Standing on Trains?

[bAzTNM]

Is this thing only allowed when the train is full?

Yesterday on the way from Carntyne to Bellgrove, the train was absolutely mobbed. Not a seat to be had. This Walter Matthau looking ticket guy comes up to me and demands that I should be sitting down. I said "Where?" and he shot me a very angry looking glare. I wasn't blocking the doors either. Lucky it was only one stop.

 

[NSEFAN]

Never heard of any requirement to be seated. Obviously if seats are available then you might as well sit, but I don't think it's compulsory.

 

[stut]

I can think of several occasions where I've chosen to stand rather than sit. Particularly on trains with 3+2 seating - my shoulders are wider than those seats, and if I've been sat down all day at work, standing for half an hour is infinitely more comfortable!

 

[trainophile]

I was on a LM not so long ago and the train manager (or was it the refreshment vendor?) asked some people standing if they would please sit down as there were plenty of seats. Can't understand preferring to stand myself, but it takes all sorts.

Edit: Ah, Stut has answered my last point already!

 

[dk1]

I would like to see them try that with the Colchester commuters in the evening. Must be upto 20 regulars on the 18.30 who stand around the buffet area consuming bath loasds of beer, gin & vino & would refuse to sit if they had the entire train to themselves.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

You can understand the reasoning when a trolley service is on the train, as the staff member needs free acess to perform their duties.

 

[Fincra5]

People sit in luggage racks and all sorts. There is nothing stopping you from standing the whole journey, some people prefer to.

 

[Metroland]

Is this thing only allowed when the train is full?

Yesterday on the way from Carntyne to Bellgrove, the train was absolutely mobbed. Not a seat to be had. This Walter Matthau looking ticket guy comes up to me and demands that I should be sitting down. I said "Where?" and he shot me a very angry looking glare. I wasn't blocking the doors either. Lucky it was only one stop.

The only solution would be to pre-book everything, hardly practical for a short 10-40 mile train ride or 2-3 mile bus or tram ride. You can of course pre-book on longer distance trains...

 

[cuccir]

There's probably a bylaw somewhere stating that you can't block the driver's door/emergency exit routes, but other than that then you can stand if you want!

 

[Tom B]

You can understand the reasoning when a trolley service is on the train, as the staff member needs free acess to perform their duties.

I do remember just before Christmas when the ECML fell to bits (again) a packed HST with passengers standing in the aisles... and the guard announcing that there was no trolley service "owing to passengers obstructing the aisles"... as if passengers were standing there specifically to inconvenience the trolley girl!

 

[DarloRich]

What i dont get it people who will stand, rather than ask someone to move thier feet/bag/case/wahtever form a seat. They stand looking on the other passernger with evil intent in thier eyes yet do nothing. Why?

I make a beeline for these inconsiderate peopel and get them to move thier stuff, I have done it even when there are lots of other empty seats just to make a point!

 

[driver9000]

There's probably a bylaw somewhere stating that you can't block the driver's door/emergency exit routes, but other than that then you can stand if you want!

There is usually a notice on the door telling passengers not to obstruct the cab door. Not thst anyone pays any attention to it, I've lost count of the number of times I've opened the door into someone or knocked a pile of luggage over with it....not so helpful if I'm trying to get out in an emergency.

To go back to the original question, if you want to stand then do so as long as you aren't obstructing cab doors.

 

[strange6]

There is usually a notice on the door telling passengers not to obstruct the cab door. Not thst anyone pays any attention to it, I've lost count of the number of times I've opened the door into someone or knocked a pile of luggage over with it....not so helpful if I'm trying to get out in an emergency.

But you're the captain of the ship and should go down with it!

 

[driver9000]

But you're the captain of the ship and should go down with it!

No I'm not. That was made perfectly clear to us in the driving school. Do what you can and then run if possible.

 

[strange6]

No I'm not. That was made perfectly clear to us in the driving school. Do what you can and then run if possible.

Run where?

 

[driver9000]

The saloon or away from the cab. once the brake is in emergency there is nothing more to do. Drivers lives have been saved by them bailing out to the engine room or saloons - the Driver of the 142 that ran through the buffers at Lime St ran and lived, if he'd stayed he would have been killed. I've bailed before (thankfully a false alarm in the end) and I wouldn't hesitate to bail again. The last thing I need is my exit being hindered.

 

[strange6]

Pity you didn't have cab doors like the 1st gens. Still, you're a lot safer on your train than when you were driving buses.

