Stagecoach Group (Group-wide matters)

[overthewater]

What are peoples view on Stagecoach; particular this year? What made me start to take real notice was TheGrandwazoo comments in Cambridge busway thread yesterday afternoon:

" is that Stagecoach has really lost its mojo with the Busway, and dare I say it, with Stagecoach East as a whole,"

Has the German owners really tightening the purse stings to get claw money back? Ive heard alot more people grumbling about the company and the Germans overall. Scotland seems to have gotten away without the worse since we have seen a good amount of investment in new stock partly down to Government schemes. If you look at the networks across all three compaines north of the border there nothing to shout home about. It's not just Stagecoach East that last it's Mojo, I think many parts of the empire has lost its mojo overall, Scotland Deffo has.

Stagecoach Lanc and Cumbria seems to doing better than other areas?


I don't think we have reach the levels of the dark days of first in the early to mid 00s or Arriva during DB, but Stagecoach Needs a good kick start.

 

[Markdvdman]

I noticed at least in Merthyr Tydfil how old the buses Stagecoach are using are! It is a travesty, plus the fares are too high and the train is cheaper. Once upon a time buses were ALWAYS cheaper than the train!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I noticed at least in Merthyr Tydfil how old the buses Stagecoach are using are! It is a travesty, plus the fares are too high and the train is cheaper. Once upon a time buses were ALWAYS cheaper than the train!

In fairness, the train will be cheaper because they're getting a substantial level of revenue funding support.

As regards the age profile of the Stagecoach fleet...

• I mentioned on another thread that there are depots/opcos that are really looking down at heel with ageing fleets. Part of that is polarisation of new vehicles (as they're investing in new EVs and that means investment is concentrated at certain depots) but also they don't appear to be as "on top" of fleet renewal as they were, especially given the paucity of deliveries during the Covid years 2020-2022; whether that is a consequence of DWS ownership, I don't know
• Specifically with Stagecoach Wales, the fleet is now looking quite old. They did get a nice set of Solos but other than that, the last major new deliveries were 2016/7 with the gold e200mmcs. However, this is in common with the other large operators in that unless you got a lump of money for EVs, the lack of money from Welsh Government and Local Authorities has stopped operators investing.
  • I think Arriva had 12 Evoras for Bangor but nothing other than that since 2017*
  • First had a dozen Streetlites which I think were diverted from West Yorkshire to Cymru but nothing else for years*
  • * excludes TrawsCymru fleet
  • Even Harris Coaches who had a few e200mmcs arrive are now reliant on the secondhand market again

Add the issue of franchising coming and it's not a surprise many aren't investing in fleet.

 

[Resuwen]

All major operators are in a holding pattern ahead of franchising.

 

[47550]

I’m not surprised there is little investment in Wales and Cambridge as both are due to be franchised in the next few years. It was a similar situation in Manchester in the run up to franchising.

 

[Great_Western]

In fairness, the train will be cheaper because they're getting a substantial level of revenue funding support.

As regards the age profile of the Stagecoach fleet...

• I mentioned on another thread that there are depots/opcos that are really looking down at heel with ageing fleets. Part of that is polarisation of new vehicles (as they're investing in new EVs and that means investment is concentrated at certain depots) but also they don't appear to be as "on top" of fleet renewal as they were, especially given the paucity of deliveries during the Covid years 2020-2022; whether that is a consequence of DWS ownership, I don't know
• Specifically with Stagecoach Wales, the fleet is now looking quite old. They did get a nice set of Solos but other than that, the last major new deliveries were 2016/7 with the gold e200mmcs. However, this is in common with the other large operators in that unless you got a lump of money for EVs, the lack of money from Welsh Government and Local Authorities has stopped operators investing.
  • I think Arriva had 12 Evoras for Bangor but nothing other than that since 2017*
  • First had a dozen Streetlites which I think were diverted from West Yorkshire to Cymru but nothing else for years*
  • * excludes TrawsCymru fleet
  • Even Harris Coaches who had a few e200mmcs arrive are now reliant on the secondhand market again

Add the issue of franchising coming and it's not a surprise many aren't investing in fleet.

Dare I say that I don't think the Wales fleet is actually that bad?

