At least this should provide the connection between Sydenham corridor and East Croydon with a single sensible change. (Thameslink book to leave Norwood Junction 1 min before the LO West Croydon...)
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Southern May 2022 timetable change
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Southern Dvr
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Problem will be that these won’t be a same platform connection and there’s no lift at Norwood.
They will also be stopping because the former Victoria to Caterham / Tattenham Corner peak service is long gone.
On Sundays the Tattenham Corner service is reduced to an hourly shuttle to/from Purley, connecting with the Caterham service which is fast between Norwood Junction and London Bridge (currently it stops everywhere).
It wouldn't really be that inappropriate to run the Tattenham Corner branch as a shuttle from Purley throughout the week.
Presumably it makes rostering easier and avoids the need to have staff at Purley to do the coupling / uncoupling process.
TT-ONR-NRN
Veteran Member
Indeed, this was the former proceedure with 456s I believe.
There was a period when there was an extra hourly shuttle but Tattenham Corner still had through services at that time. I dont think there has been a time when the branch was purely a shuttle. However, since then Legal & General moved out of Kingswood so not really sure what the non-residential demand is on the line (other than for one weekend at the start of June).
That shuttle went before 2015 - there are some posts about it here - https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...-5th-january-2015.110286/page-48#post-2445484 and here https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/purley-to-tattenham-corner-shuttles.89535/
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TT-ONR-NRN
Veteran Member
Ah it looks like it was used in place of the Coulsdon Town services after they were scrapped in 2008, and then they ditched the shuttle after they came back - of course they are about to be withdrawn again in September.
OliverH68
Member
Okay, I'm happy with both of these to compensate for the loss of the 2J stoppers. So does that now mean the 1Ps from Caterham - London Bridge are fast every day now, including Sundays?
The branch was a shuttle service during the Covid TT in the week for quite some time. It's also a shuttle service on Sundays mainly when there's engineering work affecting services via Tulse Hill & Sydenham.
Looks like there will be between the Caterham / Tattenham Corner services which will use platform 1 on the way up and 5 on the way down.
Callum J
Member
Those stations are probably close enough to Norwood Junction that if you need London Bridge you just head there and change for the fast services from NWD. Though it's a bigger headache for East Croydon access from the 'via Forest Hill' line for sure. It's a shame there isn't maybe a stopping Thameslink from East Croydon up that way.
In both cases, passengers would just take the London Overground service and change at Norwood Junction / New Cross Gate as appropriate. Anerley and Penge West both retain a 4tph service provided by London Overground.
Nicholas Lewis
Established Member
be more useful if they called at New X Gate to provide connection to ELL. NR spent a fortune putting in an access for all footbridge to the island platform and nothing uses them now.
Looks like, even with a xx10 / xx40 departure from London Bridge instead of the current xx17 / xx47, it doesn't give time to stop at both New Cross Gate and Norwood Junction. If they could remove the xx07 Uckfield trains and send the Caterham / Tattenham Corner trains out then it might be different but the Cambridge to Brighton looks to be too close behind.
However, it doesn't work in the up direction either with the Brighton to Cambridge and then the Gatwick to Bedford right behind.
Shame.
The NXG connection is only justified if the London Bridge - Victoria wasn’t used. Also as previously mentioned by another user, those services would cause knock on effects to services that don’t stop there.
Also if you live near NXG then you might as well use New Cross station a few minutes away and more connections.
Nicholas Lewis
Established Member
My wider issue is connectivity in public transport is key to drive up journeys and a location like New X Gate help facilitate easier journey opportunities in this case between East London and the South of England. Yes you could swap at Norwood Jcn but thats now two changes and more time. I understand it won't work with todays timetables but i do hope that GBR will establish principles for timetable design in the future to make journey opportunities easier.
ert47
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The up trains on 1 only appears to be in the off peak periods. In the morning it’s all on 3 and between 1700-2030 in the evening. But tbh, the 2T in the old non-Covid timetable didn’t really run at them times through ECR and started at Norwood
The Forest Hill services are well used to and from East Croydon - in fact since the downgrading of Southern services on this corridor they are arguably busier into Croydon than into London Bridge where the better reliability and frequency of the Overground has taken away many of the customers. A lot of school/study journeys will be disrupted as well as journeys to Gatwick and Brighton, and as others have said Norwood Junction is not an easy station to interchange with its narrow subways and no step free
Minstral25
Established Member
Additionally from RTT it looks like Reigate’s are booked into main concourse at Victoria - platforms 11/12 mostly except early Morning Peak and late arrivals where they remain in 15-19 as before. Also leave 1 minute earlier.
I think there's step-free at West Croydon for anyone wishing to get to East Croydon, although it's not as easy since LO swapped with Southern by using Platform 1 where there's a side gate to exit the station.
If ever the timetables revert to a resemblance of a normal service, I hope the East Croydon stoppers remain in the peaks as they've proved to be well used.
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