 

[mappman1000]

I would not have thought that you have to sit down on any train. But I've seen guards telling people to sit down on occasions when its teenagers running up and down the train and screaming and swearing.

 

[strange6]

The last thing I need is my exit being hindered.

Then you would think something would be done about overcrowding on H&S grounds

 

[DarloRich]

Then you would think something would be done about overcrowding on H&S grounds

It is - each vehicle has a % figure above seating capacity BEFORE the train is overcrowded. Much like buses have a sign saying 38 seated and 10 standing.

They shouldnt (!) run above that limit - but of course they do, as we all know.

Now where that information is held is another question.

 

[driver9000]

There is no such sign carried on trains. It would be nice if they were fitted though but I don't know what good they would do and they would probably cause a lot of arguments when people are told "it's full"

 

[DarloRich]

oh no it isnt displayed anywhere! ( it is on a bit of paper in a locked filing cabinet at HQ!)

 

[driver9000]

Seating capacity is displayed on the vehicle end, I've never been told any standing capacity. Northern are trialling a 'keep clear' area on a few 14x units.....we'll see how that pans out.

 

[DarloRich]

They exisit - for instance 321 units have the highest "capacity" of all units on the WCML

 

[strange6]

Seating capacity is displayed on the vehicle end, I've never been told any standing capacity. Northern are trialling a 'keep clear' area on a few 14x units.....we'll see how that pans out.

lol Not very well I would imagine, especially during peak times.

 

[MidnightFlyer]

I stand 90% of the time on the typical 142s between Cherry Tree and preston and return and have never been asked to sit, even when the train is 90% empty..

 

[All Line Rover]

I make a beeline for these inconsiderate peopel and get them to move thier stuff, I have done it even when there are lots of other empty seats just to make a point!

If I was occupying 2 seats (1 with my bag), and you asked me to move the bag even though there were plenty of empty seats available, I would tell you to sit in one of the empty seats instead!

I only move my bag for people when the train get's reasonably full. I can't stand sitting next to someone in Standard Class 2+2 seating (it's bad enough in First Class on the rare occasion that it happens).

 

[WillPS]

I was on a (relatively) lightly loaded EMT NOT-LIV service the other week, plenty of seats free, but some dotty cow saw fit to stand up and guard her backpack in the luggage stack, not letting the bloody pressure shut.

Most annoying.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

If I was occupying 2 seats (1 with my bag), and you asked me to move the bag even though there were plenty of empty seats available, I would tell you to sit in one of the empty seats instead!

I only move my bag for people when the train get's reasonably full. I can't stand sitting next to someone in Standard Class 2+2 seating (it's bad enough in First Class on the rare occasion that it happens).

Just smacks of being downright selfish tbh. If there are only a handful of empty double seats and I'm travelling alone I normally sit next to somebody - I get seriously annoyed when I travel with my girlfriend only to find no double seats because everybody's travelling alone.

 

[All Line Rover]

Just smacks of being downright selfish tbh. If there are only a handful of empty double seats and I'm travelling alone I normally sit next to somebody - I get seriously annoyed when I travel with my girlfriend only to find no double seats because everybody's travelling alone.

If I ever see a couple of 2 or a family of 4 who need to sit together, I will happily move somewhere else, but I would not move when asked if there were plenty of sets of 2 seats available.

 

[Weary Walker]

It is - each vehicle has a % figure above seating capacity BEFORE the train is overcrowded. Much like buses have a sign saying 38 seated and 10 standing.

They shouldnt (!) run above that limit - but of course they do, as we all know.

Now where that information is held is another question.

Interesting - and contradicts the line from one of the TOC's.

Last year I was travelling on an advance ticket where the coach did not exist let alone the seat reservation. Despite boarding at the origin station of the train I could not get a seat. I felt the train was dangerously overcrowded and after the event complained to the TOC pointing out that I would not have travelled on the train in those conditions except that my ticket was not valid on any other service.

The relevant part of the response was:
I was very concerned to learn of the crowded conditions on the train. There is no legal limit to the number of people who can be carried on a train (unlike a plane or bus), however we are aware of the implications with regards to passenger comfort. The issue of health and safety has been raised from time to time with the HSE's Railway Inspectorate. It is believed that overcrowding is an issue of comfort and, although it is less comfortable to stand, there is no significant additional safety risk. If this were to change and they imposed set limits for the number of passengers per service, we will of course comply immediately.