Aside from one or two ropey Scania E300's I've noticed on the X24, the fleet is in pretty good condition.

The older Solo's that are left are fine, and repaints are progressing quite quickly. The E200's are also progressively now getting an interior retrim.

And from an operational perspective, at least on the Newport - Cwmbran - Pontypool corridor, the timetable has plenty of early and late services, and is probably overall the best it has ever been. (Although axing the Cwmbran - Newport section of the 23 on Sundays is a bit irritating and I would love to see a Sunday service resume on the X3)

Ive noticed also that they're also doing a decent job reliability wise too.

 

[Snow1964]

I’m not surprised there is little investment in Wales and Cambridge as both are due to be franchised in the next few years. It was a similar situation in Manchester in the run up to franchising.

Yes the long lead time of regional franchising means have opportunity to move fleets around the country.

No sane organisation gives away its best assets, when it can fix what is passed on.

 

[Markdvdman]

The only issue with the franchising is it will drag on as it always does and commuters will suffer the longer it goes on. In Wales at least it is allegedly South West Wales first next year. However, where a lot of the old fleet suffer is in lack of provision for USB sockets. However, you are right that no sane operator would invest in new buses with the franchising pending!

 

[DesDobramento]

Trade website busandcoachbuyer.com recently reported that Stagecoach CEO Claire Miles has left the business.

 

[duncombec]

Trade website busandcoachbuyer.com recently reported that Stagecoach CEO Claire Miles has left the business.

CEO leaves Stagecoach for FA board - Bus & Coach Buyer

Stagecoach CEO, Claire Miles, has left the company and is joining the board of the Football Association (FA). Claire joined Stagecoach as CEO in October 2023, following a career in financial services, energy and digital sectors. Sam Greer has been appointed CEO following Claire’s departure. Sam...

www.busandcoachbuyer.com

Stagecoach CEO, Claire Miles, has left the company and is joining the board of the Football Association (FA).

Claire joined Stagecoach as CEO in October 2023, following a career in financial services, energy and digital sectors.

Sam Greer has been appointed CEO following Claire’s departure.

Sam was appointed Chief Operating Officer at Stagecoach Group on 1 September 2023. Before that, he was Engineering Director and Regional Director for Scotland. He has worked at Stagecoach since 1992.

A Stagecoach spokesperson said: “Sam has been with the business for 34 years and brings extensive operational and leadership experience, with a deep understanding of our people, our customers, and the communities we serve.

“Claire Miles has stepped down as CEO and we thank her for her leadership and the significant contribution she has made to Stagecoach, and we wish her every success for the future.”

Stagecoach says its strategy remains unchanged despite the management change.

The statement continues: “Under Sam’s leadership, we will continue to focus on delivering safe, reliable and sustainable bus travel, while investing in our people, modernising our operations and creating long-term value for the communities we serve.”

Claire is to take her new role as an Independent Non-Executive Director at the FA in November.

On starting her new role, Claire said: “I am delighted to be joining the FA Board and very excited by the opportunity to work alongside such a talented and dedicated team. Having grown up in the North East, football has always been a significant part of my life. Through my teenage sons, who play and referee at grassroots level, I have seen first-hand the positive impact that the game can have on individuals and communities. I look forward to playing my part in supporting English football and helping to ensure it continues to evolve, grow and thrive in the future.”

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I’m not surprised there is little investment in Wales and Cambridge as both are due to be franchised in the next few years. It was a similar situation in Manchester in the run up to franchising.

I would say yes and no - it certainly complicates issues.

However, I was in Peterborough in July 2022 and was making the same observations about the operations then, well ahead of any discussions on franchising:

Peterborough's buses used to be corporate but with energy and pride. Just don't see that now. Whilst the country services were perhaps less lucrative, you really did feel they made the effort. Not so certain now. It's all a bit tired, and that is especially so when measured against First's Excel or the Delaine operations. With some TLC, they could re-energise some of the routes; the cross city 1 has the potential to be improved with better bus shelters and decent marketing. I don't know what's happened but it's sadly a bit tired there now - from a trip report posted 28 Jul 2022

I really do think that Stagecoach East has lost its mojo. I remember an earlier trip (probably 2015/6) and it was a decent operation extending across the Fens from its two main powerbases in Cambridge and Peterborough. Now whether Covid was a coincidence or a cause, I don't know but it has retrenched markedly in that time. Aside from the 30 new EVs (that work the Cambridge P&Rs as @Magdalia mentioned), fleet replacement has been poor for some time with only some quite new (in fairness) e400mmcs cascaded from Manchester.

