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Southeastern... suspicious letter...

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Szazomy

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Exactly what I thought all along. I expect somebody has been masquerading as the OP, and it's very possibly somebody known to the OP.


I thought about this as a possibility but came up with nothing. Presumably anyone that did this would have to have been male, as I have a distinctly male name. Hardly any of my friends know my full address even if they happen to know whereabouts I live, let alone the likes of my postcode. The few friends that might do are all at University right now, and I would never imagine them as the type to do such a thing anyway. Unless I accidentally misplaced a document of some kind with my details on it that a stranger came across (and as far as I'm aware, all I was carrying was a bag of clothes), it's a complete mystery to me.

I've heard suggestions it could have been someone who works for the rail company, that may have gotten my address through my Railcard somehow, though I'm not sure how much that sounds like fabricated conspiracy.

I want to keep thanking the people on here though... it's been the most consistent and reliable place for me to consider the situation. TfL, Southeastern and the BTP were less than helpful in my opinion. :)
 
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maniacmartin

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My bet's on this being a prank letter from a friend. As barrykas states, the company name doesn't match (should be London & South Eastern Railway Limited)
 

SussexMan

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A little late to the party I know, but I'm sure nobody will be even remotely surprised to know that Companies House has no record of a "Southeastern Railway Limited"...

The full name of the company is London and Southeastern Railway Limited and is registered at Companies House under Company No. 04860660.

Szazomy. Did the letter have the registered address of the company on somewhere (usually in quite small print at the bottom)?

LONDON & SOUTH EASTERN RAILWAY LIMITED
3RD FLOOR
41-51 GREY STREET
NEWCASTLE UPON TYNE
TYNE & WEAR
NE1 6EE
Company No. 04860660
 

Szazomy

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The full name of the company is London and Southeastern Railway Limited and is registered at Companies House under Company No. 04860660.

Szazomy. Did the letter have the registered address of the company on somewhere (usually in quite small print at the bottom)?

LONDON & SOUTH EASTERN RAILWAY LIMITED
3RD FLOOR
41-51 GREY STREET
NEWCASTLE UPON TYNE
TYNE & WEAR
NE1 6EE
Company No. 04860660
Indeed it did :)
 

34D

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So Southeastern has confirmed to you that 84 Tooley Street is their office address for this type of work. In which case I am struggling to see how it can be any scam - Nigerian or otherwise. It still leaves the question of who gave them your details.

But didn't another poster say that this office had been vacated?

Did the OP call southern using the number on this letter, or by a number found on their website?
 

richw

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But didn't another poster say that this office had been vacated?

Did the OP call southern using the number on this letter, or by a number found on their website?

Network Rail have a planning application to demolish the premises at Tooley Road as part of the London Bridge redevelopments. One would hope the office is vacated first.
 

Szazomy

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For clarification, the number I rang Southeastern with was supplied to me by the BTP. In turn, it was Southeastern who asked me to write a letter to the Tooley Street address :)
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Okay, I haven't heard back from either my letter or email and it's been over 10 days now. Phoning up doesn't help, as everyone seems clueless and just keeps referring me back and forth. Does anyone have an appropriate email address or actual address I could use for the Tonbridge offices? I'm going to write to them now and make sure they listen to my situation - completely wrong that my personal details could potentially be at risk and they haven't managed to respond. :(

On a more positive note, I've found a receipt for my oyster card payment that I made on the day this "incident" occurred. Along with the Journey History on its way from TfL, I have undeniable proof that I was not involved in any of this, which is reassuring. :)
 
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richw

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On a more positive note, I've found a receipt for my oyster card payment that I made on the day this "incident" occurred. Along with the Journey History on its way from TfL, I have undeniable proof that I was not involved in any of this, which is reassuring. :)


Have TfL confirmed your journies show on that day correctly?
 

Szazomy

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Have TfL confirmed your journies show on that day correctly?

