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Stagecoach Repaint Updates
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I'd agree but ironically it's a mockery of what Stagey said the point in switching to three liveries was for, by introducing a fourth!
The whole exercise is a complete dog's dinner.
py_megapixel
Established Member
Do we have any confirmation of whether "Lakesider" and "The Lakes Connection" are staying (i.e. in Cumbria?)
RomeoCharlie71
Established Member
They are
py_megapixel
Established Member
That's good, I like those liveries.
To give Stagecoach the benefit of the doubt, as no vehicle has been painted into the Ocean Green "Specialist" livery - 26026 the launch vehicle has since been painted into the general local service livery - it is "possible" that blue is now to be used for specialist services and there isn't a 'fourth' livery.
However, given Exeter P&R buses have been painted into the new standard local bus livery, Cambridge Busway is using a non-standard allover green version of the new scheme, whilst the Cambridge zero emission buses (14033 and 14034) wear their own unique version (plus one offs like South East's red Demelza House 15443) I think you're right with Dogs Dinner!
I thought avoiding/eliminating all these livery variations and local adaptations of the corporate image were one of the key "outcomes" of the rebranding...!
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Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
To be fair, the Lakes liveries aren't a variant of beachball, they may contain some elements of it but are really entirely separate brands, and abandoning them would be utter madness as they are very strong brands.
The X5 livery is similarly not really Beachball - if they paint those school-bus yellow they are stupid.
(All three of these contain the sweep-up at the back, I suppose, but then so does the new livery)
The X5 livery is similarly not really Beachball - if they paint those school-bus yellow they are stupid.
(All three of these contain the sweep-up at the back, I suppose, but then so does the new livery)
The same could be said of the Winchester King's City brand which seems to be being swept away. For a rebranding that aimed for simplicity and consistency it looks already to be getting complicated and inconsistent.
I'm not saying beachball didn't need replacing, just that Stagecoach seem to be refining their identity on the hoof, rather than launching with a finalised thought through scheme.
On retrospect, seeing the magic bus variant feels like that's shown the way they *should* have gone - have a consistent rear and sides application and use their different colours on the front where needed. I wouldn't bother distinguishing between bus and coach services though as I don't think passengers do so probably use orange for normal service vehicles, blue for magic bus and that odd green on specialist routes.
Edit I think they shot themselves in the foot with the shade of orange, its different enough to the irn bru interior orange to look out of place, but not different enough to be worth it, looks washed out to start with too, can't imagine it will wear any better - I'd darken it a few shades for the above reasons.
It still looks like a washing powder brand though, I keep thinking that when I see it. Stagecoach: gets the dirt out even at 30 degrees...
Edit I think they shot themselves in the foot with the shade of orange, its different enough to the irn bru interior orange to look out of place, but not different enough to be worth it, looks washed out to start with too, can't imagine it will wear any better - I'd darken it a few shades for the above reasons.
It still looks like a washing powder brand though, I keep thinking that when I see it. Stagecoach: gets the dirt out even at 30 degrees...
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RomeoCharlie71
Established Member
I think what may have been a better approach for coaches is to have each group of services their own brand/livery, similar to Falcon and the Buchan Xpress. Yes it'd be more costly to repaint when coaches transferred between OpCos, but would develop some sort of identity and a brand.
LOL The Irony
Established Member
Agreed.
Tetchytyke
Veteran Member
There's a photo on Twitter by "Joshua Vaughan" of two Manchester E400MMCs in the new livery.
Not even close to being identical. How slapdash have Stagecoach become? It's like the managers of Busways- always the laziest of Stagecoach divisions- are running the whole show!
Not even close to being identical. How slapdash have Stagecoach become? It's like the managers of Busways- always the laziest of Stagecoach divisions- are running the whole show!
TheGrandWazoo
Veteran Member
Don't know if Busways are the laziest... They're just competent, neither exceptionally good nor exceptionally bad.
RomeoCharlie71
Established Member
The one on the right was the first one done (11259), the application guidelines have been altered since then.
cnjb8
Established Member
And that bus is only months older than the other!
RomeoCharlie71
Established Member
If you read my post, you'll actually see that the one on the right, 11259, was the first one completed, and the livery application guidelines have changed since then.
GusB
Established Member
Variations in Stagecoach livery application are nothing new, though. Have a look through any photo site for vehicles in Stripey days and you'll see differences, even across the same vehicle type. Thin stripes, wide stripes. Black window surrounds, or white window surrounds. Perhaps it should be easier to have a more consistent approach these days when it's easier to share information. I don't think you'll ever get such a large fleet to be 100% compliant!
Tetchytyke
Veteran Member
Over time things change, and different paintshops do slightly different things. Of course. But you'd expect a brand new brand to have very strict brand guidelines and be careful in their application. Especially when it's two buses of the same model from the same depot.
That makes more sense, but still think it looks rather slapdash and muddled. What happened to trial liveries being kept behind closed doors until the final version is agreed?
I am biased because I think the new branding is rubbish, though.
RomeoCharlie71
Established Member
Incorrect, the one on the left was painted at ADL Falkirk whereas the other was painted in-house at Stagecoach.
cnjb8
Established Member
Ok, but what I said still stands!
tbtc
Veteran Member
Agreed.
