Slip coaches

[Falcon1200]

There were also complications when slip coaches were detached at stations with non-platformed through lines! IIRC when Up trains slipped at Reading they were routed via the Platform 5 loop, whereas the last slipping train on BR, in the Down direction at Bicester North, had to run via the through line as the express overtook a stopper there, the loco from the stopper retrieving the slip coach.

 

[Rescars]

According to an interesting article on the Woodford-cum-Membris parish website it led to the ending of slip coach working on the GC main line, they state that the LNER retained one slip coach but don't mention where.

I remember reading years ago that in the early days of the GC London Extension that the Great Central Railway slipped a coach from a down express at Leicester Central, I expect that would have been an early recognition of the fact that they weren't attracting passenger numbers they'd hoped for from the Midland, just one coach for Leicester passengers. I'm sure it would have been an interesting thing to see.

Wikipedia informs that there were slips on from the 6.20pm ex Marylebone at Woodford and Finmere for the benefit of several bigwigs who lived locally, including a GC/LNER director. This all stopped after the Woodford accident, but whilst it lasted, civilised commuting indeed! Almost on a par with the evening Pullmans running on the Met for the benefit of the near neighbours. One-upmanship as played in the Chilterns!!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 14 Mar 2026 ==

In another thread recently about a 1955 Royal Train, @Andy873 mentions Accrington. Reputedly the combination of Baxenden bank, the speed limit through the station, problems with sighting and the need to preserve vacuum made the L&Y's Accrington slip the trickiest (demanding the most skill) on the network.

 

[Gloster]

Wikipedia's page, linked post 18, contains a rather interesting photo of two Great Western bogie mail vans, slipped from the rear of an express.
I've yet to find a Dean or Churchward "slip" sorting van (as the stowage van is seemingly rear), so I wonder how the slip was executed.

I did a lot of searching but couldn’t find anything either, so out of curiosity I posted on a forum that would know. The reply from one of the real experts is that this was probably a genuine slip using PO Sorting Slip coach 837, a seemingly unique vehicle built to Diagram M8 in 1905.

The second coach would have been a normal sorting or stowage van. Only the leading vehicle of a slip portion needed to be a specially equipped one: the very last slip at Bicester was of three coaches, one of them a former LNER vehicle. Of course, the more vehicles with standard brakes there were, the more difficult the slip guard’s job was.

 

[Sun Chariot]

Great sleuthing @Gloster !

 

[Merle Haggard]

snip

I remember reading years ago that in the early days of the GC London Extension that the Great Central Railway slipped a coach from a down express at Leicester Central, I expect that would have been an early recognition of the fact that they weren't attracting passenger numbers they'd hoped for from the Midland, just one coach for Leicester passengers. I'm sure it would have been an interesting thing to see.

Have a look, on Railways Archive, of the accident report into the 23rd December 1904 mishap at Aylesbury. It was an overnight express train, (02.45 from Marylebone) with, unfortunately, fatalities but it gives an idea of the level passenger loadings. Fare paying passengers almost outnumbered by staff (it had a manned buffet car)

 

[45Fox]

Have a look, on Railways Archive, of the accident report into the 23rd December 1904 mishap at Aylesbury. It was an overnight express train, (02.45 from Marylebone) with, unfortunately, fatalities but it gives an idea of the level passenger loadings. Fare paying passengers almost outnumbered by staff (it had a manned buffet car)

Thanks for that Merle, I've had a read of it. From the report it seems that there were no fare paying passengers on the train, only railway staff.
I remember reading that on the first day of passenger services on the GCR London Extension in 1899 the first expresses from Marylebone only had a handful of passengers on, a portent of things to come? It's probably safe to say that the GC came into It's own with freight, cross-country and local passenger services, the expresses to the Midlands and the North couldn't really compete with the already established services provided by the Midland and LNWR.

The Railways Archive is a great resource, I use it quite a lot.

 

[Gloster]

Great sleuthing @Gloster !

It wasn’t me: all I did was post a question elsewhere. It was one of the real experts who answered it.

 

[Merle Haggard]

I did a lot of searching but couldn’t find anything either, so out of curiosity I posted on a forum that would know. The reply from one of the real experts is that this was probably a genuine slip using PO Sorting Slip coach 837, a seemingly unique vehicle built to Diagram M8 in 1905.

The second coach would have been a normal sorting or stowage van. Only the leading vehicle of a slip portion needed to be a specially equipped one: the very last slip at Bicester was of three coaches, one of them a former LNER vehicle. Of course, the more vehicles with standard brakes there were, the more difficult the slip guard’s job was.

