Smart cards - loading tickets from app

[planetf1]

I have an ITSO smartcard from Thameslink (the key) (actually I have 3 others, never used from southwest trains, SWR & bluestar/goahead)

In their app it seems I can directly load season tickets to the smart card, and read what tickets are present, but cannot load daily tickets.
I can of course load a ticket at a station, perhaps buy in-app and load at station

I want to do a journey portslade-brighton & brighton-london (thameslink) zones 1-6 for which there are smartcard fares on brfares.com

On the national rail site it suggests I can buy a smart ticket from any retailer, but it doesn't refer to apps.

Can I buy a smart ticket from another ROC and directly load to the smartcard?
For example c2c and swr both sell 'daily' tickets in-app for direct loading on iOS.

I've also read that tickets can be directly loaded at the gate, given 2 hours notice. Is this relatively reliable? I presume it won't work on buses supporting thekey as first-journey (if a plusbus ticket is found)? But if I'm departing from a station I just use the smartcard as normal (presumably having somehow linked the smartcard when purchasing a ticket)

I've previously tried various ticketing options but
- 'keygo' (payg) is limited in a) no travel outside thameslink/southern/northern b) no london travelcardzone c) no split tickets - check out/in registers as a break in journey only up to a few hours (even though a pro is they support bus) . a prevented me from using last week (reading). b&c this weekend!
- etickets (when you can buy them!) don't support travelcard zone travel
- paper tickets - I lose. just me. Also in the plusBus at origin case it requires an advance trip

 

[Wallsendmag]

ISAM based collection devices need up to 2 hours, there is another collection method that some TVMs, handheld TIS and Worldline Mtis use which can deliver the ticket in much less than two hours, more like10-15 minutes. I don't think you'll be able to add a third party card to the app.

 

[CyrusWuff]

There's also a National Rail Smartcard Manager app for Android and iOS which you can use to view what's on your card, download any tickets that are queued and activate a day's travel on a Flexi-Season.

It doesn't matter what TOC's Smartcard you've got and doesn't require a login, which also makes it handy for TOC staff to assist with problem resolution.

 

[planetf1]

There's also a National Rail Smartcard Manager app for Android and iOS which you can use to view what's on your card, download any tickets that are queued and activate a day's travel on a Flexi-Season.

It doesn't matter what TOC's Smartcard you've got and doesn't require a login, which also makes it handy for TOC staff to assist with problem resolution.

Thanks, that's really helpful to know.

I downloaded, and it indeed shows my keygo subscription, but the text refers to seasons and flexi-seasons.
Will this app also load other ticket types (like off peak returns) ?

 

[[.n]]

There's also a National Rail Smartcard Manager app for Android and iOS which you can use to view what's on your card, download any tickets that are queued and activate a day's travel on a Flexi-Season.

It doesn't matter what TOC's Smartcard you've got and doesn't require a login, which also makes it handy for TOC staff to assist with problem resolution.

I'll give that a go - I wonder if @Wallsendmag was talking about a better staff based version in reply to my query elsewhere. Its certainly a step towards better integration

 

[planetf1]

I wasn't able to find anywhere that would sell me smart tickets online for theBrighton-London TravelCard-1-6 Thameslink journey, or indeed other journeys between Brighton and London. This was despite brfares showing some 'smart' tickets as available. For example the brighton-london travelcard journey on brfares shows:

SMART WRE 0BX​	Route THAMESLINK ONLY​	Validity ON DATE SHOWN Restrictions FB SUPER OFF-PEAK FOR TL&GN​	Adult NSE £11.65​	Child CHNSE £3.35​	​
​ ​ Outward & Return:​ VALID SATURDAY, SUNDAY AND BANK HOLIDAYS.​ Valid for unlimited travel in London Zones 1–6​ Fare Setter: THAMESLINK AND GT NORTHERN TL​

I assume that is a smart fare? I tried c2c (but I don't have one of their cards) , thameslink & southern western railway (I do have a card)


So I decided to abandon the smart card and visit a ticket machine at an unmanned station and figure out what was possible there. (no smart loading ).

It turned out it seems not to support PlusBus at all. I also couldn't figure out how to select all of
- Depart from another station - I could do this, but only for same day
- Travel another day (I could do this, but only from same station)
- Travelcard fares - I couldn't seem to do this with either of the above
- and as mentioned neither smart card loading, or plusbus (paper ticket) was an option

I called the helpdesk, who I don't think knew much about the machines at all.. but given the plusbus limitation was clear it was pointless trying any further.