I could understand standards slipping and more "experimentation" a long time into a livery (as some local depots start to differ) but any professional looking organisation should be sending clear instructions to all depots (and sub-contractors, including ADL) to ensure that there's a consistent approach.
I know this might look like enthusiasts over-reacting to minor things that ordinary members of the public wouldn't notice, but this is more than debating whether a stripe is a centimetre wider than it ought to be - this is basic stuff like whether the light surrounds are blacked out or painted around - even something as simple as what colour the front of the bus ought to be (which is the first thing that passengers at a stop will see, the "first impression") - they are off to a terrible start - which is surprising as they were introducing a new livery to suit their own timetable (e.g. this wasn't a case of being rushed into it at short notice due to a merger or sell-off - Stagecoach should have planned for these simple instructions long before they started painting vehicles). Sloppy.
But, aside from enthusiasts, how many people actually notice the slight variations in livery application? And similarly, your average customer on the street in Inverness has no idea what the livery in Exeter looks like.
Even with all the variation, most people will be able to identify the livery as Stagecoach, so what does it really matter?
Even with all the variation, most people will be able to identify the livery as Stagecoach, so what does it really matter?
Tetchytyke
Veteran Member
However the photo from Twitter showed two buses of the same model next to each other on the same street in Manchester, which is what showed it up.
In the grand scheme of things little doesn't matter a huge amount. But when you've literally just spent a fortune on a new brand, it seems a little lackadaisical to not have consistent branding guidelines.
tbtc
Veteran Member
When you've got identical buses at the same depot in non-identical liveries (where a five year old could spot the difference) it suggests a lack of professionalism when it comes to an expensive new livery.
I accept that a bus livery is going to be hard to apply across a variety of vehicles (single/double deckers, different lengths of vehicle, different space on the bodywork to suit the intricacies of a livery - e.g. the forward "blue" section of the beachball livery was often ignored on recent vehicles because there wasn't space for it), but something as simple as identical vehicles at the same garage suggests a lack of standards.
Fair enough, there are some who grew up with the "a bus is a bus - passengers should just be grateful that it's turned up without worrying about the fact that the destination is a postcard in the front window or it's branded for another route" mentality, but marketing matters - why spend all that money on a new scheme when you're going to take a half hearted approach (or changing your mind over what colour the front of the bus should be once you've started painting a few into the new scheme).
So far, the main justification on here for a new livery is "it's hard to get a red paint that doesn't fade" (which must come as a surprise to operators in London etc). Everything else feels like an "unforced error" (to borrow a sporting term) - including painting a bus into the "green" version and then painting it into the "standard" version shortly afterwards.
I accept that a bus livery is going to be hard to apply across a variety of vehicles (single/double deckers, different lengths of vehicle, different space on the bodywork to suit the intricacies of a livery - e.g. the forward "blue" section of the beachball livery was often ignored on recent vehicles because there wasn't space for it), but something as simple as identical vehicles at the same garage suggests a lack of standards.
Fair enough, there are some who grew up with the "a bus is a bus - passengers should just be grateful that it's turned up without worrying about the fact that the destination is a postcard in the front window or it's branded for another route" mentality, but marketing matters - why spend all that money on a new scheme when you're going to take a half hearted approach (or changing your mind over what colour the front of the bus should be once you've started painting a few into the new scheme).
So far, the main justification on here for a new livery is "it's hard to get a red paint that doesn't fade" (which must come as a surprise to operators in London etc). Everything else feels like an "unforced error" (to borrow a sporting term) - including painting a bus into the "green" version and then painting it into the "standard" version shortly afterwards.
Flinn Reed
Member
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- 8 Dec 2017
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- 218
The likely reason for this inconsistency is that the newer of these two E400s was painted into the new livery when built at ADL, while the other was later repainted from the beachball livery.
I think these differences will continue, with the variations shown where older vehicles are repainted into new liveries. For example, the E200MMCs that have so far been repainted have the black details around windows and lights removed, which is unlikely to be the case when Stagecoach next order some new E200MMCs.
cnjb8
Established Member
Stagecoach Manchester 12190 MX62GHB parked at the back of Sharston Depot 03/07/2020
Explore Troy1928's 98 photos on Flickr!
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LOL The Irony
Established Member
Well we haven't seen the back of them yet, so thanks for sharing.Apologies if already mentioned, but this is the branding the E40Hs have for MagicBus dutiesStagecoach Manchester 12190 MX62GHB parked at the back of Sharston Depot 03/07/2020
Explore Troy1928's 98 photos on Flickr!
EDIT: Oh dear lord, I just saw the back, and, uhhhh...
Kent Dreamer
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Have Stagecoach decided in what style they want to paint the front of the buses yet? Some have the light clusters and panel in between lights all blue, others have black light clusters and the middle panel blue and other still have black light clusters and the middle panel white.
Is each region just doing their own thing?
Is each region just doing their own thing?
py_megapixel
Established Member
Wasn't that spec changed shortly after entering service?
The earliest vehicles had orange front bumpers, but they dropped that pretty quickly.
CBlue
Member
Spec was changed, indeed.
Minor variation between depots and divisions in how the previous livery was applied means this is NOTHING new - and who is really going to notice apart from a few nitpickers or rivet counters?
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