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some XC Voyager Questions...
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A quick calculation shows a fastest journey time by car on the A380/M5 is about 14 - 15 minutes, 17 miles at 70 mph, add on the time to get from the A380 from Newton Abbot and you are getting near to the journey time by train as the train can actually reach Exeter in about 18 minutes. If you were going to drive in Exeter then you'd lose any advantage due to the traffic. The journey planners most likely add on some time also for the road journey due to the possibility of congestion. The car and train journey times between Newton Abbot and Exeter are fairly close and this is not the reason why the trains from Plymouth are not very busy.
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A380 route is 12.2 miles from my old postcode to the m5 junction 30. I lived TQ12 3EH 12.2 miles at 70mph is around 10 1/2 mins. Baring in mind their at several speed cameras along the A380, so no opportunity to exceed speed limit. I lived near to the A380 so would be little traffic between my house and the A380, as it routed along a little used road towards the A380. There was rarely traffic jams on the A380 Exeter bound, unless using between Torquay and Penn inn roundabout, which is required for locals knowing the alternative route via Kingsteignton to the A380 avoiding all the traffic and cutting through an industrial estate and sticking at 70 was never an issue once on the A380.
The railway in Devon and Cornwall makes no sense if you want to get somewhere quickly and efficiently. There is at present no case to dispute this fact sadly.
A good example to use is from where i live now, Penryn, I live 100 yards from the station so no time used in getting into the station at this end. The timings of the train from Penryn to Exeter St Davids is for the quickest timings 2hrs 37 looking at a weekday timetable. The average journey time is 2hrs 54. To drive from Penryn into Exeter City Centre, is on a normal day a maximum of 2 hours. so pretty much an extra hour to go by train.
Mostly west of Exeter like it or not, the main line speeds is no more than those of a branch line. The main line is little more than a glorified branch line sadly. Until the railway is diverted to pretty much run parallel to the A38 Exeter to Plymouth, the train will never compete with journey times by car!
That is not correct, the route from Exeter to Newton Abbot is not just a glorified branch line at all, it has a 100 mph section, a 90 mph section and most of the rest is at least 75 mph, that's is not "no more" than a branch line. As I say you won't save much time going by car between Exeter and Newton Abbot.
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Also not correct, you will not beat the train by much from Newton Abbot to Central Exeter. Exeter itself can also get very congested and as I say you will lose any time saving. This part of the journey certainly does not have a significant time saving by car.
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Which is nowhere near Newton Abbot station so is unfair to compare it with the journey time from Newton Abbot to Exeter, where you join the A380 is also almost 3 miles close to Exeter than Newton Abbot station is. The journey time between Exeter and Newton Abbot by train and car is fairly close and there is certainly not a large enough difference to result in people abandoning the train on this route.
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1-2 milea away admittedly. Bearing in mind lack of parking at NTA station and congestion in NTA town centre, there is no comparable reason why anyone would drive to the station and not just drive to Exeter. As i said i lived there for 4 years. Clearly you have a lack of local knowledge.
Most of the population of Newton Abbot live closer to the A38/ A380 than the train station therefore including travel time to the station, it is a lot quicker to drive to Exeter. I could be in Exeter most days quicker than it would take to drive the 1-2 miles to the station, and find somewhere to park. let alone including the train travel time.
I know what I am talking about. Fact is that journey times are not significantly different to result in lots of people abandoning the train and indeed the trains are not as empty after Newton Abbot as they are at Plymouth. The differential in journey times between Exeter and Newton Abbot is not the reason for the lack of people using the train from Plymouth.
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Again not correct, unless you live the Milber side of Penn Inn or in Kingsteignton area then the station will close to the same distance if not closer than the A380 and always closer than the A38(T) which is about 3 miles to the north. It can also be very congested in Exeter. It should also be noted that some people on the edge of Exeter even drive to Tiverton Parkway to get the train as it can be quicker than driving into Central Exeter and getting the train from there.
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I do know what I am talking about, your journey is from Kingsteignton (closer to Exeter) and requiring you to head in the opposite direction to reach Newton Abbot station. For the same reasons some people on the edge of Exeter near the M5 would drive to Tiverton Parkway rather than Exeter St Davids. If you start adding in travel times to the station then you'd find you would end up with the car matching even Exeter to Taunton journey times for some people.