I may have posted this before apologies if it's 'old hat', but told to me by someone who was there.
There were so many people on the platform at Paddington intending to travel to Bicester on this last trip that the station staff decided that the best action was a Special Stop Order, causing panic In the event, persuaded otherwise.

 

[Sun Chariot]

It wasn’t me: all I did was post a question elsewhere. It was one of the real experts who answered it.

Ah but you knew of a source that I did not.

 

[Smod]

Something about a proposed reintroduction of slip coaches might make a good April Fool joke.

 

[edwin_m]

In 1987 I joined what was known as a slip and brake test. This was to test the brake performance of a new wagon design by slipping it at various speeds on the Down Slow north of Crewe. Backing up to re-couple allowed the stopping distance to be measured by measuring the distance travelled forward and subtracting that when setting back. It was achieved by the unusual method of having both vacuum and air brakes active in the same train - vacuum for the test coach and air for the wagon under test.

 

[WesternLancer]

This thread prompts me to ask if any slip coaches survived to be preserved and can be seen today? Albeit if not seen in action.

 

[Sun Chariot]

This thread prompts me to ask if any slip coaches survived to be preserved and can be seen today? Albeit if not seen in action.

The only example I find listed is the coach body from GWR No. 7091, a dia F12 of 1898, a Tricomposite clerestory slip.

More recently as a holiday 'let' at St. Germans in Cornwall.

 

[WesternLancer]

The only example I find listed is the coach body from GWR No. 7091, a dia F12 of 1898, a Tricomposite clerestory slip.

More recently as a holiday 'let' at St. Germans in Cornwall.

Thanks. When you think about it that’s a rather a shame, and a preservation omission.

Presumably all the vehicles disappeared or had equipment removed before it was considered possible.
Shame that the old Clapham transport museum didn’t obtain one for example.

Interesting to read if the St German s example however.

 

[Sun Chariot]

Thanks. When you think about it that’s a rather a shame, and a preservation omission.

Presumably all the vehicles disappeared or had equipment removed before it was considered possible.
Shame that the old Clapham transport museum didn’t obtain one for example.

I was surprised that the Hawksworth Brake Composite Slip, featured in post 3's video, was not secured for preservation.
My guess is that the "carriage focus" of the time, was solely carriages of older vintage

 

[Merle Haggard]

Something about a proposed reintroduction of slip coaches might make a good April Fool joke.

Not that, but the reverse of the slip coach principle was seriously (it seemed) proposed at the height of rail privatisation mania.
The idea was to speed up long distance trains by cutting out all intermediate stops. To compensate, another train would start from the omitted intermediate station and accelerate until it was alongside the express, and passengers would cross between the fast and collector train.
There were people on R4 Today discussing it seriously...
There are some obvious problems not least on lines (MML, WCML) where lines are paired by use. Quite a leap, and watch out for the approaching train with a relative speed of 250 mph.
But that seemed to indicate the intellectual level of the debate

 

[Falcon1200]

There were people on R4 Today discussing it seriously...

I doubt anyone discussing it seriously was in any way a rail professional, or actually knew anything about railways, at all!

 

[AndrewE]

I doubt anyone discussing it seriously was in any way a rail professional, or actually knew anything about railways, at all!

Exactly like the rest of the enthusiasts for privatisation then...

 

[172007]

Slip trains could work.

Certanly if HS2 ever had the proposed Y shaped network and capacity became an issue. With the concrete track base which is being built and in cab signalling there is no reason why a rear train cannot be linked to the front via the signaling system and uncoupled to take a seperate route. Say the first continues at 200mph to by-pass Birmingham and the rear slows for the NEC station then Curzon street. If the front unit brakes for wjatever reason the rear unit automaticaly mirrors.

Two trains out of London using 1 path.

Pottentialy i guess the ECML could use this for Leeds and Newcastle trains. Would need concrete slab track where they uncouple and the latest as yet not inbented incab signalling.

 

[AndrewE]

Slip trains could work.

Certanly if HS2 ever had the proposed Y shaped network and capacity became an issue. With the concrete track base which is being built and in cab signalling there is no reason why a rear train cannot be linked to the front via the signaling system and uncoupled to take a seperate route. Say the first continues at 200mph to by-pass Birmingham and the rear slows for the NEC station then Curzon street. If the front unit brakes for wjatever reason the rear unit automaticaly mirrors.

Two trains out of London using 1 path.