As regards Wales, it is all about Welsh Government. The position of WG and Covid support meant all operators had a tough time and that has set them up for franchising... in some respects, it might be a blessed relief though they won't be happy about potentially losing their businesses.

Dare I say that I don't think the Wales fleet is actually that bad?

I think I said that the Welsh fleet was ageing, and that Stagecoach as a whole was looking a bit down at heel.

I remember travelling on a Stagecoach Solo a few years back (again 2022?) and being impressed how smart it was despite its years. They do try to keep a decent fleet but you can't help but notice that the age profile has really crept up. The new Solos were welcome but you do have trunk routes like the X24 now with ten year old vehicles and they are starting to show their age.

Trade website busandcoachbuyer.com recently reported that Stagecoach CEO Claire Miles has left the business.

Replaced by Sam Greer - a Stagecoach lifer. Perhaps a return to some of the Souter era practices?

 

[riceuten]

Stagecoach corporately spent way too much time, legal fees and effort trying to stop the Greater Manchester franchising system. And the Peterborough & Cambridgeshire Mayor is now trying to wriggle out of the commitments of the previous Regional Mayor and cripple the system before it even begins.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Stagecoach corporately spent way too much time, legal fees and effort trying to stop the Greater Manchester franchising system.

I'm sure it was a drop in the ocean for them and they probably thought it worthwhile as a test case. Remember that they accepted the first verdict... it was Rotala that kept on going and for them, it was proportionately more of an issue (in so many ways).

And the Peterborough & Cambridgeshire Mayor is now trying to wriggle out of the commitments of the previous Regional Mayor and cripple the system before it even begins.

Perhaps the current mayor was right to have a review given that it's a relatively small population <1m and outside the two cities, is very sparsely populated and challenging to serve unlike the other heavily urbanised franchise areas.

 

[overthewater]

Could they not look at doing a bus partnership or spending the money on other things, Stagecoach agrees to put some new fleet in while the council puts in better bus lanes and pays for some enhancements?

 

[riceuten]

Could they not look at doing a bus partnership or spending the money on other things, Stagecoach agrees to put some new fleet in while the council puts in better bus lanes and pays for some enhancements?

I've yet to encounter a bus partnership that's actually delivered.

The CPCA Mayor does indeed want to spend money on "other things" - roads, mainly.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I've yet to encounter a bus partnership that's actually delivered.

Leicester? Portsmouth?

 

[Nammer]

Portsmouth certainly has delivered. The Stagecoach buses here are always clean and tidy. Reliability is good. The council (LibDem) is very pro-active 'bus friendly'

 

[Bornin1980s]

I have been wondering, what is current Stagecoach policy regarding new vehicles? At one time, they were loyal to Alexander/ADL, but they seem to have favoured imports lately, their ScotZEB3 order being all Yutong. Is their relationship with ADL over?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I have been wondering, what is current Stagecoach policy regarding new vehicles? At one time, they were loyal to Alexander/ADL, but they seem to have favoured imports lately, their ScotZEB3 order being all Yutong. Is their relationship with ADL over?

They are selecting ADLs for certain opcos (East Mids, Mids, South West) with e100evs and e400evs and they're in the process of delivery.

Thing is Yutongs are both cheaper and, up to now, better built.

 

[Steve440]

I have been wondering, what is current Stagecoach policy regarding new vehicles? At one time, they were loyal to Alexander/ADL, but they seem to have favoured imports lately, their ScotZEB3 order being all Yutong. Is their relationship with ADL over?

They were loyal to ADL because of the Brian Souter connection.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

They were loyal to ADL because of the Brian Souter connection.

That and that they had a large and standardised fleet anyway.

 

[Bornin1980s]

They were loyal to ADL because of the Brian Souter connection.

Not originally. Brian Souter bought ADL because of Stagecoach's Alexander fleet, so it was the other way round!