity Thameslink/Crossrail-style through routes connecting to ligher underground metro routes at large, well-designed interchange stations, with routes designed such that there isn't a single interchange that's used by a dispropotionate number of passengers.

The route of the Bakerloo line, for example, would make for a good through NR route connecting the Waterloo and Charing Cross commuter routes with those from Euston, Paddington and Marylebone. The Victoria line could be replaced with a route linking the lines into Victoria and Waterloo with those leaving Kings Cross, St Pancras, Euston and even the West Anglia routes from Liverpool St.

Additionally, it would be even better if these extra cross-London routes could be 4-tracked and set up so that limited-stop express services (using 125mph-capable "Intercity" stock) could run through London and thus reduce the number of long-distance passengers have to cross London via the Underground (or the metro/commuter routes that I'm proposing).

(Obviously all this would be far too expensive and impractical to implement, I'm interpreting this as a fantasy thread...)

 

[swt_passenger]

Do we assume the OP is using “overground” to mean all mainline rail, or just the “Overground” that TfL run...

 

[Harshil]

Hi I also meant it as mainline rail as well.

 

[Pshambro]

Do people think it would be a good idea to have a Grand Central type station where all long distance routes converge (albeit grade separated) so that long distance passengers changing in London don't have to use metro services alongside commuters and locals doing short journeys.

I've changed at Tokyo central from the airport shuttle to the Shinkansen in the Friday night rush hour and whilst that was bewildering in the extreme, it probably wasn't as bad as having to find the right metro and get on it (with rucksack) to another terminus.