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yet again clearly not knowing the area, train services, road network, and appears to be just referring to a map. Kingsteignton is only across the "race course" from the station, Although 1.2 miles by road. a negligble amount.. The expresses arrive at xx51 in Exeter St Davids, which for starting work on the hour is completely unsuitable timings. A large majority of passengers will start work on the hour. It is not possible to get from St Davids to most places of work in the city centre in the 9 mins. all other services between these inappropriately timed expresses are timed from 30, 33, 34 and 37 mins travel time, which most certainly does not compete with driving from anywhere in NTA
I know the area and the road and rail network very well. The journey from Kingsteignton to Newton Abbot station itself would add on time as roads can often be busy and it still requires you to head in the wrong direction to get to the station. This has absolutely nothing to do with the railway itself. It is still a fact that the journey time to Exeter isn't that much different by train or by car and is any differential does not explain why people in Plymouth would not want to use the train.
You would use an express, not a stopping train. There is an arrival in Exeter at 08:21 leaving Newton Abbot at 08:03 an 18 minute journey. Even a train that takes 30 minutes is not bad when there is rush hour traffic to get through in Exeter. Yes I have actually been in Exeter at rush hour and have seen how busy it can get.
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The travel time to a station and parking facilities will have a lot to do with the railway. A majority of people will factor this into their journey plans. People are not going to travel to a station where they are likely to get stuck en route in traffic, and then struggle to park at the station. both of these key factors affect newton abbot considerably with such a good road network.
Barring the 803 the rest of the exprsses are scheduled to arrive too close to the hour for any other daytime hour apart from 9am.
Barring the 803 the rest of the exprsses are scheduled to arrive too close to the hour for any other daytime hour apart from 9am.
No, the time it takes to get to the station from where you live has nothing to do with the railway. If you live further from the station then your total journey time will be longer, not much the railway can do about that. Some people on the edge of Exeter drive to Tiverton Parkway to avoid the Exeter traffic, if they are close to the M5 then it won't take that long. If less people drove then the roads wouldn't be as congested. I doubt many people in Newton Abbot drive to Exeter St Davids to get a train to London when there is a train available from Newton Abbot as there would not be a significant time saving so this doesn't explain why trains are not busy from Plymouth.
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But the roads are how congested they are in places because the railways don't do enough to capture users from their cars onto rail. Perhaps they should employ you to get people from their cars to the train as you are pretty much sticking to your thoughts and opinion, very pro rail. If the railway put their side across as you have perhaps more people would use rail.
What more can the railways do though? They can get you from station to station quickly but they can't do much about how long it takes to get to the station. For commuters from Newton Abbot to Exeter even if the journey time by train was only ten minutes car would still be quicker due to the time it takes to get to and from the stations. For intercity journeys though 18 extra minutes on the train from Exeter to Newton Abbot is not bad and the trains from Newton Abbot are relatively well used, this does not though seem to be the case though from Plymouth.
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There isn't really a lot of point in arguing over journey times. Road journeys will be affected by numerous factors which usually aren't going to be predictable with any degree of accuracy. Time of day will have a lot to do with it, as an example the journey time from my house to my mother's house can vary between 24 minutes and 41 minutes depending on when we drive it and the weather conditions at the time. Sometimes it's slightly quicker going via the back roads sometimes not - that depends if you meet someone else on a single track section!
Most of all though, the time depends on where exactly you are going to and starting from! Asking someone who lives in Llanelli how long it will take them to drive into Swansea will get wildly different answers depending on where they live, and where in Swansea they want to get to!
Most of all though, the time depends on where exactly you are going to and starting from! Asking someone who lives in Llanelli how long it will take them to drive into Swansea will get wildly different answers depending on where they live, and where in Swansea they want to get to!
I travelled to Exeter today on the train and both times i did this the train was quite well used. However I stand by my point earlier in the thread that Plymouth - Exeter is slow, and the this hinders more use I think. I agree that from Newton Abbot it does improve vastly but all the damage is done until then. If for example I was going to Reading it is quicker/same time (depending on traffic) to drive as I would be at Exeter about 15 minutes before the train would. Yes the train does catch up but there is also cost involved on the train. Cheaper to drive (despite the fuel prices). If the train was quicker maybe the cost could be justified.
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