Southeastern - How do you save money when buying Southeastern tickets?

[Perns1972]

From a non-expert perspective, it looks like there are fewer splits available on Southeastern than elsewhere on the network.

So, I wonder whether anyone has any tips for how to save money when travelling on Southeastern.

Let me know what you would do to save when travelling on their trains.

Thanks,

Matt

 

[telstarbox]

The opportunities are limited as there are no Advance fares, there is already lots of demand for peak and off-peak travel to London, and the franchise hardly overlaps with other operators much.

 

[island]

I believe they are starting to sell advances next year.

 

[telstarbox]

That makes sense as Southern (another Govia TOC) already sell them on their longer-distance flows e.g. London to Brighton.

 

[yorkie]

There isn't much you can do.

Its worth noting that if you are making a longer journey involving one of the 'InterCity' TOCs beyond London, a through ticket will likely be much cheaper than "splitting" in London.

For journeys wholly on Southeastern there's little scope for savings.

There may be some fares set by other operators (eg Southern, c2c) that undercut Southeastern fares, and therr may be some Routeing Guide loopholes, but Southeastern can get very annoyed if they find out about cheaper fares and try their best to both harrass customers and stop the 'loopholes'. I don't think I could recommend people take advantage of any anomaly involving southeastern unless they are up for a fight and have a lot of time on their hands to resolve a potential dispute and are fully aware of their rights and responsibilities. A certain video involving a Bromley South ticket incident springs to mind....

I even got an earful for trying to use a Sheffield to Tonbridge ticket via Lewisham (a short loop off the main line so about a quarter of a mile longer than the absolute shortest route), I was apparently meant to use Southern via Kensington Olympia.

I would advise caution when using any ticket on Southeastern other than the most straightforward of tickets as I've heard of numerous disputes.

 

[bicbasher]

If you have the time and patience, it may be worth using Southern for Hastings via Haywards Heath or to Ashford International. A Southern Daysave, plus a normal CDR from Ashford Intl to somewhere like Dover Priory or Margate may be worth saving a few pennies on.

I've found that if I want to travel to Tunbridge Wells from Forest Hill, the off-peak CDR via East Croydon and Redhill on Southern changing at Tonbridge is £1 more than travelling on Southeastern from West Dulwich changing at Orpington. In this case, it's a rare case where Southeastern is cheaper and has a more regular train service.

 

[yorkie]

If you have the time and patience, it may be worth using Southern for Hastings via Haywards Heath or to Ashford International. A Southern Daysave, plus a normal CDR from Ashford Intl to somewhere like Dover Priory or Margate may be worth saving a few pennies on..

In other words avoid using Southeastern where practicable. I agree with that, and I believe their pricing policies are designed to price people off travelling with them. Sadly there are not many alternatives but I agree that for some journeys such as London to Hastings, Southern are a viable option for those who are happy to sacrifice their time for a cash saving.

Unlike southeastern, southern do actually want to attract new customers and offer competitive deals. Its hard to believe they are owned by the same parent group as their approaches are very different.

 

[RJ]

There are plenty of loopholes within the Southeastern network which I wouldn't hesitate to use if I had any reason to travel on their trains.

I would excise caution however. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing - few Southeastern staff seem to understand how to find out what a ticket entitles the holder to do. Southeastern have plenty of time served staff who can offer an educated guess based on what sounds right in their own mind. Those who can read and understand the Conditions of Carriage and Routeing Guide, then apply the information within to establish the validity of a ticket, seem to be very thin on the ground.

This lack of knowledge is combined with what seems to be an unwritten zero tolerance policy against people finding legitimate ways of saving on through fares. Southeastern consider this to be fare evasion - they'd sooner report it to the police with a view to securing a conviction, than accept that permissible saving opportunities exist and deal with them as appropriate. There are anecdotes on how Southeastern's front line staff and management have dealt with ticketing issues elsewhere on the forum.

You've been warned

 

[Wolfie]

There are plenty of loopholes within the Southeastern network which I wouldn't hesitate to use if I had any reason to travel on their trains.

I would excise caution however. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing - few Southeastern staff seem to understand how to find out what a ticket entitles the holder to do. Southeastern have plenty of time served staff who can offer an educated guess based on what sounds right in their own mind. Those who can read and understand the Conditions of Carriage and Routeing Guide, then apply the information within to establish the validity of a ticket, seem to be very thin on the ground.

This lack of knowledge is combined with what seems to be an unwritten zero tolerance policy against people finding legitimate ways of saving on through fares. Southeastern consider this to be fare evasion - they'd sooner report it to the police with a view to securing a conviction, than accept that permissible saving opportunities exist and deal with them as appropriate. There are anecdotes on how Southeastern's front line staff and management have dealt with ticketing issues elsewhere on the forum.

