Smoking on the train.

[Wezz]

I've taken to lieing and telling smokers/vapers that it's a £60 fine if they're caught, most of them quickly put them away lol
I work for a TOC though, so my tactic wouldn't work for regular passengers.

 

[duffield]

Where's Charles Bronson or Denzel Washington, when you want them?

You really need Samuel L. Jackson ("Vapes on a Train")

 

[Aviator88]

The problem is, in this day and age of concealed knife crime, it's impossible to accurately 'assess the risk' prior to confrontation.

These things are best left to the police to deal with - they also have far more protection when it comes to any subsequent legal issues arising from the confrontation.

Report it - if they turn up, great. If they don't, they don't. In both instances, you'll be going home to your family safely.

 

[ExRes]

This thread has become a bit of a drag now, maybe it's time to stub it out

 

[jmh59]

You can try what they are suggesting in Hong Kong: '"When the members of the public see people smoking in non-smoking areas, even if no law enforcement officers can show up immediately, we can stare at the smokers."' (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-china-66206511)

 

[Krokodil]

You can try what they are suggesting in Hong Kong: '"When the members of the public see people smoking in non-smoking areas, even if no law enforcement officers can show up immediately, we can stare at the smokers."' (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-china-66206511)

"What are you looking at?"

In a menacing voice

 

[sleepinghobby]

It's not something you can control so I would suggest not spending any further effort into worrying about it. You will just end up getting hurt. I am pretty confident in saying the smoke detectors in 700s were altered to be less sensitive due to frequently being triggered by people vaping - I just hope they still work in good time when there is a genuine emergency.

 

[AverageJoe]

Life's a lot easier when you just decide some things don't bother you so much. Yes, smoking on a train is not nice at all. But so what? I'm not going to rat a smoker out to the police.

Rat a smoker?

What is this some kind of childish prison code?

For one it’s prohibited and as a non smoker I don’t want to have to deal with that when I shouldn’t.
I’m pretty sure the person could wait. They just don’t care about anyone other than themselves, so why should I care that they feel ‘ratted on’

Secondly if that was on a train I drive it would likely set of the smoke alarm. That would mean the train is brought to a stand, conversations would have to happen with the guard and signaller then according to company rules the fire alarm would have to be isolated. So that means if it happened in a toilet the toilet would be locked out of use or if it was in a carriage the carriage would be locked out of use, meaning all the passengers would have to squeeze in to the remaining carriages.

This would obviously all take time and mean a decent delay.

Is it worth it? Nope!

 

[AlterEgo]

Rat a smoker?

What is this some kind of childish prison code?

For one it’s prohibited and as a non smoker I don’t want to have to deal with that when I shouldn’t.
I’m pretty sure the person could wait. They just don’t care about anyone other than themselves, so why should I care that they feel ‘ratted on’

Well you shouldn't care about their feelings, it's just in my experience not worth the hassle. There was a thread on Twitter yesterday (now deleted) of someone who challenged someone else who was playing their music out loud. This escalated the situation from just annoying music to a full blown shouting match and then an irate, selfish man bellowing on his own at the carriage.

That's why I don't get involved. That person's intervention made the situation worse for everyone, and they were polite about it too.

In my experience almost nobody ever challenges this sort of behaviour although it seems all the people who do are in this thread!

 

[AverageJoe]

Well you shouldn't care about their feelings, it's just in my experience not worth the hassle. There was a thread on Twitter yesterday (now deleted) of someone who challenged someone else who was playing their music out loud. This escalated the situation from just annoying music to a full blown shouting match and then an irate, selfish man bellowing on his own at the carriage.

That's why I don't get involved. That person's intervention made the situation worse for everyone, and they were polite about it too.

In my experience almost nobody ever challenges this sort of behaviour although it seems all the people who do are in this thread!

Well I understand that you or I wouldn’t want to get in to a situation that could escalate.

But that’s what the police are for. So I wouldn’t feel bad about reporting them at all.

As a member of staff I would challenge them in a calm manner and explain their options, or the police will be called.

 

[Krokodil]

it's just in my experience not worth the hassle

Two minutes to compose a text, 10p to send it. What hassle?

 

[Wolfie]

You aren't remotely concerned about that, you "ratted" a smoker (your words) to the police because you "don't want to sit or stand on a train with that".


The most British thing is making it a crime and people thinking they should call the police.

I absolutely would call the police. I violently object to having my lungs damaged by some vile little scrote.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 15 Jul 2023 ==

It's not about being one of the lads, it's that I wouldn't waste my energy and time on such a minor issue. I would just walk away and not let it bother me; smoking is only confrontational when you decide to confront someone about it. We can leave it to the real heroes - people who text 61016; the true glue of society.

There is lots of evidence that ignoring the little things only leads to worse things happening.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 15 Jul 2023 ==

I'd text 61016. BTP might be too stretched to deal with it, but that's their call to make.

The example of somebody smoking in a shelter, I'm probably not that bothered about. If it was chucking it down and the shelter was the only dry place to stand I might ask them to stop. I'm generally not too concerned about the no smoking on platforms rule though; as long as it's an open or semi-open space. While I don't personally smoke on the regular, I'd be in favour of something like SBB's approach which is to ban it in enclosed spaces, but on an open platform or under a shelter, fair game. Last I looked at the research, while outdoor second-hand smoke is still harmful, it's just nowhere near the same scale; and smoking outdoors is generally permitted.

Balanced and l would agree.