Getting to a staffed station is generally a pain - parking etc, which is why I was hoping for online smart loading

Sigh. I do seem to struggle buying tickets. We have lots of pieces of the picture, but it absolutely is not all joined up.

I've decided to abandon the 2 ukp saving and just get a ticket in the morning, and pay full bus fare. I could have ordered the ticket online for collection, but don't have a spare 2 hours now (time to cook a nice meal + wine!). The equivalent ticket to above is easy to buy at the main brighton station on paper (and perhaps smartcard) ... I need paper or smartcard in order to get the travelcard especially as we'll be right out to zone 5.... The ticket is actually superb value, so even with this approach it's great.. just a shame the tech can't quite come together.

 

[johncrossley]

I don't think this ticket is even available from the ticket machine as a smartcard. Have a look at the machine in the morning. I had a look at one of the Brighton Line stations a few weeks ago (I can't remember which) and it wouldn't sell the Super Off Peak Thameslink Only Travelcard (i.e. the weekend special offer) as a smartcard, but it would as a paper ticket. It was able to sell the weekday version as both a smartcard and a paper ticket.

I don't think it is possible to load any GTR ticket onto a smartcard using an app unless it goes outside the GTR area. For example Brighton to Woking single/return can be added using an app. I've added a Travelcard from Woking before. So GTR are the problem here.

KeyGo will give you discounted bus travel in Brighton if use KeyGo from Brighton station that day, but unfortunately this doesn't give you a Travelcard.

 

[Wallsendmag]

GTR have a separate set of ticket types for Smart Tickets, very strange way of doing things.

 

[planetf1]

I wasn't able to find anywhere that would sell me smart tickets online for the Portslade-Brighton + Brighton-London TravelCard-1-6 Thameslink journey, or indeed other journeys between Brighton and London. This was despite brfares showing some 'smart' tickets as available (at least they are called

 

[johncrossley]

I wasn't able to find anywhere that would sell me smart tickets online for the Portslade-Brighton + Brighton-London TravelCard-1-6 Thameslink journey, or indeed other journeys between Brighton and London. This was despite brfares showing some 'smart' tickets as available (at least they are called

GTR stopped offering smartcard tickets online except for season tickets, even though Southern were probably the first TOC to offer them. Single and return smartcard tickets are only available from the machine, but not Super Off Peak. They want people to use KeyGo, but that is no good for people who want something like a Day Travelcard.

 

[planetf1]

So I did this journey last Sunday.

I decided to visit a TVM at an unmanned station (day before travel, not my origin station). I realised this probably wouldn't do ITSO cards, but not only that, I also could not get even a paper ticket with a combination of
- A different day travel
- Travel from a different station
- Travelcard zone 1-6
- plusbus
- (ideally remember I would have wanted itso)

I contacted the helpdesk (help point/info) who were polite but didn't seem to really know the machines. They did tell me I couldn't get plusbus which kind of put an end to the idea anyway

I decided not to travel to a manned station (getting late, traffic, tired) and just paid for regular bus fare the next day. A minor 2 ukp hit

At Brighton mainline I visited the TVM. Whilst the regular tvm would sell me a paper thameslink 1-6 ticket (just what I wanted) for 11.65, the itso TVM would only offer a 'Smart Off Peak Day Travelcard, Thameslink Only, Zones 1-6' for 26 *before railcard*. At that point I just went paper as it wouldn't even sell me the right price ticket on itso.



So what can I conclude - other than getting a bit obsessed about this whole process.

Basically that uk ticketing remains full of anomolies, there's lots of variation between companies, and though there's some great ideas (PAYG - thameslink) the process just doesn't all hang together

So on my recent journeys failures include
- inability to get etickets from most suppliers despite knowing they are offered on various routes
- no easy way to get a plusbus ticket without visiting a manned ticket office (other than PAYG)
- PAYG not doing optimum pricing (journey split - even with explicit check in/out, and I don't think thameslink-only pricing either)
- PAYG not supporting tube/bus in london
- no etickets for tube/bus (or local bus/plusbus)
- no PAYG for venturing into another TOC area
- Incorrect pricing & lack of availability for ITSO tickets
- No app-based ticket loading for ITSO (in my area)

My ideal would be to complete PAYG, especially to include London tube/bus, but also to address journey split/toc specific ticket discounts

Second best would be to mandate ALL tickets are available on ITSO, *AND* loadable from mobile (including plusbus) - that is close to perfect

Sigh....