Not quite yet, though the journey history should be through within a couple of days and hopefully put me in the clear. If not for some peculiar reason, then I still have the receipt of the Oyster card top up that I did about thirty seconds before I began that journey from Liverpool Street to Bromley South. :) I also have a stamped train ticket and receipt proving I travelled from Colchester just before this, just to paint a clear picture of my actions to them. I don't think they can find problem with that :)
 

sarahj

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The Newcastle address is the head office for Go-Ahead, thats where our (southerns) head office is as well. TBH I dont think sending any letters there would do much good.
 

theageofthetra

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Have you still got the envelope the letter came in? What postage was on it? A large company would use a franking machine supplied the the post office. If it has the franking clearly visible what does it say? You could also take it to a large post or sorting office and advise them of a posible fraud and they should be able to tell you where the frank was issued to. If it has a normal stuck on stamp it would be highly suspicious.
 

snail

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If you read the OP it says the envelope was prepaid 2nd class. Quite common for business use, no franking required.
 

Szazomy

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After two weeks, Southeastern have finally responded to me, via the email I sent them, rather than the letter they requested that I write.

They have requested that I send the prosecution letter back to the Tooley Street address, leaving a note on the back stating that the incident in question has nothing to do with me. They'll then respond to me accordingly.
I'll keep the receipt for my oyster transaction for the day that I travelled, as well as the journey history I have requested, and will point out I am in possession of these proof items :)
In my haste to respond to the letter I had already filled in the details they requested of me, but given they have now confirmed the Tooley Street address themselves I don't see a problem in giving them these.

Hopefully this will rectify the issue altogether. :)
 

snail

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I'll keep the receipt for my oyster transaction for the day that I travelled, as well as the journey history I have requested, and will point out I am in possession of these proof items :)
No harm in sending them copies and advising you have the originals.
 

Szazomy

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Yes, it was the one that was on the letter supplied...No.84 I believe :)

I'll be sending the letter tomorrow...I've had to prepare for a last minute job interview today, and just haven't had the time ;)
 

swj99

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It still leaves the question of who gave them your details.

Unless I accidentally misplaced a document of some kind with my details on it that a stranger came across (and as far as I'm aware, all I was carrying was a bag of clothes), it's a complete mystery to me.

Could be anyone these days. Identity thieves obtain personal information from a variety of different sources, for many different reasons. There’s pickpocketing, stealing personal correspondence from post office vehicles, out of mailbags etc, thrown away junk mail from recycling bins, plus a lot of other possibilities. Who can say where they might have got your name and address from ? In this so called ‘information age’ there are those who say there is nothing more insecure known to mankind than a computer. The possibilities are almost endless. There are probably lots of people in different places who have or who have had access to a record of your name and address, and all it would take is for one such person to keep a note of it for future dishonest purposes.

It reminds me of the proprietor of a garage a few years ago, who kept written records of the names of all his customers who paid over the telephone for work done on their cars, together with the details of the debit or credit cards used for the transactions. Then, just before he disappeared owing many people money, he did multiple “cardholder not present transactions” using these card details, with all the money from this going into his business bank account. By the time the customers realized and reported this to their banks and card issuers, the guy had emptied the account and done a runner. As far as I know, no-one's caught up with him yet either, although I’m sure several people including the police and some of his ex employees who are owed wages, are still looking. Now that's just one devious person that I know about. There are probably thousands of people like him all around the country, blagging the system in different ways for their own ends.
This con merchant conned the banks and credit card companies, not the actual customers, although obviously it doesn't seem like that at the time when things like this happen.

Whoever gave your name to Southeastern has effectively conned them, not you, it's just a shame that it always seems to be the honest law abiding people who end up having to spend time sorting out the mess afterwards.

For you to be convicted in court of whatever it could be that they 'may' suspect you of, the person who alleges they spoke to you at the time would have to be able to positively identify you in court under oath, as the person who was spoken to, which they obviously cannot truthfully do because you were never spoken to. If Southeastern wanted to pursue the matter, it would be for them to identify the actual person who gave your details, and prosecute them, if they can be found.
 

jon0844

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It's true that there are loads of possibilities, and if an RPI only asks for a name and address and not your DOB then it's probably dead simple to get those details. I am sure you could get a lot names and addresses from a phonebook or some Google searching.
 

island

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DOBs are difficult to verify anyhow.

Did Southeastern comment on the poor quality of the letter at all?
 

richw

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It's true that there are loads of possibilities, and if an RPI only asks for a name and address and not your DOB then it's probably dead simple to get those details. I am sure you could get a lot names and addresses from a phonebook or some Google searching.

not forgetting the electoral register is a publically available document.
 