 

[Aviator88]

In my experience almost nobody ever challenges this sort of behaviour although it seems all the people who do are in this thread!

When given the shroud of anonymity, people often express themselves as what they like to think of themselves as, or what they wish they were.

 

[AverageJoe]

When given the shroud of anonymity, people often express themselves as what they like to think of themselves as, or what they wish they were.

Or given the fact most of this forum is full of rail staff who’s job it is to challenge that sort of behaviour… maybe it would happen.

 

[E27007]

I believe the 2007 anti-smoking acts discouraged smokers by making it inconvenient to smoke especially at work, giving a strong incentive to give up, to it has worked in that sense, possibly the most succesful challenge to "big-tobacco" after decades of action by parliament, I know several ex-smokers in my workplace, few seem to regress back to smoking, some kept logs of the money they had saved by giving up, many thousands of pounds per annum for some individuals funding better cars /expensive golf clubs / holidays etc.

 

[Killingworth]

About a fortnight ago the fire alarm sounded in a Northern westbound 195 service in Totley Tunnel- 3.5 miles long. The driver carried on to Grindleford where all passengers were evacuated and the train checked. No fire found but one passenger was vaping on the platform. It seems it was established that he'd been the cause of the alarm, was told to cut it out and the train proceeded.

The thought of a fire in a tunnel, or just the sound of the alarm, is quite frightening. The sensors may be too sensitive, but how can they tell the difference between many potential sources of smoke?

 

[AverageJoe]

About a fortnight ago the fire alarm sounded in a Northern westbound 195 service in Totley Tunnel- 3.5 miles long. The driver carried on to Grindleford where all passengers were evacuated and the train checked. No fire found but one passenger was vaping on the platform. It seems it was established that he'd been the cause of the alarm, was told to cut it out and the train proceeded.

The thought of a fire in a tunnel, or just the sound of the alarm, is quite frightening. The sensors may be too sensitive, but how can they tell the difference between many potential sources of smoke?

They don’t need to tell the difference
since smoking isn’t allowed.

What I would like to see happen is the person caught smoking is fined or banned.

If they can’t go a few hours without smoking then drive or walk. Others shouldn’t have to pay for someone else’s addiction.

 

[Mugby]

This thread has become a bit of a drag now, maybe it's time to stub it out

Very well put! Couldn't agree more!

 

[reduke]

Had a 15 minute delay on Thameslink the other week when some idiot managed to set off the fire alarm with his vape cloud at 100mph on the ECML fast, moaned to his mate on the phone about being delayed, and then hid the device just before the driver had finished walking the 12 carriages back to check if anyone had been smoking.

Missing my once an hour bus was most pleasing.

 

[MarkWi72]

It’s a shame the 310s aren’t still around. The ‘open and shut ‘case would suffice.

 

[Russel]

On a busy XC service from Newcastle to Birmingham in October, it filled with football fans at York following disruption, there was the usual high levels of alcohol consumption and rivalry between fans but overall a good atmosphere.

A few did vape which would normally annoy me, but given how much worse the journey could have been, it was hardly the end of the world, I was even given a bottle of beer...

 

[Watershed]

I feel like this is going round in circles, but I don't think it is illegal. It is prohibited by the railway companies (in this case Network Rail), but they could choose to assign any outdoor area as a smoking area, be it within the station footprint or not.

It's one of those strange situations where it's illegal, but only if there is a notice saying it's prohibited. Such notices are displayed at almost all stations, but no doubt there are a few that have slipped through the cracks.

The other ambiguity is that the ban only applies "on any part of the railway on or near which there is a notice indicating that smoking is not allowed". So if there's a "no smoking" sign at the entrance to the station, but nowhere else, then arguably the end of the platform is not subject to that notice and the ban. Hence the importance of havign "no smoking" signs at regular intervals along platforms - it's also rather amusing being able to point them out when people smoke in plain view of them!

 

[Joey Beauchamp]

It's one of those strange situations where it's illegal, but only if there is a notice saying it's prohibited. Such notices are displayed at almost all stations, but no doubt there are a few that have slipped through the cracks.

The other ambiguity is that the ban only applies "on any part of the railway on or near which there is a notice indicating that smoking is not allowed". So if there's a "no smoking" sign at the entrance to the station, but nowhere else, then arguably the end of the platform is not subject to that notice and the ban. Hence the importance of havign "no smoking" signs at regular intervals along platforms - it's also rather amusing being able to point them out when people smoke in plain view of them!

That's really interesting because at many smaller stations there is a notice near the gate stating "smoking is prohibited in these premises" or similar. I would argue that the use of "in" rather than "on" leaves it somewhat open to interpretation as to whether it might be allowed on the platform (it obviously isn't in the shelter.

Of course I know that smoking is banned anywhere inside the station footprint. But I also think it's a completely different level of behaviour to smoke on a sparsely populated or empty platform compared to a similarly uncrowded train, especially now windows can't even be opened.

 

[Wivenswold]

There have been two occasions since 2007 when drivers have said they'll open the doors at a platform if anyone wants to stretch their legs or have a sneaky smoke. Both times the line was blocked, it was at small unmanned rural stations and on one occasion it was during a blizzard, so may have been in jest.

As a smoker I find it no problem to not smoke for a planned journey but it can get a little tricky if you get delayed for a few hours between stops. I carry a very discrete vape pen that's set to not give off any vapor, just in case, though I've only used it once and I don't commute anymore. I should really quit though, terrible habit, wouldn't recommend it.