You've been warned

If I ever found myself in that situation they would find I take a very similar zero-tolerance approach. An immediate approach to my MP and the most rail unfriendly media - the Daily Heil comes to mind - involvement of a bloody expensive solicitor and immediate litigation if they don't pay all of the bills plus SUBSTANTIAL compensation. Oh and staff dismissals up and to including managers too. They want to play silly games they deserve to be crucified!

Re the BTP.. if they're daft enough to support SouthEastern's games I'm sure a few referrals to the IPCC will reign them in.

I have heard rumours that Leigh Day (Google them.. suffice to say that having taken millions from HMG SouthEastern would hold no fear for them) for one are looking around the rail industry for a suitable legal test case.

I am minded to say don't tolerate little dictators who try to make their own rules...instead set out to make their lives miserable and unpleasant and ultimately, having extracted serious compensation, destroy them. I do appreciate that involves serious effort and a degree of risk however.

 

[bb21]

I do appreciate that involves serious effort and a degree of risk however.

That, while all these other things you said sounded great, is likely to be a significant barrier to a little nobody taking on a big company in all but the most crystal clear of cases, unfortunately, given the imbalance of power between the railway companies and the passenger, and we all know how those cases always end up.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

That, while all these other things you said sounded great, is likely to be a significant barrier to a little nobody taking on a big company in all but the most crystal clear of cases, unfortunately, given the imbalance of power between the railway companies and the passenger, and we all know how those cases always end up.

Yes, it seems everything is weighted towards the TOC's rather than the paying passenger (...sorry customer)

I travel on SouthEastern fairly regularly but often at short notice so I don't get time to book in advance for the longer journeys. The last time, I took the High Speed and despite paying the premium, my family and I were more than happy for a 56min journey as opposed to 1hr 44mins (or over 2 hours in some cases including waiting for connections)

Amazing really as I booked in advance to go to York a few months ago (from London) which worked out cheaper than going to see my parents travelling wholly within SouthEastern...

Guess one just has to swallow it. ..

 

[thebigcheese]

Depends where you are in Kent I guess. I lived in Maidstone and would have been able to shave £500 off an annual season to London quite easily. I now live in Gravesend and can shave £1500 off a high speed annual season should I so wish (using the same ticket combo I get 25% off the SDR) so it's just a case of having a hunt around!

I was forced to buy an excess once for my high speed ticket but since complaining I have been refunded and now have it in writing that the ticket is valid via that route.

 

[RJ]

Depends where you are in Kent I guess. I lived in Maidstone and would have been able to shave £500 off an annual season to London quite easily. I now live in Gravesend and can shave £1500 off a high speed annual season should I so wish (using the same ticket combo I get 25% off the SDR) so it's just a case of having a hunt around!

I was forced to buy an excess once for my high speed ticket but since complaining I have been refunded and now have it in writing that the ticket is valid via that route.

You can easily save over £2500 a year for travel between Gravesend and London Terminals!

If I ever found myself in that situation they would find I take a very similar zero-tolerance approach. An immediate approach to my MP and the most rail unfriendly media - the Daily Heil comes to mind - involvement of a bloody expensive solicitor and immediate litigation if they don't pay all of the bills plus SUBSTANTIAL compensation. Oh and staff dismissals up and to including managers too. They want to play silly games they deserve to be crucified!

Re the BTP.. if they're daft enough to support SouthEastern's games I'm sure a few referrals to the IPCC will reign them in.

I have heard rumours that Leigh Day (Google them.. suffice to say that having taken millions from HMG SouthEastern would hold no fear for them) for one are looking around the rail industry for a suitable legal test case.

I am minded to say don't tolerate little dictators who try to make their own rules...instead set out to make their lives miserable and unpleasant and ultimately, having extracted serious compensation, destroy them. I do appreciate that involves serious effort and a degree of risk however.

It seems that Southeastern could do with some help with improving their internal communications and better equipping their staff to deal with disputes. It'll only be a matter of time before someone else runs into problems with their staff not accepting valid tickets - and once again, they won't be prepared to deal with it in a professional manner. I'd sooner see them sort themselves out than leaving themselves open to being fudged in the way you describe.

Even I was offered a payoff by them, which I declined on the basis that they were trying to brush the problem under the carpet rather than deal with it properly.

The question asked by the OP is very broad - perhaps information can be shared by PM for specific journeys?

 

[yorkie]

The question asked by the OP is very broad - perhaps information can be shared by PM for specific journeys?

I'm pretty sure the OP only wants information that would be suitable for consumption by the general public.

Which, in the case of Southeastern, is very little!

 

[telstarbox]

Maybe the OP is a rather clumsy Southeastern spy

 

[yorkie]

Maybe the OP is a rather clumsy Southeastern spy

Having met him, I can safely say you can relax; he's on our side!