South Western Train accuses fare evasion

[jon0844]

But surely the 'dummies' take ages because some menu layouts are confusing, especially when you're after tickets that aren't the regular/common ones. The wizard would make it a no brainer, and even more regular rail users might prefer to not walk away wondering if they got the right ticket.

And the ones that have a basket to let you add more tickets, or don't offer things like groupsave either at all or until the end, are more confusing still.

Another example of stupidity in design is when you get a meal deal at Sainsbury's or M&S and use a self checkout. You scan everything and it shows the total as being the sum of the items without the discount. You're then asked to select your method of payment and only then does it work it out!

Suffice to say, people get confused and call for assistance only to be told how to fix the problem and that it's normal. No, it's bad programming and the fact that people have to seek help proves it.

 

[Eagle]

But surely the 'dummies' take ages because some menu layouts are confusing, especially when you're after tickets that aren't the regular/common ones. The wizard would make it a no brainer, and even more regular rail users might prefer to not walk away wondering if they got the right ticket.

It might take longer to select a common ticket though, which on most machines can be done in a couple of presses e.g. "London Terminals" > "Standard Off Peak Day Return" instead of Where are you going? "London Terminals" > Are you coming back? "Yes, today" > What times will you be travelling? "Off Peak" > What class? "Standard" > Do you have a railcard? "No" > Would you like a travelcard? "No" or something of the sort.

Not that it wouldn't be very useful in some cases, of course.

 

[jon0844]

It's pretty easy to buy a simple return to London Terminals or a travelcard, but for other destinations it can confuse even the seasoned traveller.

What's more, if you're away from home and wanting a ticket and don't know the options or prices (to know if you're paying the right money) then seeing a range of anytime, off peak, super off peak and other tickets with restrictions will slow even the best of us down.

I think that a lot of problems could be solved by changing the design of the user interface and the text shown. Perhaps a simple summary for each ticket type in layman's terms, or some sort of colour coding. What's more, just having one layout for all machines in the UK - not different ones from different suppliers. Make each manufacturer have to work to the exact same spec.

 

[Eagle]

What's more, just having one layout for all machines in the UK - not different ones from different suppliers. Make each manufacturer have to work to the exact same spec.

This would certainly be a good thing. If only to get rid of machines with confusing non-QWERTY keyboards...

 

[jon0844]

Can you imagine if Sky had let every box maker use its own user interface?

I am surprised that ATOC didn't make sure we had one interface (albeit with TOC colours/logos) so it would be easy to sell tickets - and produce online guides to get people more comfortable in advance of experiencing them - thus speeding up usage.

 

[Greenback]

A common interface would be very useful. I was perplexed in Italy, being used to the normal Trenitalia TVM's, to be confronted by a completely different layout and screen when in Como Lago Nord looking to get a local ticket to Milan.

I had a bit of a panic, but managed to work it out eventually, once I had watched a few locals using it!

 

[cjmillsnun]

True, but the OP was convinced they had a "Return", not a "Day Return".

They should've checked their ticket. It would've been printed very clearly.

Sadly it is a genuine mistake, however the OP's attitude to the PF probably will do them no favours.

 

[oversteer]

TVMs are for the most part pretty awful.
I struggled the other day to work out how to buy a 'peak travelcard' for travel today during the middle of the day... and i consider myself tech savvy. Ticket office closed, of course.

 

[falcon]

Excellent post, giving a very good summary of the "normal" situation guards face day in day out.

I agree perfect.I thought it was just me that used to get all that rubbish.

 

[Greenback]

TVMs are for the most part pretty awful.
I struggled the other day to work out how to buy a 'peak travelcard' for travel today during the middle of the day... and i consider myself tech savvy. Ticket office closed, of course.

I agree. I don't much like using them and I conside rmyself tech and ticket savvy! I am only comfortable when I am buying a straight forward ticket from A to B, and I already know the ticket I want and the fare I expect to pay. Even then I find the various layouts I encounter to be confusing, and it cna take some figuring out how to actually get to the ticket I wish to buy.

In contrast, when abroad I am usually more comfortable using the ticket machines. This is undoubtedly because the fare systems in other countries are far simpler than in the UK, so there is less of a bewildering array of options to be displayed.

 

[Hyphen]

I am surprised that ATOC didn't make sure we had one interface

One interface would be nice even for the same TOC - I bought a ticket from a TVM at Swansea yesterday and they'd changed the entire interface! Really confused me when I began typing "Nottingham" and it started randomly blanking out letters!

 

[jon0844]

Removing choices as you type is fine if the machine can be clever enough to know there might be variations, like King's Cross and London King's Cross. Should the user need to know exactly how the machine refers to a station?

And it's crazy when some systems show a Heathrow as a range of destinations (Heathrow Rail, Heathrow Airport and even individual terminals). As in the Thales app on my phone. Worse still, select any of these options and it comes back saying no fares found from Hatfield!
The TVM at Hatfield only has one version I believe but then shows loads of confusing tickets, where it isn't clear if it is valid via tube, Heathrow Connect or Heathrow Express - and that's before you have things like peak, off peak and wanting an open return.

 

[alanf]

Let me get this straight she should have known it was specificly for return on the same day as outward travel. And by the way you can return up to 04 29 the following day Well thats as clear as mud then. Surely if it's a 30 minute journey it should be valid till about 00 30 so you can join the train just before midnight.

 

[Deerfold]

Let me get this straight she should have known it was specificly for return on the same day as outward travel.

Did you mean that to be a statement or a question? Are you saying she should have known are asking how she was supposed to know?

And by the way you can return up to 04 29 the following day Well thats as clear as mud then. Surely if it's a 30 minute journey it should be valid till about 00 30 so you can join the train just before midnight.

Ticket validity until 0430 on the day after the expiry of the ticket is more generous than most people would expect without checking and ensures tickets are valid until the end of service on most lines - and almost matches validity on TfL tickets (on TfL the time is boarding time so you could still legitimately be on a night bus after 0530).

Having all tickets valid until 0430 seems easier than having different validities depending what journey you're planning.

 

[paul1609]

It's pretty easy to buy a simple return to London Terminals or a travelcard, but for other destinations it can confuse even the seasoned traveller.

What's more, if you're away from home and wanting a ticket and don't know the options or prices (to know if you're paying the right money) then seeing a range of anytime, off peak, super off peak and other tickets with restrictions will slow even the best of us down.

I think that a lot of problems could be solved by changing the design of the user interface and the text shown. Perhaps a simple summary for each ticket type in layman's terms, or some sort of colour coding. What's more, just having one layout for all machines in the UK - not different ones from different suppliers. Make each manufacturer have to work to the exact same spec.

You should try the machines at Ashford international on a weekend. I think there are 3 pages of tickets to London Terminals, Before the ticket office opens there will be whole hoards of people trying to find someone who knows how to use the machines.
I use the machine in the subway now because its almost impossible to get away from families once you've let on that you know whats what.