Pottentialy i guess the ECML could use this for Leeds and Newcastle trains. Would need concrete slab track where they uncouple and the latest as yet not inbented incab signalling.

what has concrete slab track got to do with it?

 

[Sun Chariot]

what has concrete slab track got to do with it?

When smooth concrete's wet, it's easier to slip...

 

[Rescars]

Not that, but the reverse of the slip coach principle was seriously (it seemed) proposed at the height of rail privatisation mania.

Not such a new idea perhaps. The London and Blackwall managed both slipping and reconnecting (sort of) with their cable system back in the 1840s!

 

[Pigeon]

The pils coach by Pigeon Rail Systems is described here: http://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/slip-coaches-slipping-distant-signals.225616/post-5521918

 

[172007]

what has concrete slab track got to do with it?

Uncoupling reliably even when stationary really requires straight and level track which ordinary ballast can't do, certanly at speed.

 

[Sun Chariot]

Uncoupling reliably even when stationary really requires straight and level track which ordinary ballast can't do, certanly at speed.

I'm really confused at your statements here and in post 49. I take it you are conversant with the mechanics of former slip-working / you watched the 1960 video embedded in post 3?

 

[edwin_m]

Ordinary ballast, if properly maintained, can provide the sort of accurate geometry needed for high speed operation, as witnessed by most of the world's high speed routes that use it. This would certainly also be compatible with the use of autocouplers, which require much less precise geometry. Slab track is used on high speed routes to reduce maintenance when the track is heavily used.

 

[Sun Chariot]

Ordinary ballast, if properly maintained, can provide the sort of accurate geometry needed for high speed operation, as witnessed by most of the world's high speed routes that use it. This would certainly also be compatible with the use of autocouplers, which require much less precise geometry. Slab track is used on high speed routes to reduce maintenance when the track is heavily used.

Thanks - perfectly echoes my understanding.

 

[172007]

I'm really confused at your statements here and in post 49. I take it you are conversant with the mechanics of former slip-working / you watched the 1960 video embedded in post 3?

Yes i am.

Although it's a history and nostalgia thread it seemed interesting to see the slip coach concept with a modern take and post #46 did kick it off.

The modern take can now be flipped around and now:

Did the group companies or BR with multiple units ever consider slipping whole trains i.e. loco 5 coaches loco 5 coaches to use 1 path out of a busy area for 2 completely different seperate destinations?

 

[Sun Chariot]

The modern take can now be flipped around and now:

Did the group companies or BR with multiple units ever consider slipping whole trains i.e. loco 5 coaches loco 5 coaches to use 1 path out of a busy area for 2 completely different seperate destinations?

In reverse order:

...to use 1 path out of a busy area for 2 completely different seperate destinations

Splitting (and - at the country end - joining) is regularly still done; such as Southern TOC services which split along East Sussex for differing final locations.
DItto Inverness to Far North services, Georgemas Junction had for years been the split for Wick and Thurso.
Ditto Carstairs in my rail-travel "peak years" (1980s and early 1990s) where Edinburgh / Glasgow bound Intercity services split (and southbounds joined, to create a single southward WCML path).

Did the group companies or BR with multiple units ever consider slipping whole trains i.e. loco 5 coaches loco 5 coaches

By definition, a slipped portion is in-motion, non-driving and unpowered; else it becomes a split portion.
The most intensely-worked paths I can think of, were LNER's Jazz Trains into and out of London Liverpool Street. Those paths achieved turnaounds which utterly trump dwell-times we are used to!
However, even those peak-hours services were pathed (2-3 minutes apart) without the operatonal need (and headache) of slips.

 

[Rescars]

In reverse order:

Splitting (and - at the country end - joining) is regularly still done; such as Southern TOC services which split along East Sussex for differing final locations.
DItto Inverness to Far North services, Georgemas Junction has for years been the split for Wick and Thurso.
Ditto Carstairs in my rail-travel "peak years" (1980s and early 1990s) where Edinburgh / Glasgow bound Intercity services split (and southbounds joined, to create a single southward WCML path).


By definition, a slipped portion is in-motion, non-driving and unpowered; else it becomes a split portion.
The most intensely-worked paths I can think of, were LNER's Jazz Trains into and out of London Liverpool Street. Those paths achieved turnaounds which utterly trump dwell-times we are used to!
However, even those peak-hours services were pathed (2-3 minutes apart) without the operatonal need (and headache) of slips.

Splitting still takes place even within the London travel zones. The majority of Caterham and Tattenham Corner services from and to London Bridge split or join at Purley.