Mojo

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The agency that verifies names and addresses for my company has access to the full, unedited, electoral register as well as referencing data from a credit-referencing agency. I don't know what data from these contains, however, but have been told that it is much more accurate now than when they just used to use electoral data.
 

OwlMan

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Although a lot of people have access to the non-public version, I think you'd be surprised how easy it is to access!
As easily as visiting the Coucil Offices :). The full register is available for public inspection.
 

SussexMan

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As easily as visiting the Coucil Offices :). The full register is available for public inspection.

My council says I can only view my own entry in the full register. Have you anything to suggest I have a right to see all entries in the full register?

There are two versions of the Electoral Register. The edited register can be viewed for any purpose; the full register can only be viewed for electoral purposes, e.g. to check your own registration details to see if they are correct.
 

DaveNewcastle

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The Representaion of The People Act 1951 refers (Amended E & W 2002).

Members and Officers of a Local Authority will have access to the register of entries for purposes in the course of their duties, and external agencies (incl. Credit Agencies) may buy rights of access for their own purposes.
A citizen also has the right to examine their own entry.
Copies are released to the British Library, the National Library of Wales, the National Library of Scotland and several other governmental agencies, to the Police, Security Services, political parties, acting representatives and prospective candidates for local or national government.

The 2001 Regulations define prohibitions on the disclosure of that data:-

The Full register - "The full electoral register is a public document and it can be made available to any member of the public who wishes to consult it. However this has to be done in person and under supervision at the local electoral services office. It is not possible to make copies of part or all of the register although hand written notes can be made.",
and
The Edited register - "There are no restrictions on access to the edited register. No supervision is required and so it may be made available for public inspection at any place the Electoral Registration Officer sees fit."

In respect of copies sold to external agencies:
"Sale of the edited version of the register

There are no restrictions on the sale of the edited version of the register or on the uses that can be made of it. The Electoral Registration Officer must supply a copy of it to any person on payment of a fee.
"

See Representation of the People (England and Wales) Regulations 2001.

Some services exploit the older arrangements, such as 192.com : "Since the introduction of the edited version of the register in 2002 it has been possible for electors to tick a box on the annual canvass form to ‘opt out’ of appearing in the version of the register which is available for sale without restriction to commercial concerns. In theory it is therefore possible for an individual to prevent the sale of their personal details to companies who purchase the edited version of the electoral register. However, websites such as 192.com and B4Usearch.com have been able to circumvent this by using old electoral registers to build their databases because these registers were compiled before the law was changed. Much of the information in the old registers compiled before 2002 is of course still current.

The companies are not acting illegally by providing this information but they are exploiting a loophole in the regulations
"

Quotations from 'Supply and sale of the electoral register' in the House of Commons Library, 2008, by Isobel White.
 
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Mojo

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My council says I can only view my own entry in the full register. Have you anything to suggest I have a right to see all entries in the full register?
I am not 100% certain, but I believe you have the right to inspect the register under Section 43 of The Representation of the People (England and Wales) Regulations 2001. In areas with two-tier local government (i.e. District councils and County councils) you go to the District council.

I have been to the District council offices to examine the full electoral register as I was trying to track down the home address of a Chair of school governors.

I just turned up at the offices on spec as I was passing by, so I am not sure if you are supposed to book (it might be wise out of courtesy for the staff) and told the receptionist who offered us a seat in their foyer. 5 Min later a lady came down with two huge folders and informed me of the rules for public examining the register (written notes only, no copying of huge sections, no photos, etc.)

I was not asked for a reason why we were inspecting the register, but on informing the friendly lady that I might take some time (the register is sorted by Ward, and then by street, so I had to go through each street), she invited me up into her office and we got talking about what I was looking for.
 

Szazomy

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Just a quick update, I've currently received no response at all from Southeastern, having returned the letter to them as requested. I don't know whether that's because it is a lengthy process to deal with, or whether I can deal with this as a closed matter. They haven't been very helpful, considering this all concerns my personal information.

TfL have also been unhelpful, and have failed to deliver me an Oyster Journey History (on my second attempt at getting one!) but I still have a receipt of my Oyster transactions to prove I travelled legally on the day in question.

Once again, I'd like to thank the helpful people here who generally managed to point me in the right direction in terms of a course of action :)
 

bb21

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It might take a few weeks I reckon, so be patient. I would say give them six weeks and if you don't hear from them, ring them.
 
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